Basho Talk Natsu 2018 (SPOILERS)

[Yatagarasu 352]

7 minutes ago, Pandaazuma said:

Hokutofuji bout.  Sumo and concussion. That was not pleasant to watch at all.

At first I thought maybe he'd got winded, but the replay showed bad head contact.  And the way he just crumpled later...looks like concussion.  Poor guy.  I really hope he's ok.  

[autotroph 43]

11 minutes ago, Pandaazuma said:

Hokutofuji bout.  Sumo and concussion. That was not pleasant to watch at all.

Yeah, it was not good at all. I said to myself "they should stop it", then remembered this is sumo and that would never happen...

I wonder if he collapsed/vomited in the corridor - it looked that way.

[Jyuunomori 226]

Tochinoshin just went casual 10-0.

He will clearly get 11 wins now. I can't see him losing 5 in a row.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Jyuunomori

[Hakuyobaku 33]

34, ozeki in the bag

[Yatagarasu 352]

Asanoyama was unfortunate.  That was very much his bout, but the right call in the end.  

Chiyonokuni still going strong, though the bout itself was not his finest moment.  The first sidestep was beautiful with the intended surprise, but he didn't follow it through with an effective enough attack.  The second was less of a surprise, obviously.  Had he tried a third sidestep (which he seemed to be bracing for), Nishikigi would have potted him.  

Ishiura's bout was very odd.  It's like he just gave up in the end.  The commentator summed it up well 'Ishiura wa genki arimasen'.  

Tochinoshin has not only got his ten wins but remains undefeated.  At the risk of being shot down, the sumo's...a bit samey though.  

Kakuryu.  Beautifully executed but, against Geek, rude.  

Endou visibly not operating at 100% but I was impressed that he gave Hakuhou a good run for his money.  Hope he didn't wreck his arm further.  

It never ceases to astonish me how ill-equipped they seem to be concerning ringside/easily accessible medics.  Hokutofuji barely made it down the hanamichi before basically collapsing in the corridor.  When the camera flashed back to him a short while later no visible medics were in attendance, only his tsukebito.  Instead of being given a wheelchair he was helped back up to his feet and he gambarised walked to wherever he was going - hopefully the doctor's room!  Hope for his sake it's not serious, but that he sits the rest of the basho out. 

Quite a few runners in jonidan all at 5-0, including both Hoshoryu and Naya who are both living up to their pedigree so far.  The torikumi for the next couple will be interesting.  

Edited May 22, 2018 by Yatagarasu
Edit - rewatched bout and removed inaccurate comment

[Eikokurai 3,437]

My manager pulled me away from my desk mid-sumo so I missed a number of bouts. Came back just in time to see Tochinoshin and had to explain to my manager about his ozeki run. My other boss would not have been so accommodating of my slacking off. Haha.

Easy win for Tochinoshin today. Ozeki promotion more or less assured now. One more win to put it beyond doubt but I think he’s done enough personally.

[Jakusotsu 5,869]

3 hours ago, Pandaazuma said:

Hokutofuji bout.  Sumo and concussion. That was not pleasant to watch at all.

And I'm still puzzled why Fujishima called a matta. That tachiai looked more legit than most.

[Gernobono 463]

can't remember seeing 2 consecutive sashi chigae ......if 1 is no longer a reason for seppuku, 2 must be for sure 

[Morty 1,483]

4 hours ago, Pandaazuma said:

Hokutofuji bout.  Sumo and concussion. That was not pleasant to watch at all.

Agreed. Particularly the aftermath in the tunnel

[Benihana 1,910]

Yes, watching Hokutofuji wasn't nice. He probably should think about his style, because he's know to get head in first. But sumo...

I admire Kotoshogiku for not going postal and my disliking for Kakuryu gets up a notch. You could hear the audience being not amused.

[Kintamayama 44,639]

There was a real chance of a first itamiwake (tie) in 60 years today in the Ryuuden-Hokutofuji bout.. Both Fujishima head judge and Gyoji Kimura Hisanosuke asked Hokutofuji if he could continue and he answered in the affirmative. If he would have said he couldn't, it would have been declared a tie, since no bout actually took place.

[Tsubame 359]

5 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

There was a real chance of a first itamiwake (tie) in 60 years today in the Ryuuden-Hokutofuji bout.. Both Fujishima head judge and Gyoji Kimura Hisanosuke asked Hokutofuji if he could continue and he answered in the affirmative. If he would have said he couldn't, it would have been declared a tie, since no bout actually took place.

That were exactly my thoughs during the bout. If he just couldn't get up and be ready for the second tachi-ai, that have to be a draw.

[Rocks 1,807]

8 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

There was a real chance of a first itamiwake (tie) in 60 years today in the Ryuuden-Hokutofuji bout.. Both Fujishima head judge and Gyoji Kimura Hisanosuke asked Hokutofuji if he could continue and he answered in the affirmative. If he would have said he couldn't, it would have been declared a tie, since no bout actually took place.

Which is what should have happened. The guy was clearly in no condition to continue. Shameful.

[Eikokurai 3,437]

24 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

There was a real chance of a first itamiwake (tie) in 60 years today in the Ryuuden-Hokutofuji bout.. Both Fujishima head judge and Gyoji Kimura Hisanosuke asked Hokutofuji if he could continue and he answered in the affirmative. If he would have said he couldn't, it would have been declared a tie, since no bout actually took place.

I wonder how much say the aite has in such situations. Could Ryuuden have theoretically said he felt Hokutofuji couldn’t continue and accept the tie or would his “refusal” to fight count as a kuroboshi against him?

[Naganoyama 5,879]

Surely nowadays if a rikishi decides he is not fit to fight then he gets a fusenpai, whether he doesn't turn up at all or if he can't re-present himself after a matta.

[Akinomaki 40,030]

That was a real poisoned mood in the kokugikan for quite a while after the henka by Kakuryu: not much booing, just a negative frenzy. Both that and the enthusiastic frenzy for Endo isn't really audible on NHK (the announcer simply mentioned it) -  and neither on the video I took of the Endo shikiri time: huge applause for each new round of kensho banners, where NHK turns down the hall sound. The Endo calls after that NHK brought in full.

Hokutofuji obviously wasn't fully conscious when he nodded to the questions if he could go on - he was about to stagger off the dohyo at first because he thought the bout was over and he lost.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Akinomaki

[Eikokurai 3,437]

6 minutes ago, Naganoyama said:

Surely nowadays if a rikishi decides he is not fit to fight then he gets a fusenpai, whether he doesn't turn up at all or if he can't re-present himself after a matta.

Probably right, if Gojoro’s case in 2005 is anything to go by. He was forced to withdraw from a torinaoshi and forfeited the bout. That could explain Hokutofuji’s insistence on continuing – just another of sumo’s many customs that have unintended adverse consequences.

[ryafuji 810]

1 hour ago, Kintamayama said:

There was a real chance of a first itamiwake (tie) in 60 years today in the Ryuuden-Hokutofuji bout.. Both Fujishima head judge and Gyoji Kimura Hisanosuke asked Hokutofuji if he could continue and he answered in the affirmative. If he would have said he couldn't, it would have been declared a tie, since no bout actually took place.

Why wouldn't it have been recorded as a fusenpai for Hokutofuji?

[Asashosakari 18,959]

36 minutes ago, Naganoyama said:

Surely nowadays if a rikishi decides he is not fit to fight then he gets a fusenpai, whether he doesn't turn up at all or if he can't re-present himself after a matta.

Yeah, don't know where the itamiwake talk comes from, considering we've already seen a rikishi get fusenpai'ed for being unable to participate in a torinaoshi, and that's functionally the same thing as not being able to participate in the originally scheduled bout.

Edit: I see Eikokurai already mentioned that scenario.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Asashosakari

[Eikokurai 3,437]

2 minutes ago, Asashosakari said:

Yeah, don't know where the itamiwake talk comes from, considering we've already seen a rikishi get fusenpai'ed for being unable to participate in a torinaoshi, and that's functionally the same thing as not being able to participate in the originally scheduled bout.

Edit: I see Eikokurai already mentioned that scenario.

I had to look it up. It was the closest instance I could find to an itamiwake being called. Begs the question under what circumstances an itamiwake would or could ever be called. For what was the rule conceived in the first place?

[Rocks 1,807]

40 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

That was a real poisoned mood in the kokugikan for quite a while after the henka by Kakuryu: not much booing, just a negative frenzy.

I can see why. The idea of a Yokozuna feeling he needs to henka a M5 is just ridiculous.  It's must have been even more frustrating for the people that actually paid to be there.

Mitakeumi is very popular to begin with. I expect he will get boisterous support Day 11.

[Asojima 2,873]

In the case of a torinaoshi, an actual tachiai has occurred. In this case, the tachiai had not yet happened. I have no idea whether this matters, but technically, the match never started before the injury occurred.

Edited May 22, 2018 by Asojima

[Millwood 41]

3 minutes ago, Asojima said:

In the case of a torinaoshi, an actual tachiai has occurred. In this case, the tachiai had not yet happened. I have no idea whether this matters, but technically, the match never started before the injury occurred.

If there were any justice here - and I understand this is Sumo - the fact that the injury was caused by a Matta should have some bearing.

[Kintamayama 44,639]

"Why did I do that?? I'm totally unhappy. It would have been better if I lost. I wasn't planning this," said Kakuryuu of his henka. "This shows weakness," said Hakkaku rijicho. Kakuryuu showed great power in yesterdays's bout against Shoudai.  "I've ruined my own good flow," he lamented.

[Rocks 1,807]

12 minutes ago, Asashosakari said:

Yeah, don't know where the itamiwake talk comes from, considering we've already seen a rikishi get fusenpai'ed for being unable to participate in a torinaoshi, and that's functionally the same thing as not being able to participate in the originally scheduled bout.

Edit: I see Eikokurai already mentioned that scenario.

I would not agree these are functionally the same thing. In the case of a torinaoshi a match has occurred and another is set. That would be the same as a rikishi being unable to take the dohyo the day after an injury in a bout. Which makes the fusenpai make sense.

In this case Hokotofuji is unable to continue due to an injury  outside of the bout yet on the dohyo.  Unless they are willing to formally suggest the  matta, and therefore the injury causing Hokutofuji to withdraw, is solely his own fault it isn't really right to declare Ryuden the winner.