Basho Talk - Hatsu Basho 2017 ** (SPOILERS)

[pmac 34]

kise countdown: 4 down, 11 to go :)

wow mitakeumi, fearless and focussed, i wouldnt be surprised if he would be ozeki in a year from now!

ura i love you, i dont get tired watching his bouts, also he looks like hes putting weight on, maybe we see a real tachi-ai in future...... :D

[Akinomaki 39,581]

The OneAndOnly sumo channel posting each day videos from the kokugikan 2nd floor has now not just also maezumo, and today also Wakaichiro - but even Hattorizakura: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNag0wD2NNA

A bit too harsh to call that again one stepping out by himself, but it shows that there is still no real improvement, though his first bout against his mirror image gave some room for hope: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhpyD_4R0QU&t=8s

Of course his fan channel has both from the NSK stream videos: 1st, 2nd

Edited January 11, 2017 by Akinomaki

[Rocks 1,805]

23 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtaIH95hJkE

Very good bout. He was beaten but he hung in like grim death. Lot of grunting. Loud. He looks good.

[Bumpkin 438]

5 minutes ago, Rocks said:

Very good bout. He was beaten but he hung in like grim death. Lot of grunting. Loud. He looks good.

"grim death"  

[Jojo 11]

6 hours ago, orandashoho said:

It's not the absolute number of kinboshi that is telling, but the number relative to the number of matches won and the total number of matches -- I will leave it to the statisticians to figure out those rankings.

No ranking per se but he gives away a kinboshi per 5 bouts (counting only maegashira opposition), and around 1 in 10 altogether.

 

7 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

Harumafuji has never lost two straight bouts in the first three days before. As luck would have it, YDC Chairman Moriya was there yesterday. And the bombshell: "If he goes on like this, I think he should retire!!"said the Chairman in no uncertain terms and without mincing words. Harumafuji gave up his 31st kinboshi, tied for 8th most ever. The leader is Kitanoumi with 53.

 

49 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

And we all know what a hopeless yokozuna Kitanoumi was. Just shows how meaningless that particular stat is.

Bold claim ryafuji, considering Kitanoumi, as a Yokozuna, competed in well over twice as many bashos as Harumafuji has so far...

Moreover, and maybe to the point of YDC Chairman Moriya, he gave plenty away by extending his career maybe just a bit too long. Case in point, his only fought 10 bouts total in his 3 last basho, giving away 4 kinboshi out of 5 possible.

[Dwale 419]

Finally thought of a good nickname for Kotoshigiku: "Potatozeki." However, given his performance of late, one does wonder for much longer that would apply.

[Yubinhaad 11,506]

1 hour ago, Kintamayama said:

Nice bow. Narutake and Ichirou were the two best guys from Maezumo so I'm guessing Ichirou will go on to win 5-6 bouts. He looks solid to me.

Hopefully they'll both still have to contend with Wakayama, a solid Makushita-level rikishi returning from injury and a decent bet to repeat his Jk-Jd yusho double from the start of his career. Not sure about Maeta, a bit long in the tooth now but he's also down there only because of injury. Whatever happens it's nice to have an interesting Jonokuchi yusho race between newcomers and old hands.

Edit: In fact Narutaki fights Wakayama tomorrow, so that'll be a real test.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Yubinhaad

[d_golem 213]

I'm getting behind Afroman now! The kid looks good!

And Ura! Toyohibiki couldn't push him out by his upper part, so he tried to push him out by his belly, but Ura saw through that and purposely pulled his belly backwards, in doing also shifted his centre of gravity back towards the centre of the dohyo. Toyohibiki looked absolutely shattered at the end there. Breathtaking stuff...

Edited January 11, 2017 by d_golem

[ryafuji 806]

51 minutes ago, Jojo said:

Bold claim ryafuji, considering Kitanoumi, as a Yokozuna, competed in well over twice as many bashos as Harumafuji has so far...

I would have hoped that the sarcasm in my post was obvious, seeing as how I described the stat as meaningless in my next sentence. As previously mentioned, what is meaningful is not the overall number but the percentage of total yokozuna bouts that result in a kinboshi.

Edited January 11, 2017 by ryafuji

[ALAKTORN 346]

Wow, Hakuhō fighting on the belt like in good old days. I say he takes the yūshō.

Aoiyama is a bag of disappointments…

[Benevolance 2,472]

But it's a very big bag, so it's like, 10x the disappointments to be had but for the regular price of disappointment! A bargain on disappointments that can't be missed, I say! 

[Jojo 11]

53 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

I would have hoped that the sarcasm in my post was obvious, seeing as how I described the stat as meaningless in my next sentence. As previously mentioned, what is meaningful is not the overall number but the percentage of total yokozuna bouts that result in a kinboshi.

Thank you, I gathered your sarcasm, obvious as it was, I simply disagree with your assessment that the number is meaningless. It matters financially, it matters to the reputation and status of Yokozuna... 

[ryafuji 806]

23 minutes ago, Jojo said:

Thank you, I gathered your sarcasm, obvious as it was, I simply disagree with your assessment that the number is meaningless. It matters financially, it matters to the reputation and status of Yokozuna... 

OK, I thought the "bold claim" was referring to my "hopeless yokozuna" comment not my "meaningless" comment. Thank you for clarifying.  I'm not sure though that the number of kinboshi conceded over an entire career really affect a yokozuna's reputation and status that much. It's much more about the nuts and bolts of number of yusho and number of wins per basho. How often do the YDC criticize yokozuna for giving away kinboshi, if he has posted a reasonable overall record? It's more praise for the maegashira than criticism for the yokozuna, it seems to me.

Edited January 11, 2017 by ryafuji

[Akinomaki 39,581]

3 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

4 hours ago, WAKATAKE said:

So was the monoii call for Kise-Shohozan a sashichigae or what?

The goyji got away with it with a mawashi-uchiwa: change of gumbai direction after pointing to the other side first - in this case he maybe just forgot which side Kise was on. (Un)fortunately Tomozuna was the head shimpan and didn't know how to explain the situation  - but he was nice this time and avoided the sashichigae.

Later articles report that the mawashi-uchiwa Nikkan had confirmed came too late and wasn't accepted by the shimpan department - it is officially a sashichigae on the record of Kimura Tamajiro. http://mainichi.jp/articles/20170112/k00/00m/050/049000c

Edited January 11, 2017 by Akinomaki

[Naganoyama 5,818]

Kimura Tamajiro had a pretty helpless expression on his face when he was trying to point his gunbai towards Kisenosato. He could see the shimpan relentlessly getting up.

[Rocks 1,805]

I noticed Tochinoshin's mawashi came loose against Hakuho similar to when he faced Kisenosato last basho. I wonder if he is purposefully going with a loose mawashi?

[Rocks 1,805]

I think Kisenosato's Day 5 bout against Mitakeumi could be his toughest test this basho. Not saying it's the only one Kise could lose obviously. I don't see any of the Yokozuna as above the rest this basho. 

[robnplunder 974]

About Shodai & Mitakeumi, they have been taking turns at walking the same path, Mitakeumi walking one step faster.  I can almost guess what Shodai is going to do in the next basho based on what Mitakeumi does in the current one.  Kinboshi for Shodai in the next basho for sure. 

The story of the basho for me so far has been Mitakeumi, and Ura.  Disappointment so far: Ishiura, Sato - combined for one win vs 7 losses. 

Why was the Aminishiki win reversed?  Was it a hair pull?

[robnplunder 974]

3 minutes ago, Rocks said:

I think Kisenosato's Day 5 bout against Mitakeumi could be his toughest test this basho. Not saying it's the only one Kise could lose obviously. I don't see any of the Yokozuna as above the rest this basho. 

Kise & Mita both looked strong in this basho.   I hate the fact that they are meeting in day 5.  It's going to be the most anticipated 5 seconds in this basho for me, being a Mita fan and wanting to see a Kise Yusho.  I will be happy with either's win.  I think Kise will beat Mitakeumi though.  Kise is just too big & strong for Mita to push around.

[Benihana 1,900]

25 minutes ago, Rocks said:

I noticed Tochinoshin's mawashi came loose against Hakuho similar to when he faced Kisenosato last basho. I wonder if he is purposefully going with a loose mawashi?

I don't know if he did it today, but some rikishi do it on purpose when facing a opponent who is strong at(on?) the mawashi.

11 minutes ago, robnplunder said:

Kise & Mita both looked strong in this basho.   I hate the fact that they are meeting in day 5.  It's going to be the most anticipated 5 seconds in this basho for me, being a Mita fan and wanting to see a Kise Yusho.  I will be happy with either's win.  I think Kise will beat Mitakeumi though.  Kise is just too big & strong for Mita to push around.

I'm with you, it is a lose-lose situation for us.

[Akinomaki 39,581]

45 minutes ago, robnplunder said:

Why was the Aminishiki win reversed?  Was it a hair pull?

His foot was out first, before Kitataiki touched down.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Akinomaki

[Sakura 1,463]

9 hours ago, robnplunder said:

Mitakeumi!  I knew he can beat Kakuryu today.   He didn't disappoint me. 

Ura's sumo style can be only described by a Beatles' song, "Helter Skelter."    What was that today?   How far can he bend backward without losing balance?  

 

I don't get to watch much live, what with the time difference and the streaming quality. (I can get qq to work for 20 minutes at a stretch). I did see the Ura match though. I was stunned by the whole thing, especially the bendiness. I did think that it looked like he touched out first, though.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Sakura
spelling

[RabidJohn 1,644]

Wow, go Mitakeumi! If he can keep up this kind of performance he'll be ozeki a lot sooner than next year. How about July? He's still got some serious opposition to come, so I don't expect him to contend for the yusho this time, but he's set himself up for a solid 11-12 wins if he can maintain his current awesomeness.

Back-on-the-belt Hakuho's looking good too, like he's come to terms with his injuries and their weaknesses, and he's playing to his remaining strengths, waiting patiently to bring them into play. I think this is his yusho and probably only Kise and Kak can do anything about it.

And I knew Ura was bendy, but that was outrageous!

[Asojima 2,870]

10 minutes ago, Sakura said:

I did see the Ura match though. I was stunned by the whole thing, especially the bendiness.

Don't credit Ura. Blame Toyohibiki.  His standard tactic is to push his opponent to the edge, and then stand back about 1 1/2 feet and push with arms only.  He allows his dead victim to recover and then grind him into the dirt.

[robnplunder 974]

15 minutes ago, Asojima said:

Don't credit Ura. Blame Toyohibiki.  His standard tactic is to push his opponent to the edge, and then stand back about 1 1/2 feet and push with arms only.  He allows his dead victim to recover and then grind him into the dirt.

Yeah, going to Ura's stomach area after nearly getting him out had the opposite effect.  It allowed Ura to spring back into attack position.  It was a manga moment.  But in the heat of a match, I think Toyohibiki's instinct took over.   If he had time to think about it, he'd just fall on Ura's bent body.   Then again, we'd not be talking about Ura at this point.

 

Edited January 11, 2017 by robnplunder