Basho Talk - Haru Basho 2016 +++ Spoiler Alert! +++

[egparis18 622]

4: Ichinojo vs Daieisho: Huge upset! Daieshou wins by severely scaring Ichinojo out of the ring. That was funny.

You, of course, wouldn't pee yourself if Ichinojo so much as gave you a level stare.

You, and anyone else who casually trashes rikishi, Ichinojo or any other, without a thought for how it might hurt his fans, or even the rikishi himself if he happens to understand English and follow this forum, are not funny.

I mean trashes too. There's nothing wrong with consructive criticism.

I don't think I have ever trashed a rikishi before, sure I poke fun at them when they behave weirdly. Ichinojo even commented that it was his bad habit of pulling and jumping backwards instead of going forward. I wouldn't pee myself from Ichinojo rushing towards me? I don't really know if I would. I am 201cm tall and weigh 155kg. I think I'd manage somehow without pissing myself, would be scary still though considering how build he is.

Only rikishi who I keep poking fun at is Hattorizakura. But this poking of fun ain't malicious, infact I am inspired his guts. Lesser rikishi would have already given up on his situation. But for real with Hattorizakura. He is 70 kilos and hasn't won a single bout and this is his third basho out of Mae-zumo. He has to be one of the gutsiest persons I have seen. But is his heya feeding the poor man? I'd expect him to put on a bit of weight right now. But then again Sumo is tought sport so integrating takes time.

Sorry if I offended you as an Ichinojo fan.

Thank you. That's a very gracious apology. I'm touchy about Ichi.

Edited March 19, 2016 by egparis18

[Benevolance 2,534]

I count myself fortunate that Goeidou doesn't have any fans on this forum who might get touchy about my poking fun.

[Katooshu 3,485]

I really enjoyed Kotoshogiku-Toyonoshima....I thought Toyonoshima had him there and I was about to let out a sigh of disappointment.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Katooshu

[mikawa 1,794]

I count myself fortunate that Goeidou doesn't have any fans on this forum who might get touchy about my poking fun.

Don't be so sure :)

But seriously though, even though I've always liked Goeido as a Sekiwake, him as an Ozeki has just been more than disappointing (hopefully he can get a good score this time around). A bit like his namesake Honda Gotaro, who has also been disappointing given his talents.

[Gurowake 4,151]

I may have been a bit rash in my previous post. I'll try to be a bit more conciliatory and rational.

I think I don't fit into people's preconceived notions of how a Westerner should be a fan of sumo. I don't fit into many people's preconceived notions of anything at all. In no way am I completely dismissing the chances of young foreigners, I'm just saying that they're giving me no reason to care about them right now. Yes, they may develop into excellent rikishi, but I am not the kind of person who derives any particular satisfaction from having someone I've followed from the beginning of their career make it big, nor do I care additionally about people who happen to be born on the same continent or country as me. I'm a citizen of the world; all people are equally worthy of being followed regardless of where they are from. Foreigners in Sumo have a higher bar to meet in order to enter, so one is generally going to be expecting better things of them.

I don't know what the percentage of foreigners that enter Sumo that end up becoming sekitori, but I expect that any Westerner who is making the effort to live in such an alien culture should expect to on average and be severely disappointed if they don't. Perhaps I'm just biased toward seeing that a very significant majority (around 2/3) of currently active foreigners have made Juryo, with only Sakigake (and I guess Chiyoshoma for now) not being a long-time sekitori, while not seeing how many have tried and failed. Perhaps Kaisei is a bit above average for a foreigner since he's made the top half of Makuuchi, but he's still pretty much in the thick part of the bell curve. Roughly a third of the foreign sekitori are better than him now, and a few others have made it to a higher rank in their career. Certainly for a rikishi, he's way above average, and he certainly has a fine career for himself. But I just can't get excited for anyone via a comparison to Kaisei. And the current Mongolian Yokozuna entered Ozumo at a much younger age, so it's to be expected that they didn't catch fire right away. Coming in at 18 is a lot different than coming in at 15.

Yes, for a rikishi first entering the sport, the long view needs to be kept in mind. Most guys don't make it right away and they need to learn and develop. They can still have a fine sekitori career even if they spend five years getting there. But that's just something that the rikishi themselves need to keep in mind. As a somewhat casual fan half a world away, whatever view I take of things is valid for my own purposes. There's no point in telling others who they should be interested in years down the line, because they might just not be interested in the sport anymore by then. For someone that's really dug themselves deep into the Sumo world, it certainly makes sense, but I'm not particularly interested in the long view because the investment of my interest in the sport isn't looking for long-term rewards. Since we're talking about emotional returns and not economic ones, it's difficult for me to accept an argument that I'm doing it the wrong way.

As to my assertions that "no one cares", I suppose I was wrong, and incorrectly transferred my opinions on to others and was blind to other people's interests despite knowing myself that I am not typical of a fan of my demographic. That just seemed like the way things were to me at the time.

[rzombie1988 159]

Some thoughts from the last two days:

- I do think Toyonoshima threw against Kotoshogiku. His flip is unexplainable, especially at the speed he did it.

- I've figured out why Tochinoshin loses. Every match, he wraps his arms around and goes for the back of the belt, never the front. You can't do anything solely with the back of the belt. You need the front or side of the belt as well. He never goes inside for the belt, always around or outside.

- Ichinojo actually looked liked he cared near the tail end.

- Amuuru looked strong the last few days. If he can get inside before he gets knocked silly he has a good shot at winning. Don't know if his style can work in the upper ranks though.

- Felt bad for Sokokurai against Terunofuji. Soko had no shot of winning that whatsoever.

- Ikioi vs Kisenosato should be exciting tommorow. Ikioi is 0-10 against him, so he's gonna have to be on the ball.

- Also checked out all of Osunaarashi's matches. His slaps are lighting fast right now and he's totally in beast mode. Would not be shocked at a 14-1.

Edited March 19, 2016 by rzombie1988

[Kotogouryuu 143]

I really enjoyed Kotoshogiku-Toyonoshima....I thought Toyonoshima had him there and I was about to let out a sigh of disappointment.

What exactly Kotoshogiku has done to expand his range of offense and especially defense in the last six months I don't know, but it sure as hell is working. He beat Toyonoshima from a situation he would haven't even reached last year.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Kotogouryuu

[rzombie1988 159]

Nishinoshima, how is Brody doing by the way? Is he eating and training alright?

Despite having two defeats this basho his posture during tachiai looks better in my opinion.

I would love to get some news about how he is dealing with his heya duties and how much training he is doing or is he having a hard time?

If he managed to turn this basho into a winning one I think access to Internet would boost his confidence.

He's 2-2 now after another win today.

Has lost a lot of muscle / weight since he joined which isn't uncommon. Needed to break down and resculpt that stiff body to a sumo one.

It's been tough but it always is. So much stuff goes on in sumo that never makes that news. Suffice it to say that it's a hard life and not for most people.

He's pretty much on the schedule I imagined when I helped him join. The injuries and surgery were setbacks but you have to expect them given the nature of the thing. He needs a year or two more before he can start to put it all together I think. Probably another 30-40 kilos too eventually.

In my opinion he has to stick with the long slaps aka Akebono. Not liking his posture at all. He also has to stop going for the back of the belt like Tochinoshin.

[rzombie1988 159]

I really enjoyed Kotoshogiku-Toyonoshima....I thought Toyonoshima had him there and I was about to let out a sigh of disappointment.

What exactly Kotoshogiku has done to expand his range of offense and especially defense in the last six months I don't know, but it sure as hell is working. He beat Hiroshima from a situation he would haven't even reached last year.

He hasn't slipped/fell on his face in a while. He did that on multiple days in bashos in the last year. I also think he is looking a bit more at his opponent to avoid henka's.

[CT3* 331]

The sensitivity is high around here of late...

[Kotogouryuu 143]

//Trying to live post my reactions and thoughts that are immediate again! Excuse me for being unfiltered! Let's hope the stream can keep up. :P//

4: Gagamaru vs Mitakeumi: Our favourite tone-deaf crybaby continues to dominate Mitakeumi. It was tri-push railroad for Gagamaru. Mitakeumi doesn't have any clue what to do against bigger opponents than him. Gagamaru is great but not someone Mitakeumi should struggle against.

9: Ichinojo vs Kaisei: Ichinojo was sleeping at tachiai but managed to neutralize Kaisei A's rush with his sheer size and mongolian genetics. Pushing from both sides ensued only to end with a good throw by Ichinojo. Why doesn't this Ichinojo show up more often. I call him Ichinojo (A)lpha. Better bout than the last one. Some good sumo shown today.12: Ikioi vs Myogiryuu: Most exciting match of today. Let's see what happens! Stand-off and stood up! Tingling excitement! Myougiryuu gets the superior belt grip but Ikioi takes his opponent and throws the former Sekiwake like he was a bag of potatoes. IT'S HAPPENING HOLY SHIT!19: Kakuryu vs Yoshikaze: Yoshikaze attacks valiantly! Pushing and pulling tries but Kakiryuu puts a stop to that nonsense and gives Yoshikaze a good chop to the head and he falls like a rotting tree. Hatakikomi!

20: Tochinoshin 0 vs Hakuho 21: We all know who is gonna win, but let's watch it anyway. For the grunts! Hakuho catches him easily and pushed Tochinoshin back like he was air. What? We all knew this was going to happen. 0-22.

21: Harumafuji vs Aoiyama: Can Aoiyama defeat the best currently competetive Yokozuna? Surely not, right? AND STREAM CUT OUT! THANKS FOR READING! :D Just kidding. Harumafuji uses his skill and power to push Aoiyama staight of the dohyo!

I'm going to reply to your comment on these because your stuff is really good. I like the play-by-play feel in the comments, keep them coming!

4: Mitakeumi started waaaay to slow. Gagamaru had time to find his balance and start his offense, so yeah, that was over before it started. A lesson learned, I hope.

9: Ichinojo finally used the leg power he obviously has. In his first few makuuchi basho he seemed to be able to stop being pushed back at will. Maybe he has a chance of finding that mojo again.

12: Myogiryu is no pushover, that was a good win by Ikioi. Magnificent sumo. I'm actually surprised that this was only their 7th match. It seems I'm getting used to some names and losing perspective on where on the banzuke they spend their time. This match didn't really do anything to clarify that, to be honest.

19 & 21: Kakuryu is good. He is beatable, but there is really no way to faze him. And so is Harumafuji, obviously. Today Ama just seemed to move the general aspects of reality around him until Aoiyama was out of the ring. Good sumo from both of the yokozuna.

20: Tochinoshin doesn't seem to have any real weapons against the sanyaku. He has power, but it's clearly not enough. Grunting will only get you so far. Yeah, he has been treated badly in several banzuke promotions but from here it's up to him, and he's not on it so far.

[Irakusamaru 77]

Tozai kai

http://www.touzaikai.org

Well, that explains why they sit on the east and west sides! Are there other large support groups like that? I mean, I'm aware of the koenkai, but Tozai kai seems to offer more general support.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Irakusamaru

[Dwale 419]

Really enjoyed Amuuru's match. I like ponderous power sumo as well, but there's something about an agility win that's especially rewarding. For me, anyway.

Gotta give props to Ichinojo; sluggish or not, he's in there doing his job. Didn't look too shabby with that throw, either. "Oh, right, I forgot he's incredibly strong."

Now, be honest. Did anyone think Kotoyuki was going to have such a good first week at maegashira 1?

[Tenshinhan 1,612]

Looking forward to Kotoyuki vs Aminishiki tomorrow - they met each other three times and each bout resulted in a henka.

[orandashoho 720]

Now, be honest. Did anyone think Kotoyuki was going to have such a good first week at maegashira 1?

Not I. It's really impressive.

[Benevolance 2,534]

Kotoyuki is proving he's a top dog.

[Dwale 419]

Looking forward to Kotoyuki vs Aminishiki tomorrow - they met each other three times and each bout resulted in a henka.

Hmm. Ok, I've got a prediction! They BOTH henka tomorrow, initiating the largest simultaneous facepalm in human history.

[ScottyJoyJrBebe 97]

At only 24 years of Age, Kotoyuki can become something special (I believe) Although some have mentioned his inconsistency, may I mention that he has had only one MK in the last 2 years, and a slow and steady climb is never a bad thing (Kakuryu) Lets hope he continues to stay on fire in week 2 HHHHUUUU!!!!

My friend Ichinojo, my faith in you (and Elaine's faith as well) is paying off. 10 wins is definitely reachable at this point.

Ozekiwake Goeido is also silencing quite a few of us that didn't believe in him.

Kotoshogiku continues to press home his tsuna attempt. Last Year, did anyone even remotely think that we would be debating a tsuna run by him?? I sure didn't, I only just liked his Koooooooooooooooooooooootoshogiku stretch (Koto-Bauer)

[Pandaazuma 1,310]

I may have been a bit rash in my previous post. I'll try to be a bit more conciliatory and rational.

(Sign of approval...)

And I'll stay away from giant red letters and Pandaazuma pop-ups

Dammit! I like that meme!

[Jyuunomori 238]

Brodi (Homarenishiki) pushed his opponent out and down onto the head judge (his boss Nishikido oyakata). Nishikido injured his leg and is now kyujo.

Too bad for the Nishikido, Sumo is truly a dangerous sport. But at least his boy won, despite causing anguish to him. :P

Brodi looked rather fierce this time around and his tsuppari looked strong, we have never seen him use it in that fashion. Maybe he is reluctant to use it because it is all new to him.

[hamcornheinz 839]

Comes from being the biggest kid by a mile growing up. Fear of hurting your peers / having to go half speed. Has a bit of the old Lennox Lewis about him in terms of needing to get hit first to get angry. After day six he was saying he was going to stop being second off the mark at the tachi-ai and on day seven he did indeed get the faster start. Two wins from the last three needed.

got to turn up the hurt. I have the same condition, and when I do kendo I do only go about half strength subconsciously.

[Jyuunomori 238]

Endo has failed us all, the pattern has been broken.

Also Osunaarashi must be disappointed in himself just as much as we are disappointed in him. He couldn't find a new kimarite to defeat Endo today and had to resort to using Uwanage twice. Tsk tsk. (Pick on my sarcasm, please.)

Edited March 20, 2016 by Jyuunomori

[Katooshu 3,485]

Go away Nishigiki....this is Osu's yusho.

[ALAKTORN 346]

Wow, Kotoshōgiku. I had to clap to myself for that.

Oh yeah I forgot I’m totally late. This is a comment on yesterday’s bout. lol

Edited March 20, 2016 by ALAKTORN

[inhashi 2,363]

Endo has failed us all, the pattern has been broken...

His heya mates Daiesho, Daishomaru, and Tsurugisho are progressing nicely. Seemingly likable boys too.

edit: jinxed Daishomaru :'-(

Edited March 20, 2016 by inhashi