Aki Basho 2018 Discussion [SPOILERS]

[YoungSumo 93]

Tochinoshin is a bit banged up and clearly not 100% but his losses were all to guys who are all having a strong basho. He's going to pick up some more losses for sure but 3 more wins should definitely be possible. 

Even though I'm fully behind Kisenosato I'm definitely expecting one of those 3 wins to come tomorrow. Kise doesn't have that aggression necessary to make life difficult for Tochinoshin now and I don't even think it'll be a close bout. I think its very commendable Kisenosato put in so much effort to return but its clear he's not like the old him and most likely never will be again. Best case scenario for him all around would probably be to get a winning record here and retire with his head held high.

[Rocks 1,810]

6 hours ago, Morty said:

Hakuho will be out with supporters tonight getting big time drunk after win 800. It may be the best time to face him

I thought the same. Easy to let off after a "big win" especially when it came too easily against a guy who is injured and had zero interest in going at Hakuho. Yutakayama came back to get a few wins and decrease his drop down the banzuke knowing after Hakuho he was done with the Y/Os. 

[Rocks 1,810]

4 minutes ago, YoungSumo said:

Tochinoshin is a bit banged up and clearly not 100% but his losses were all to guys who are all having a strong basho. He's going to pick up some more losses for sure but 3 more wins should definitely be possible. 

Even though I'm fully behind Kisenosato I'm definitely expecting one of those 3 wins to come tomorrow. Kise doesn't have that aggression necessary to make life difficult for Tochinoshin now and I don't even think it'll be a close bout. I think its very commendable Kisenosato put in so much effort to return but its clear he's not like the old him and most likely never will be again. Best case scenario for him all around would probably be to get a winning record here and retire with his head held high.

That isn't going to happen. If Kisenosato can get a KK, even at 8, he doesn't retire. Did you hear those screams for him? The Kyokai won't even mention his retirement. He's bringing in too much money at this point and there is little reason for Kise to leave that money on the table. 8 wins and he goes on. The only way you see a Kise intai announcement is when he gets to 6 losses IMO.

[Rainoyama 1,157]

6 hours ago, Morty said:

Hakuho will be out with supporters tonight getting big time drunk after win 800. It may be the best time to face him

 

8 minutes ago, Rocks said:

I thought the same. Easy to let off after a "big win" especially when it came too easily against a guy who is injured and had zero interest in going at Hakuho. Yutakayama came back to get a few wins and decrease his drop down the banzuke knowing after Hakuho he was done with the Y/Os. 

Mm not sure a champion like Hakuhou is going to take the risk to get too drunk when he has an important match tomorow. He is still in the race but Kakuryu looks really good so he knows he cannot afford to lose because he partied too much.Why would he risk it when he can celebrate after the basho ?

[Asojima 2,874]

Tochinoshin is banged up, and Kisenosato has been fighting with one arm in his last few matches.  The recent history pre-injury match-ups between the two say that Kise may be in for a bad night.

[Rocks 1,810]

3 minutes ago, Rainoyama said:

 

Mm not sure a champion like Hakuhou is going to take the risk to get too drunk when he has an important match tomorrow. He is still in the race but Kakuryu looks really good so he knows he cannot afford to lose because he partied too much.Why would he risk it when he can celebrate after the basho ?

When you have 40 Yusho under your belt you think you can do both. For many years that was true for Hakuho. I'm not so sure anymore.

[Kawabata 270]

17 minutes ago, Rocks said:

a guy who is injured and had zero interest in going at Hakuho.

Yeah it seemed pretty obvious that Yutakayama had lost that bout before he stepped on the dohyo, his facial expressions and body language during the salt-throwing etc all just screamed "I should have come back tomorrow"

 

[Rocks 1,810]

1 minute ago, Kawabata said:

Yeah it seemed pretty obvious that Yutakayama had lost that bout before he stepped on the dohyo, his facial expressions and body language during the salt-throwing etc all just screamed "I should have come back tomorrow"

 

I'm not sure he could have avoided Hakuho unless he waited till after day 10 at which point he'd only have 5 matches left to get wins in. Not many. Better just to bite the bullet and take that loss.

 

BTW, Kisenosato still has a road to 9 wins. He will face Endo, and win because Endo will be MK at that point and ready for this basho to be over with. He has Ichinojo who looks like he won't pull out a comeback KK this time. Ichinojo has not put up much fight at all and may not against Kise either. And unless I'm wrong with the scheduling Kise will get Goeido on Day 15 with Kak-Hak as the final match. Unless Goeido has something to shoot for in that match, such as; 10 wins, the yusho or the jun-yusho, I could see Goeido doing a bit of backscratching.

[bettega 433]

9 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Tochinoshin is in trouble. All three Yokozuna and Takayasu still to face with three wins needed.

Make it two - there's a Intai coming. I won't tell from whom 

[Mufuu 13]

9 hours ago, Shio-kago said:

Goeido's stubborn defense of his Ozeki rank, when he has faced the edge of the cliff so many times, has meant a great deal to me.

I have a similarly-derived respect for Hattorizakura. 

[Isao 23]

3 hours ago, Rocks said:

Tochi isn't badly injured so such as banged up, a lot. He has a lot of small to middling injuries that add up to not much stamina.

It's not only a lack of stamina. His waist was too high in the last bouts. That's why I think the injuries in his legs are worse than most people think, and he will not recover in one day. OTOH, Kisenosato seems simply rusty, not injured, so he will maintain the physical level that has allowed him to win almost all bouts this basho. And mentally I think he is still very motivated and with good fighting spirit, much more than Tochinoshin.

[Amamaniac 2,091]

6 minutes ago, Antonio Inoki said:

And mentally I think he is still very motivated and with good fighting spirit

Early in this tournament, I would definitely agree that Kise seemed motivated to win.  But yesterday's bout/loss against Tamawashi made me think that he had lost his grit.  The loss against Chiyotairyu on Day 6 may just have let the air out of his tires, IMHO.  Kise's biggest weakness is his lack of confidence.  I hope Tagonoura oyakata finds a way to get him back on track, or this could end up being a disaster tournament for the Yokozuna.

I had been hoping that Takayasu would keep his win-streak alive, and that even if Kise wouldn't win the championship, he would be able to tip the scales in Takayasu's favour.  That definitely ain't happening now.  Generally speaking, when Kise does well, Takayasu does well.  Perhaps the opposite is also true.  When Kise does poorly, Takayasu starts to struggle.  They might be feeding off each other's negative (and/or positive) energy.

Today's bout between Kisenosato and Tochinoshin will be interesting.  Who wants the win more?  The take-home pay will definitely make it worth either wrestler's while to give it their all.

[Amamaniac 2,091]

6 minutes ago, Kyokufuji said:

The Japanese commentary during the replay was hilarious.

I believe I heard Mainoumi say that a monoii was definitely called for.  I wonder if the fact that Chiyonokuni fell so close to the shimpancho, i.e., Onomatsu, resulted in Onomatsu's confusion and non-call of a monoii.  He was technically in the best position to see that Kagayaki's left arm dropped out first, but he was too busy shielding himself from Chiyonokuni's legs to see what was actually going down (pun intended).

[Amamaniac 2,091]

That's twice that I've seen a Westerner with glasses and a grey beard sitting in the front row directly behind the wrestlers on the East side.  How in heaven's name is he scoring those tickets?  Most Japanese fans would die for that seat.  And he gets his mug on TV to boot.  Once, I can accept as a special favour, but twice!

Colour me super jealous.

[Asashosakari 20,225]

4 hours ago, Asojima said:

Now and then, there is a delayed call for a monoii.  It has long been assumed that these calls originate from the video replay gyoji.

No need to assume, we had confirmation of that in one case last year.

[dingo 1,477]

Goeido is the only ozeki who won. Now how often does that happen? 

[Rocks 1,810]

1 hour ago, dingo said:

Goeido is the only ozeki who won. Now how often does that happen? 

Given the quality of Ozeki for the last couple of years and the fact there was only 2 for a while, probably often. Certainly on the days the 2 ozeki met each in the ring. 

[Benihana 1,971]

7 hours ago, Gurowake said:

Anyone with the closest ring side seats (5 Shimpan, 4 rikishi, 1 gyoji) can call a mono-ii.  Well, I guess I don't know if the back-up gyoji can call one, as I've never heard of it.  But while it's extremely rare for rikishi to call them, it has happened though.  I remember Hakuho calling one when one of the other Mongolian Yokozunas "lost" but had his hair pulled.

Hakuho calling for a monoii after his own bout just flashed back. Had to rewatch it immediately, this is so much fun  

Spoiler

 

Wacky Aki is back. I don't like how the basho's evolving. Only really good thing are the weak results in juryo, which means Aminishiki is still tied for the yusho race with 5-3. Except from Arawashi and maybe another makuuchi visit it's all M5 downwards from now on. Ganbatte!

[sekitori 492]

2 hours ago, Benihana said:

Wacky Aki is back. I don't like how the basho's evolving. Only really good thing are the weak results in juryo, which means Aminishiki is still tied for the yusho race with 5-3. Except from Arawashi and maybe another makuuchi visit it's all M5 downwards from now on. Ganbatte!

I don't think it's wacky at all. I happen to like the way it's evolving. Hakuho achieved his milestone 800th win as a yokozua. Both yokozunas are undefeated and two of the ozekis have only one loss. The other yokozuna and ozeki are injured and are doing their best to get winning records. Mitakeumi is still in line for promotion to ozeki, at least so far. Hokutofuji and Ryuden are doing unexpectedly well at 7-1. After having a terrible 2-13 basho, Yoshikaze is now at 6-2. Asanoyama is also at 6-2. Aminiishiki has a good chance of returning to makunouchi and Toyonoshima, after a horrendous injury, will finally return to juryo. What's not to like?

Edited September 17, 2018 by sekitori

[Eikokurai 3,437]

23 minutes ago, sekitori said:

I don't think it's wacky at all. I happen to like the way it's evolving. Hakuho achieved his milestone 800th win as a yokozua. Both yokozunas are undefeated and two of the ozekis have only one loss. The other yokozuna and ozeki are injured and are doing their best to get winning records. Mitakeumi is still in line for promotion to ozeki, at least so far. Hokutofuji and Ryuden are doing unexpectedly well at 7-1. After having a terrible 2-13 basho, Yoshikaze is now at 6-2. Asanoyama is also at 6-2. Aminiishiki has a good chance of returning to makunouchi and Toyonoshima, after a horrendous injury, will finally return to juryo. What's not to like?

Both Yokozuna? Have you retired Kisenosato already? :)

[Kishinoyama 624]

6 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

Both Yokozuna? Have you retired Kisenosato already? :)

He does mention the other Yokozuna and Ozeki in the post you quoted. 

[Eikokurai 3,437]

51 minutes ago, Kishinoyama said:

He does mention the other Yokozuna and Ozeki in the post you quoted. 

I know. Still odd to use ‘both’ when the third exists though. ;)

[sekitori 492]

1 hour ago, Eikokurai said:

Both Yokozuna? Have you retired Kisenosato already? :)

Instead of stating that both yokozinas are undefeated, I intended my words to mean that both of the yokozunas who had a reasonable chance to win the yusho were undefeated. As was stated previously, I did mention the "other" yokozuna, but my statement should have been clearer. Sorry for causing people to be upset by what they believe is my "odd" use of language. 

Edited September 17, 2018 by sekitori

[Eikokurai 3,437]

11 minutes ago, sekitori said:

Instead of stating that both yokozinas are undefeated, I intended my words to mean that both of the yokozunas who had a reasonable chance to win the yusho were undefeated. As was stated previously, I did mention the "other" yokozuna, but my statement should have been clearer. Sorry for causing people to be upset by what they believe is my "odd" use of language. 

I’m not upset. I even put a smiley face!

[lackmaker 454]

15 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

In what sport does such a thing exist?

I believe athletics does have a right to appeal by the team of an athlete unfairly impeded.