Seiyashi 4,108 Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Eikokurai said: 6 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: I should have added a smiley emoji, I really was too serious there... I know you were joking. I hope you didn’t think my answer was genuine. I’m not that dumb! I know you were joking too, but the joke sort of got orphaned without reference to the 2 5-10 M1s, so some poor new soul coming across it later might just take it as gospel... No offence meant! Future note to self - be more explicit with jokes. Edited March 25, 2021 by Seiyashi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amamaniac 2,079 Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said: Looked to me like Akiseyama's belly landed simultaneously with Hoshoryu's foot, but no mono-ii. Maybe because the best-placed judge had to take evasive action. I'm going to go so far as to say, Akiseyama's belly was down first! Hoshoryu pivoted on the bales and skilfully stayed in, evading Akiseyama's charge. He then allowed himself to step out, not at the edge, but rather, down off the ring. He did everything right IMHO. I would have settled for a torinaoshi, but deep down I feel that he was robbed. Twisting moves at the bales are used all the time ... and those who can pull them off are usually rewarded with the win. That being said, I also accept the fact that oozumo is filled with results that are questionable or even outright wrong. Luckily they are few and far between. We fans may not like it, but upon reflection I have decided that it simply goes with the territory. No use getting one's mawashi tied in a knot. Edited March 25, 2021 by Amamaniac Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Karasukurai 166 Posted March 25, 2021 Just caught up on Juryo - Ura looked in a lot of pain after his win today. If he turns up tomorrow and beats Bushozan to KK I hope he takes the last couple of days off. Loved Akua's sprightly, wide-armed, stomp back to his position after his win. Nice to see good old Chiyomaru leading the field too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,108 Posted March 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, Amamaniac said: No use getting one's mawashi tied in a knot. Au contraire, it stops it all from hanging out... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amamaniac 2,079 Posted March 25, 2021 51 minutes ago, Eikokurai said: Wakatakakage wins to get his kachikoshi (8-4) and edge ahead of Hokutofuji, his main challenger for either M1e or a Komusubi slot, the availability of which is going to the wire. Wakatakakage is a real breath of fresh air this tournament. He is clearly the most talented wrestler of the three Waka brothers. He started out this tournament with a 2-4 losing record. But the thing was that his two wins were Ozeki scalps! With those upset victories under his belt, I felt that he could potentially make a claim on a Sansho Prize (esp. Outstanding Performance) if only he could manage a KK ideally with 9 or more wins. He now has strung together 6 straight wins, most of them against worthy opponents. I'd say he's on fire. And tomorrow he'll go up against Takayasu! That will be a critical bout for Takayasu's yusho hopes. I give Papa Yasu 60-40 odds of winning. But I'll definitely be crediting the 40 as a strong chance for Wakatakakage to pull off a HUGE upset. And if he does, I believe he will seal a shukunsho and maybe a second Sansho to boot! I can't handle all this excitement! 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eikokurai 3,437 Posted March 25, 2021 29 minutes ago, Amamaniac said: Wakatakakage is a real breath of fresh air this tournament. He is clearly the most talented wrestler of the three Waka brothers. He started out this tournament with a 2-4 losing record. But the thing was that his two wins were Ozeki scalps! With those upset victories under his belt, I felt that he could potentially make a claim on a Sansho Prize (esp. Outstanding Performance) if only he could manage a KK ideally with 9 or more wins. He now has strung together 6 straight wins, most of them against worthy opponents. I'd say he's on fire. And tomorrow he'll go up against Takayasu! That will be a critical bout for Takayasu's yusho hopes. I give Papa Yasu 60-40 odds of winning. But I'll definitely be crediting the 40 as a strong chance for Wakatakakage to pull off a HUGE upset. And if he does, I believe he will seal a shukunsho and maybe a second Sansho to boot! I can't handle all this excitement! If Mitakeumi loses one more and either Daieisho fails to seize his spot or Takanosho drops into it, there’s the real possibility Wakatakakage (M2w) gets promoted to a higher Komusubi slot than Daieisho did from a higher rank (M1w) with a 13-2 yusho behind him. Such is the capricious luck of banzuke making! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 19,694 Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Seiyashi said: According to NHK's research, Kaiketsu did get the delegation again. But no ozekiwake have gotten the delegation. The closest to an official answer was the non-answer by Oguruma, commentating that day, who said they didn't know and they'll wait and see. Courtesy of Herouth on Twitter: ヘルット (BASHO SPOILERS!) on Twitter: "Announcer asks Oguruma: "When Kaiketsu returned to Ozeki, he got a second promotion ceremony. Nowadays when returning from Sekiwake to Ozeki, there is no ceremony. What about the case of Terunofuji?" Oguruma: "There is no policy. If it happens, we will discuss and decide"." / Twitter According to Kaiketsu's ja.wiki article, the delegation was sent because it was an ozeki promotion decided by the shimpan committee and confirmed by the rijikai (as opposed to an automatic promotion by rule), and so the news needed to be transmitted officially just like for any first-time promotion. Whether or not they still consider this "needed" now is an open question, of course. Edited March 25, 2021 by Asashosakari 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Morty 1,505 Posted March 25, 2021 Happy to see that my comment yesterday caused some spirited discussion. But I apologise to @SumoKitten if I offended you - my favourite thing about this forum is that it is respectful and we can have discussion without people getting aggressive, and so if I overstepped the mark, I'm sorry. In that spirit, for newer forum members, be aware that English speaking rikishi have visited here in the past and so any comments anyone makes about a particular rikishi may be read by them. I don't know is any of the current crop of rikishi fit that bill, but you never know. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seregost 132 Posted March 25, 2021 If Akiseyama's belly wasn't so huge, for sure Hoshoryu would have been losing clearly xD. As to Ura, I would quite immediatly. Ok, he will go makekoshi, but a minimum one, so he will drop just a few spots in the banzuke. I don't get this behaviour. And Midorifuji's case maybe is not so easy, but anyway he doesn't look in good condition at all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bessantj 4 Posted March 25, 2021 If Teronufuji doesn't win another bout (ending 9-6) how likely is he to be promoted to Ozeki? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jakusotsu 6,052 Posted March 25, 2021 16 minutes ago, bessantj said: If Teronufuji doesn't win another bout (ending 9-6) how likely is he to be promoted to Ozeki? Considering the Miyabiyama precedent, I'd say nil, and even a 10-5 is very much debatable. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bessantj 4 Posted March 25, 2021 11 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said: Considering the Miyabiyama precedent, I'd say nil, and even a 10-5 is very much debatable. Thank you. Still a bit new to sumo and navigating what constitutes a promotion can be a bit confusing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,108 Posted March 25, 2021 12 minutes ago, bessantj said: 25 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said: Considering the Miyabiyama precedent, I'd say nil, and even a 10-5 is very much debatable. Thank you. Still a bit new to sumo and navigating what constitutes a promotion can be a bit confusing. I think it won't help you if we say that the only hard and fast rules are: win and you go somewhat up, lose and you go somewhat down, a 7-0 from MS15 or up gets you into juryo, and a 7-0 from anywhere else in makushita gets you MS15 or up. Optics are everything in sumo. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eikokurai 3,437 Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said: Considering the Miyabiyama precedent, I'd say nil, and even a 10-5 is very much debatable. I agree with your thoughts on the 9-6 but I think the Miyabiyama precedent will be less of a pull with Terunofuji than it might for others, with his two yusho and better Ozeki record first time around. I‘d like to think that buys him some grace with the Kyokai. Edited March 25, 2021 by Eikokurai 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,108 Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Eikokurai said: 1 hour ago, Jakusotsu said: Considering the Miyabiyama precedent, I'd say nil, and even a 10-5 is very much debatable. I agree with your thoughts on the 9-6 but I think the Miyabiyama precedent will be less of a pull with Terunofuji that it might for others, with his two yusho and better Ozeki record first time around. I‘d like to think that buys him some grace with the Kyokai. The Miyabiyama case is perhaps more of an exception rather than a precedent. His initial promotion was already somewhat contentious, and he didn't exactly prove his doubters wrong in the rank, so it's not a surprise that the shimpanbu would refuse to promote him again (and were proved right when he never again managed those types of numbers). Terunofuji won his initial promotion in fine style and had great promise as an ozeki, and fell down the rankings less to inferior sumo than catastrophic injury. I don't think the Miyabiyama case will be weighing very much on the Kyokai's minds if at all. What may, however, is the slightly flagging quality to his sumo in the tail end of the basho. He is looking much less irresistable in the closing days of the basho compared to the opening days, and really bad losses to any of the ozeki and/or weak wins only over them may do him in, even if he meets the numbers. Takakeisho's first non-promotion is the worrying precedent here, not Miyabiyama. Edited March 25, 2021 by Seiyashi 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bessantj 4 Posted March 25, 2021 39 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: I think it won't help you if we say that the only hard and fast rules are: win and you go somewhat up, lose and you go somewhat down, a 7-0 from MS15 or up gets you into juryo, and a 7-0 from anywhere else in makushita gets you MS15 or up. Optics are everything in sumo. I do get the sense that requirements for promotion/demotion are quite malleable, I'm guessing that if, for some reason, there were no Ozeki then Terunofuji would have a much better chance of getting promoted. I'm hoping the more I follow Sumo the more i'll get in tune with the "feeling" of who is going where. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jakusotsu 6,052 Posted March 25, 2021 44 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: ...a 7-0 from MS15 or up gets you into juryo... Not always. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bessantj 4 Posted March 25, 2021 4 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said: Not always. Now there's a man that liked Makushita. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 19,694 Posted March 25, 2021 57 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: and a 7-0 from anywhere else in makushita gets you MS15 or up. And from Sandanme 1 to 25! Unless you're a 31-year-old fluke champion that has no hope in hell of taking advantage of a top 15 ranking anyway. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,108 Posted March 25, 2021 So basically, the rule is, there is always an exception. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lackmaker 438 Posted March 25, 2021 Except for the rules where there have so far been no exceptions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kaminariyuki 500 Posted March 25, 2021 7 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said: Looked to me like Akiseyama's belly landed simultaneously with Hoshoryu's foot, but no mono-ii. Maybe because the best-placed judge had to take evasive action. I don't know if it's an exceptional basho on this count, but I've noticed the nimbleness and dexterity of the shinpan have been tested lately. I replayed the Ura-Enho match a few times to see if I could see how Ura got injured, but what I particularly noticed was how Ura completely took out the shinpan as he blasted off the dohyo. Someone should keep stats on shinpan and gyoji take-downs. If I'm watching in the afternoon and note such an occurrence, I admit, Ialways lift my shochu cup in honor of their health. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kaminariyuki 500 Posted March 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Seiyashi said: The Miyabiyama case is perhaps more of an exception rather than a precedent. His initial promotion was already somewhat contentious, and he didn't exactly prove his doubters wrong in the rank, so it's not a surprise that the shimpanbu would refuse to promote him again (and were proved right when he never again managed those types of numbers). Terunofuji won his initial promotion in fine style and had great promise as an ozeki, and fell down the rankings less to inferior sumo than catastrophic injury. I don't think the Miyabiyama case will be weighing very much on the Kyokai's minds if at all. What may, however, is the slightly flagging quality to his sumo in the tail end of the basho. He is looking much less irresistable in the closing days of the basho compared to the opening days, and really bad losses to any of the ozeki and/or weak wins only over them may do him in, even if he meets the numbers. Takakeisho's first non-promotion is the worrying precedent here, not Miyabiyama. Just like the Great British Bake-Off, or a symphony, or a foot race, it never hurts to finish strong. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RabidJohn 1,858 Posted March 25, 2021 1 hour ago, bessantj said: I'm hoping the more I follow Sumo the more i'll get in tune with the "feeling" of who is going where. Don't count on it. Daieisho's failure to secure an additional sekiwake slot with a 13-2Y from M1 blindsided just about everybody here! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hakutorizakura 643 Posted March 25, 2021 Sumo has lots of subjective things. Which makes it interesting (or infuriating, depending on your salt intake) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
