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Basho Talk - Hatsu Basho 2017 ** (SPOILERS)

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5 hours ago, lackmaker said:

Is this the very definition of hope over experience?

yes, what else is left? :)) 

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6 hours ago, Asashosakari said:
7 hours ago, Arn said:

Interesting.

How did the mass-expelling in 2011 affect this?

Not by a lot, I would say. Nearly all the expelled rikishi were already pretty old at the time and would be long retired by now anyway - and a lot of the guys who were lucky to move up to fill the freshly vacated spots weren't that young either and are now gone as well (Takanoyama, Tenkaiho, etc.).

If anyone is interested in exactly who from what ranks were expelled, the yaocho guys are among those listed as retired in the May and July 2011 basho banzuke (which you get access from the SumoDB). The only one of those good fellows expelled that actually got back in is Sokokurai, who sued the NSK and won (reinstated and banzuke gai May 2013).  About those lists - not everyone on the retired lists were yaocho guys.

There was another scandal about a year earlier related to illegal gambling on baseball (IIRC, yakuza connections were involved) that led to a number of 1 and 2 basho suspensions. Ozeki Kotomitsuki was expelled, as was his oyakata, ex-Takatoriki. IIRC there were other oyakata who were demoted and something like 15-20 rikishi were suspended for 1 or 2 basho. Some of the current rikishi caught up in that include Goeido, Okinoumi, Toyohibiki, and Toyonoshima. Shohozan was suspended for 2 basho.

Links (English)
Controversies in Professional Sumo
May 2011 Banzuke
July 2011 Banzuke

Edited by Fukurou
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And the most important link: 

Takatoriki joins puro resu as the mad barber.

Edited by Benevolance
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On 1/13/2017 at 09:00, dingo said:

Hakuho might be near 100% of his aging, injury-nagged self. But he's far from the lean mean zensho machine of earlier times. 

That may be true, but he's still better than anyone else. 

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6 hours ago, Wakaebala said:

Also, I'm really looking forward to Ura's debut in Makuuchi. I'm not sure how high he's gonna rise, but I really think if he can stay in Makuuchi, he will force other rikishi to fight harder, and better. His way of sumo is very hard to find out, but really, very fun to watch. This year is going to be huge in Ozumo! :)

Methinks Ura in Makuuchi will be similar to Takamisakari - popular and the crowd love him because of the quirkyness and unpredictability, but probably never going much higher than the middle of maegashira. 

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3 hours ago, Fukurou said:

There was another scandal about a year earlier related to illegal gambling on baseball (IIRC, yakuza connections were involved)

In Japan all gambling is illegal outside a limited number of racing sports (Bicycle, motorbike, and a few others.) Bet on anything else, and you're committing a crime. The yakuza are, of course, involved in illegal gambling as a matter of course. I don't recall if they were in this particular case, but even if they were not the mere fact of rikishi making illegal bets would have been scandal enough.

There was a potential scandal earlier this year when some rikishi were thought to have been gambling with dice. From context I inferred it was among themselves, not involving anyone else, and the reason no action was taking is that it turned out no money had been involved.

 

Edited by Kuroyama

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5 hours ago, Fukurou said:

There was another scandal about a year earlier related to illegal gambling on baseball (IIRC, yakuza connections were involved) that led to a number of 1 and 2 basho suspensions. Ozeki Kotomitsuki was expelled, as was his oyakata, ex-Takatoriki. IIRC there were other oyakata who were demoted and something like 15-20 rikishi were suspended for 1 or 2 basho. Some of the current rikishi caught up in that include Goeido, Okinoumi, Toyohibiki, and Toyonoshima. Shohozan was suspended for 2 basho.

Looking around a bit ago I was reminded that this gambling thing happened about the same time as a crackdown on yakuza involvement in sumo. One of the big organizations (families?) was buying large blocks of high priced seats to guarantee they'd be seen on tv. The objective was to be seen and raise the spirits of their Boss in prison. The NSK, with its reputed long-time association with the yakuza got all embarassed when the police came to them about it. I don't think I'd have wanted to be the NSK official that had to tell the pinkie-less guys they couldn't have their tickets.

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Wow, Amuru beat Satoyama. Considering Amuru is literally only using 1 leg that is pretty impressive. 

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Watching the Basho live on television in Tokyo is pretty amazing! They even have the broadcast in English.

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1 hour ago, Rocks said:

Wow, Amuru beat Satoyama. Considering Amuru is literally only using 1 leg that is pretty impressive. 

I liked Satoyama toppling Amakaze, he acted very tired after he got back up haha.

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9 hours ago, Fukurou said:

There was another scandal about a year earlier related to illegal gambling on baseball (IIRC, yakuza connections were involved) that led to a number of 1 and 2 basho suspensions. Ozeki Kotomitsuki was expelled, as was his oyakata, ex-Takatoriki. IIRC there were other oyakata who were demoted and something like 15-20 rikishi were suspended for 1 or 2 basho. Some of the current rikishi caught up in that include Goeido, Okinoumi, Toyohibiki, and Toyonoshima. Shohozan was suspended for 2 basho.

Links (English)
Controversies in Professional Sumo
May 2011 Banzuke
July 2011 Banzuke

To clarify one thing, Kotomitsuki and ex-Takatoriki were not from the same beya, but Takatoriki (Otake-oyakata/beya) was a major player in getting Kotomitsuki (Sadogatake beya) hooked.

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1 hour ago, CT3* said:

Watching the Basho live on television in Tokyo is pretty amazing! They even have the broadcast in English.

I'm guessing you're saying that because you watched yesterday and heard John riveting insight and sharp wit??!! nudge, nudge, wink, wink

 

(Laughing...):-D

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Geek 2-6 and has 8-0 Kise tomorrow. Could this be the last match of their series?

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25 minutes ago, Jojo said:

I'm guessing you're saying that because you watched yesterday and heard John riveting insight and sharp wit??!! nudge, nudge, wink, wink

 

(Laughing...):-D

I'm watching a stream, but from a graphic they flashed earlier it's Doreen (aka Orion) commenting tonight.

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Arawashi pulling off the major upset! Hakuho's 28 match winning streak* against "hatsugao" opponents ended tonight!

 

(*If I heard the radio announcer correctly, if not I'll edit later)

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It happened so fast I didn't know how exactly Hak lost! There was tachiai, then both men spun around and around, then all of a sudden Hak was off the dohyo!

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11 minutes ago, WAKATAKE said:

Geek 2-6 and has 8-0 Kise tomorrow. Could this be the last match of their series?

Awful to see. Giku totally had him he just doesn't have the legs anymore. Sad. Easy win for Kise tomorrow.

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Hakuho lost!   Arawashi's only two wins in this basho coming via beating Yokozuna.   Kise thanks you, Ara.

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Just now, d_golem said:

It happened so fast I didn't know how exactly Hak lost! There was tachiai, then both men spun around and around, then all of a sudden Hak was off the dohyo!

Hakuho practically threw himself out. He swung Arawashi so hard but Arawashi hung on for dear life and Hak ended up out. Wild. 

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I'm gonna need to see a replay on youtube tomorrow to figure out what the hell happened. It was so fast, clash, spins, and then somehow hakuho is out of the dohyo

edit: clearly, Harumafuji withdrew because he feared the power of Arawashi, the yokozuna slayer

Edited by Rigel

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4 minutes ago, Rigel said:

I'm gonna need to see a replay on youtube tomorrow to figure out what the hell happened. It was so fast, clash, spins, and then somehow hakuho is out of the dohyo

See? See? I'm not the only one who went "What the??" *purple rain*

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12 minutes ago, Jyuunomori said:

MY GOD!

We have a badass over here. Please Arawashi, six more wins.

I think it's more likely he goes 2-13. The guy just stepped in it this basho.

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