Hatsu 2024 discussion (results)

[Akinomaki 40,821]

3 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Miyagino in the NHK announcer booth was certain he saw Ura's finger flick sand before Tobizaru's foot stepped out and I concur. Neither the gyoji nor shimpan agreed, however, so a flying Ura gets the win. 

Ura was dead flying anyway way before Tobizaru was out, but it was too late on the schedule for the only appropriate decision of torinaoshi

[Bunbukuchagama 774]

4 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Miyagino in the NHK announcer booth was certain he saw Ura's finger flick sand before Tobizaru's foot stepped out and I concur. Neither the gyoji nor shimpan agreed, however, so a flying Ura gets the win. 

Tobizaru got robbed.

[Bunbukuchagama 774]

16 minutes ago, Chartorenji said:

Kirishima is 10-0 versus Kotonowaka, good chance he remains level with Terunofuji. (If Teruno beats Kotonowaka here ofc.)

Kotonowaka still has a hard ceiling. 

[Katooshu 3,335]

3 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

Ura was dead flying anyway way before Tobizaru was out, but it was too late on the schedule for the only appropriate decision of torinaoshi

Dead while he was in the ring and pushing Tobi? I disagree - for me the questions was about the finger and I couldn't make it out with the quality of video I had.

Edited January 26, 2024 by Katooshu

[Leoben 146]

Quite an anticlimactic end to the day imo.

[Akinomaki 40,821]

With Dad not there to initiate the promotion process (I guess Fujishima has that task now as well as the shift), the grandson may need a play-off appearance to get promoted - and Kirishima as well

- and I expect there will be none

Edited January 26, 2024 by Akinomaki

[Jakusotsu 6,052]

10 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

Ura was dead flying anyway way before Tobizaru was out, but it was too late on the schedule for the only appropriate decision of torinaoshi

Nonsense. There was plenty of time left.

[Hankegami 537]

30 minutes ago, Chartorenji said:

Kirishima is 10-0 versus Kotonowaka, good chance he remains level with Terunofuji. (If Teruno beats Kotonowaka here ofc.)

You rang?

Anyway, Terunofuji looked dominant against Kotonowaka. I was low-key expecting a rematch of their last F2F in May 2023, when KNW gave a huge run for his money to Teru. This time he was immediately yorikiri'd out instead. Of course, it's 99% because Teru got a much better grip, but still KNW is no lightweight.

Now, the round robin will go on to Day 14. Like many others here, I also foresee a Kirby vs. Koto & Teru vs. Hosh. Sumo Database is not available as I write (too many people getting in?), but I'm positive that Koto and Hosh are the dark horses for this pairing. Kotonowaka has not won against Kirishima in a while - he even lost in Nagoya, when Kirby was nursing an injury -, while Terunofuji used to make quick work of Hoshoryu. Given what we've seen today, the likeliest upset can be made by Kotonowaka, who would put his Ozeki promotion in danger if he drops a third one (Kirishima is in a much similar situation, though, just one rung higher). Teru, instead, showed today that he's still the boss of the ring and looks like a safer bet for respecting his previous records. But never say never. Anyway, a win from Terunofuji and Kirishima would give us a nice not-actually-a-playoff situation on Day 15.

One rung below, the fight for a san'yaku spot is still very open. Wakamotoharu is the only guaranteed comeback. Atamifuji kept his hopes for occupying the second spot alive, courtesy of Kinbozan (nice henka, Kinbo). Abi, Tobizaru, and Nishikigi are all 7-6 and will certainly do the impossible to win out and put up a claim for that spot. Down at M7w, a returning Asanoyama is also lurking out for an upset claim from the rear. Things could be spiced up with a Kotonowaka promotion to Ozeki (still possible with a 12-3), in which case WMH will get his old Sekiwake spot back, and the race for Komusubi will have two spots to give instead of one.

20 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Miyagino in the NHK announcer booth was certain he saw Ura's finger flick sand before Tobizaru's foot stepped out and I concur. Neither the gyoji nor shimpan agreed, however, so a flying Ura gets the win. 

I found that decision, well, not much agreeable. Shortly before they deemed Shodai vs. Tsurugisho a torinaoshi (and Shodai lost the rematch) because - I believe - Shodai was flying while executing his technique. No matter that Tsurugisho landed first by ages. Now Ura flies while, uh, flying (a nice barrel round, 10/10) but he wins because Tobizaru stepped out first. Even the crowd was chanting for a torinaoshi. Color me surprised.

Edited January 26, 2024 by Hankegami

[Kaninoyama 1,818]

I could be wrong, but it seems like mono-iis have been quite few and far between this basho, at least in Makuuchi. Not that that's a bad thing. 

Edited January 26, 2024 by Kaninoyama

[Bunbukuchagama 774]

19 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Dead while he was in the ring and pushing Tobi? I disagree - for me the questions was about the finger and I couldn't make it out with the quality of video I had.

Ura was airborne.

[Katooshu 3,335]

Is airborne automatic dead now? When you're in the dohyo and have your arms extended pushing a guy?

Hardly a situation where someone leaps out of the dohyo, performing no actual sumo technique on the opponent, to avoid touching first. 

Edited January 26, 2024 by Katooshu

[Bunbukuchagama 774]

Just now, Katooshu said:

Is airborne automatic dead now? When you're in the dohyo and have your arms extended pushing a guy?

Ura flied parallel to the ground. It's not a position you can recover from.

Since everyone is used to his acrobatics (win or lose), shimpan seem to consider it normal.

[Katooshu 3,335]

He was driving Tobizaru back and with arms extended managed to push him out of the dohyo before Tobi could throw him out; simply being in the air isn't a loss. He did not jump backwards vs a forward moving opponent like Shodai vs Tsurugisho, like Ichiyamamoto vs Tobizaru, or like himself vs Kotonowaka a few basho ago.

We also regularly see forward moving rikishi push out opponents before falling on their face and it's called oshidashi, not a dead body loss, and it's uncontroversial.  

The hand should've been the only issue - clearly that came close to touching.

Edited January 26, 2024 by Katooshu

[Katooshu 3,335]

Day 14 is up

https://www.sumo.or.jp/EnHonbashoMain/torikumi/1/14/

[Terunoshoryu 11]

Just now, Katooshu said:

Day 14 is up

https://www.sumo.or.jp/EnHonbashoMain/torikumi/1/14/

You so fast!

[Jakusotsu 6,052]

8 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Day 14 is up

https://www.sumo.or.jp/EnHonbashoMain/torikumi/1/14/

Is this really the best they could come up with after all this time? The first half looks like a mess.

[Akinomaki 40,821]

I don't know what took them so long - there was nothing important to decide

[Bunbukuchagama 774]

1 minute ago, Akinomaki said:

I don't know what took them so long - there was nothing important to decide

They needed to find a way to screw me in all the games - and succeeded by scheduling Atamifuji against Asanoyama. 

[Katooshu 3,335]

Half Canadian Itadaki has retired 

 

[Akinomaki 40,821]

56 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

Nonsense. There was plenty of time left.

The last bout was 3 minutes before the end of NHK time - that's not plenty

[Jakusotsu 6,052]

This is what I would have done in the first half (don't mind the order):

Churanoumi (M13e, 5-8) - Shonannoumi (M6w, 3-10)
---
Mitakeumi(M9e, 5-8) - Kotoshoho (M14e, 8-5)
Meisei (M9w, 8-5) - Oho (M11w, 8-5)
Tamawashi (M10e, 8-5) - some guy from above
Sadanoumi (M10w, 6-7) - Onosho (M14w, 8-5)
Tsurugisho (M11e, 7-6) - Takarafuji (M16e, 5-8)
Takanosho (M12e, 8-5) - Shimazuumi (M17e, 9-4)
Myogiryu (M12w, 4-9) - Tomokaze (M15e, 4-9)
Endo (M13w, 4-9) - Bushozan (M16w, 4-9)
Onosato (M15w, 9-4) - some Juryo guy

[Jakusotsu 6,052]

1 minute ago, Akinomaki said:

The last bout was 3 minutes before the end of NHK time - that's not plenty

Only because they had a lot of surplus rounds throwing salt.

Edited January 26, 2024 by Jakusotsu

[Akinomaki 40,821]

First time kachikoshi since his marriage last May for Nishikifuji

Already the return has paid off for Asanoyama, if he gets rid of the other contestants, even sanyaku is in reach

[Akinomaki 40,821]

15 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

In the old days. we used to call Kotooushuu Osh.. I called him that to his face, he didn't like it.

The problem with Osh and Hosh is not that the last vowel is missing, but that the first one gets improperly shortened. Hak and Kak are perfect, but for Shoryu II, Housh or Hosher are no solution either.

[Seiyashi 4,108]

1 minute ago, Akinomaki said:

The problem with Osh and Hosh is not that the last vowel is missing, but that the first one gets improperly shortened. Hak and Kak are perfect, but for Shoryu II, Housh or Hosher are no solution either.

This is probably Kinta's joke, but it ain't kosher to call him Hōsher? 

(Sorry )