Basho Talk - Kyushu Basho 2015 +++ Spoiler Alert! +++

[torquato 1,075]

He has also said that he wants to reach 36 yusho to "equalize" his old man's 6 bokh national championships. Now what?

Edit: Actually, I don't remember those statements you claim he has made. Link, please?

I’m not sure where to find the links. It was YT vids. I remember one of them was of Hakuhō talking about it while inside the car after the day’s bout. In general though he wasn’t sure what to do and I think he said it was his wife who told him to go for 36 yūshō to equalize his father (I may be wrong on that). Sorry but I have only my memory to go on, don’t know how to find the vids again.

And from this piece of video (that you have no idea where it is - or actually VIDS, so you should have no problem finding at least one, but you won't) you deduced he has no motivation to do sumo anymore? And you say he has been saying that for months?

He never said anything remotely similar. I challenge you to show me anything near that. Because even if that's what he thinks, he will never say that. That's the part about Sumo you don't fully comprehend. A Yokozuna will never say that. Saying this kind of stuff leads usually to retirement.

Well, I can 'confirm' a story along that line. However, only by memory. Hakuho said something about not being fully motivated after achieving something and that he felt very grateful to his wife, who supported and remotivated him. Im absolutely sure I have read this here in this forum some time ago. It could have been uterly unreliable gossip talk, a quote from a Japanese paper or in a YT video interview. I can't remember, But I remember reading this here in the forum before.

However, I don't think that it is a valuable argument for anything anyway.

[Pandaazuma 1,310]

Impossible to claim yaocho when one is not in possession of all the facts...as we aren't. No one except Hakuho knows how he is feeling and how good or bad his real physical condition is. People who say it was a foregone conclusion that Hakuho can easily beat a man with one leg have no idea what they are talking about...Teru had already beaten seven strong, professional rikishi before yesterday with one leg.

Speculation is fine...but without all the facts it will invariably be wrong. Personally I think Rando's 4×9 theory is more accurate! ;)

[hamcornheinz 839]

He wouldn't stretch it for three minutes.

He didn’t, Terunofuji did. Hakuhō was simply defending to make it look legitimate, and Terunofuji took his time to do attacks.

All you wrote is total nonsense and comes from the theory that Hakuhou can't lose if he doesn't want to.

No, it comes from the theory that Hakuhō could’ve easily attacked many times during the bout, but never did. That’s really the one thing that looks fishy to me. Watching the bout, I thought there were plenty of opportunities for Hakuhō to win it, so I’m confused as to why he didn’t even try. I don’t think Teru-Kak was yaochō yesterday (Teru did a nice hatakikomi) and I’m usually not one for conspiracy theories.

As I have written so many times before, there are internal Mongolian rikishi politics that you know nothing of. Hakuhou would not give Terunofuji (or Harumafuji) the time of day, let alone let them beat him.

I’ve read this many times before, but if nobody explains them to me, I can not know…

I'm guessing you are a Hakuhou fan.

Mainly, but I’m a fan of many. Harumafuji’s and Terunofuji’s both.

Edit- Hakuhou was very lucky this basho to not reach this point with 4 losses at least. He has not trained and has not recovered from his injury.

This is actually an interesting point. I’m aware he was injured and couldn’t train very well, but he’s looked pretty good so far in this basho; you could say that the yaguranage against Okinoumi was a sign of weakness (he was pushed back), but I’d say the contrary– it takes a lot of strength to pull off something like that, something an injured rikishi shouldn’t be able to do.

Sorry if this is considered OT/spam.

why would you think Hakuho had many opportunities to attack? Terunofuji was leaning on him, which meant he had a greater force to overcome if he wanted to push, which leads to opportunities to being thrown. At the same time if he pulled back and tried to throw, he was vulnerable to getting pushed out by someone who is much stronger. Terunofuji knows this, and is only looking for Hakuho to initiate a pull back, and force him out. And thats exactly what happened, textbook sumo. So why don't you think a bit more about what you're saying before you say it?

[ALAKTORN 346]

And from this piece of video (that you have no idea where it is - or actually VIDS, so you should have no problem finding at least one, but you won't) you deduced he has no motivation to do sumo anymore? And you say he has been saying that for months?

Yes. He’s been saying that he accomplished what he wanted to do and had no goal anymore, felt lost. Then the thing about tying his father’s 6 championships came about as a new goal to reinvigorate him. But I don’t think it really did.

He never said anything remotely similar. I challenge you to show me anything near that. Because even if that's what he thinks, he will never say that. That's the part about Sumo you don't fully comprehend. A Yokozuna will never say that. Saying this kind of stuff leads usually to retirement.

Well, you can choose to believe whatever you want. I probably heard it in one of the vids Akinomaki posts after-basho, but I’m not willing to go look through all of the vids he’s posted just to find one where Hakuhō mentions this.

[Treblemaker 254]

Then again, after watching Joe Hart screw up in the Manchester City goal yet again, I get the point of $h!t happening.

I digress a bit here, but which goal did Joe Hart screw up in? All I saw was Demichelis and Mangala got handed an ass whoopin' by two tiny Brazilians.

The man's frustrating. Makes a fingertip save one minute. Let's the Titanic in between his legs the next.

[Dapeng 236]

Hakuho's loss to Harumafuji was a real one: Harumafuji henka-ed and was very fast. After losing this one and seeing Shohozan's potential in winning this basho, Hakuho made a very clever decision: to stay away from the game.

Harumafuji really wants to win this basho because he hasn't yusho-ed for more than 2 years. The problem is, the Japan-borns haven't yusho-ed for more nearly 10 years, and now Shohozan is very near!

Shohozan will beat Ami today, but will Harumafuji give Shohozan a playoff and let him win the basho?

[Treblemaker 254]

Ok, I would like forward the motion of putting all this stuff to bed and save the energy for the excitement of the final day. Any seconds?

Edited November 22, 2015 by Treblemaker

[d_golem 213]

Ok, I would like forward the motion of putting all this stuff to bed and save the energy for the excitement of the final day. Any seconds?

All this stuff IS fueling my excitement for the final day and I only read them :-D

[Hakuhonofan 334]

Well, I can 'confirm' a story along that line. However, only by memory. Hakuho said something about not being fully motivated after achieving something and that he felt very grateful to his wife, who supported and remotivated him. Im absolutely sure I have read this here in this forum some time ago. It could have been uterly unreliable gossip talk, a quote from a Japanese paper or in a YT video interview. I can't remember, But I remember reading this here in the forum before.

However, I don't think that it is a valuable argument for anything anyway.

It's this one :

I am the Yokozuna, on 25 Jan 2015 - 03:44, said:

Hakuho in his yusho interview admited to have thought about intai in the two days after he has won the 33rd cup. He thanked his wife, which I hear for the first time. Said he has not stopped working a single day since progressing to Yokozuna rank. But says that he has not drained himself psychologically so intends to carry on.

Link of post : here

33rd yusho interview :

About planning to reach 36 yusho like his dad, link from Nikkan Sports here

[Arashifuji 10]

Ok, I'm new to this thing, but considering:

1. Hakuho's lack of training because of injury (oh my God! Terunofuji wasn't the only one banged up on that dohyo!)

2. That Hakuho must be really tired after 13 days of basho, and always fighting with a target on his forehead (because he is the über-dai-greatest-of-all-time-Yokozuna).

3. That Hakuho was obligated to show his greatness all over again after an injury (quite a rare situation in his career), to moot any kind of speculation like: "yeah, he is done, the king is dead". And there is nothing that makes people crazier than the fall of a giant.

4. Terunofuji's motivation to put any kadoban chances to rest.

5. The fact that Terunofuji is not the kind of fella that is simply blown away off the dohyo in his bouts.

6. that Terunofuji was leaning all over Hakuho for a couple of minutes with all his humongous body mass (that did not shrunk just because his knee is bad).

7. That Hakuho losing puts the cup in Ama's hands. The tournament math is not forgiving for any setups.

Sorry if I look like a Hakuho fanboy here (I'm not, but it's hard not to admire the achievements he got, and his amazing consistency throughout all those years), but those circumstances above make any yaocho way too far from likely.

In Brazil we have a saying that means like "I don't believe in witches, but sure they exist!". In this case, the witch is just too ugly to exist.

[littlebutts 14]

Props to Hakuho for discovering the secret to eternal life. Never getting injured or aging must be really boring on an existential level. Can't blame him for getting bored of fighting against all of these mere mortals...

This thread is getting a bit too sumotalk-y for my likes.

[Kuroyama 715]

Let's the Titanic in between his legs the next.

There are sooo many ways to interpret that...

[Kintamayama 45,570]

With all the conversations regarding the Hak/Teruno bout, there's little I can add, except for the knee-jerk reaction I had when I saw the video. Yes, a good long belt battle - the kind I haven't seen Hak in for quite a while - followed by what looked like an unusually graceful exit etc.

I am utterly shocked you still are looking for these "signs." Wow, ST is really powerful.

But I'm NOT looking for signs. Or Wonders. It simply LOOKED weird. That's all. As I had said, after watching Hak dance all basho long, it's seemed very uncharacteristic that he APPEARED to be pushed out WITH WHAT APPEARED TO BE minimal resistance.

I'm shocked that you're shocked.

I'm double shocked now. Without noticing, your mind automatically sees things and knee-jerk translates that they "look" weird. Whereas my mind sees things and says "wow, he lost."

[Kintamayama 45,570]

And from this piece of video (that you have no idea where it is - or actually VIDS, so you should have no problem finding at least one, but you won't) you deduced he has no motivation to do sumo anymore? And you say he has been saying that for months?

Yes. He’s been saying that he accomplished what he wanted to do and had no goal anymore, felt lost. Then the thing about tying his father’s 6 championships came about as a new goal to reinvigorate him. But I don’t think it really did.

He never said anything remotely similar. I challenge you to show me anything near that. Because even if that's what he thinks, he will never say that. That's the part about Sumo you don't fully comprehend. A Yokozuna will never say that. Saying this kind of stuff leads usually to retirement.

Well, you can choose to believe whatever you want. I probably heard it in one of the vids Akinomaki posts after-basho, but I’m not willing to go look through all of the vids he’s posted just to find one where Hakuhō mentions this.

Yet you are willing to quote him as if it's true to make your central point that Hakuhou couldn't care less anymore?

[Kintamayama 45,570]

I really don't get why Shohozan didn't get put with an Ozeki yesterday or today, especially when they knew Kotoshogiku was out. Even Ichinojo would have made more sense. Although unlikely, if Shohozan gets to a playoff tommorow, it's going to look bad on the matchmakers.

Because at the time of the torikumi making Kotoshougiku was still in.

[inhashi 2,363]

Congrats to Shodai!!! \(*o*)/

[Pandaazuma 1,310]

Great effort from Ura...but Shiba was in control there.

[Irakusamaru 77]

Congrats to Shodai!!! \(*o*)/

You mean:

https://youtu.be/ZFPIgoPVMds?t=1m9s

Can't wait to hear his name called out in Makuuchi (especially by Kimura Keinosuke...)

[WAKATAKE 2,677]

Well, the non-Japanese yusho streak is now at a full 10 years.

[Masumasumasu 902]

Shohozan totally threw that match. He obviously wanted to scratch Aminishiki's back.

[kuroimori 1,634]

Shohozan for jun-yusho?

He needs to overcome major 7-7 wiliness from the Dai-Wily Aminishiki.

which is not an easy thing to do as we could witness a few moments ago.

Wiliness aside, this is maybe just another example of feeling the pressure of the home crowd put on the local hero to get that long desired japanese yusho.

[kuroimori 1,634]

Yoshikaze might have been beter off losing today...?

That ran through my head too.

Maybe it is too early in the morning for me, but could you please elaborate?

Goeido might take his sekiwake position... If he lost today, Goeido remains ozeki and Yoshikaze could have still gone KK tomorrow.

Goeido should win tomorrow against 8-6 Tochiozan and Yoshikaze takes Myogiryu's Sekiwake spot.

So Goeido won as expected, keeps Ozeki, but Yoshikaze losing against Ikioi makes Hatsu 2016 Sanyaku composition interesting.

Will Yoshikaze still move up to Sekiwake and Ikioi to Komusubi?

[hamcornheinz 839]

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn

gratz Harumafuji

Edited November 22, 2015 by hamcornheinz

[rhyen 1,846]

*feeling deliriously happy*

Congratulation to Harumafuji

Edited November 22, 2015 by rhyen

[Maguroyama 27]

Ok... that was confusing. "Everyone" lost, including Harumafuji. Who thus won... To think that Shohozan was just a win away from a yusho playoff...

And of course the embarrassing ozeki keeps his rank. I really think a kadoban ozeki should be demanded to win 10. Which Goeido never has done as ozeki...