Video Stream - Availability

[shumitto 418]

Many diehard fans in Japan who don't really even care that much about the upper divisions, watch the lower ones on the feed so they can see the wrestlers they like. This is a bad move all around.

I am not in Japan and don't consider myself a diehard fan at all but my focus has considerably switched to the lower divisions in the past few years - including Juryo, specially the bottom half. I can still watch makuuchi on NHK but I'd rather see the veterans and the up-and-coming talents fighting for a place in the sun down in makushita and below.

I wouldn't hold my breath about a change in their pricing scheme happening anytime soon, but if I am not mistaken, UStream took over as live feed provider in Aki 13', which means we don't necessarily have to wait until next year to see a change take place.

Edited January 22, 2014 by shumitto

[Asameshimae 220]

If a lot more people will be watching NHK by whatever means, I highly recommend Sumo Digest, which is shown at around 2 am Japan time (but can vary by a few hours either way). It is only makuuchi, but it takes about 20 minutes to watch and gives you just enough lead in to each bout to make it exciting, with replays for the interesting bouts. I record and watch it relatively regularly.

Edited January 22, 2014 by Asanomeshi

[Kuroyama 715]

I'm not sure how it is in Japan, but how many people under 30 actually even watch TV on their TV anymore? In other highly technological countries like the US and Korea, TVs are primarily used by the young for displaying streaming services. They are going backwards, not forwards.

The young? I'm 50, and that's pretty much all we use the TV for in my house, aside from our DVD/BluRay library. I live in a deep valley so reception over the air is poor, and I don't pay for cable. I DO pay for Netflix (and soon Hulu) streaming services, and it's used constantly.

[Mark.Buckton 68]

Personally, I would love to see it on something like ESPN3. There's cricket matches, rugby, Australian rules football, sailing, curling, judo, etc. on there, why not sumo?

the fee / rights - and the fact that the kyokai have been ripped off by many foreign sources - including American based ESPN agent this basho!

Perhaps they are fed up giving stuff away?

I don't know what their structure for fees and rights are, but surely there's something out there that can bring the sport of sumo to a larger audience at a reasonable price. I find your statement that the fees are too high to be dubious, given the other content on ESPN3. Surely the budget for the UK Darts Federation(or whatever) cannot be that much higher than that of the Sumo Federation. And I've seen darts on ESPN3.

The more insular, paranoid, backwards, and technologically irresponsible the powers that be are, the smaller their audience will be, and the smaller their revenue will be. They are killing their own sport.

I'm not sure how it is in Japan, but how many people under 30 actually even watch TV on their TV anymore? In other highly technological countries like the US and Korea, TVs are primarily used by the young for displaying streaming services. They are going backwards, not forwards.

And if you tell me that $10/day for sumo coverage is reasonable, I will laugh in your face and ask you what planet you're from.

first bold bit - ??? no idea what you mean.

second bit - pure speculation. Irrelevant.

third bit - TV is still huge in Japan

fourth bit - who said this and where?

and I'm not sure what you know, but ISDB-T in Japan compared to similar but less advanced systems in the US such as ATSC offers a multitude of interactive options for mobile devices, PABD and more. Whilst not directly affecting the choice of TV channels (to watch), and in that regard Japan is still very much reliant on terrestrial broadcasts as opposed to imported concepts of SKY or cable, these figures might help:

SKY in Japan offers 300 channels - 3.8 million subscribers.

WOWOW (similar but only 3 channels) - 2.56 million

That is less than 7 million interested in such options - from a population of 127 million. Six / seven percent?

There is just not the competition here - or couch potato population lifestyle found elsewhere for whom TV is such a crucial part of life - and that pushes prices down for the consumer. Whether things work or not for the NSK remains to be seen, but if you look at the bigger picture here that I will soon refer to in writing, they might be onto something as unpopular as that is here.

And let's be honest - the international 'outrage' currently consists of 136 members on FB, and not much else.

Edited January 23, 2014 by Mark.Buckton

[yade 14]

after a short break niji stream is now almost PERFECT! no sound delay , no stumble. Sound is very clear now. They must have changed something. This is like watching TV (well almost). I am very pleased now :)

they switched it back just before the last bout...... must have been a dump joke ( hey look what it COULD look like if we want to, but we dont........)

Edited January 23, 2014 by yade

[Manekineko 200]

My summary of results of "how much would you pay" poll...

[wolsonjr 1]

I had tried this also and after one error message the stream displayed fine in vlc with this address. The recording to mp4 was fine. I also for the first time began to dig into the command line features, because I want the recording to start automatically when my PC is switched on (preferably by someone else to do this at the time the broadcast starts, when I am not yet there) - I can't find another way than a batch file in autostart with some lines like Torquato showed.

So far I tried this, but it won't work

cd "C:\Program Files (x86)\VideoLAN\VLC"

vlc rtmp://202.131.233.170/live/ubslive2009 --sout"#duplicate{dst=standard{access=file,mux=mkv,dst='C:\Users\aki\Videos\mongol.mp4'},dst=nodisplay}"

If you're on a PC it should be vlc.exe. And why not in one line "C:\Program Files (x86)\VideoLAN\VLC\vlc.exe"?

I couldn't open the adress rtmp://202.131.233.170/live/ubslive2009 directly in VLC.

On unix/ linux the comandline tool 'rtmpdump' does the trick. I just tried it.

rtmpdump --live --rtmp "rtmp://202.131.233.170/live/ubslive2009" - | vlc -

Sure there will be an equivalent on Windows....

I rather like to have a not that long line (and used that from the online help), ".exe" is not necessary. Using just:

vlc rtmp://202.131.233.170/live/ubslive2009

in the .bat file starts the stream at once, but no recording: the --sout part seems to be the problem. I may try rtmpdump for windows, together with rtmdumphelper that sounds to be good solution.

I can't stay up all night so I record it. Thanks for the help with rtmpdump. My recording script (Linux) has start and stop timers and saves the output as below, directly. I watch the next morning (Illinois US) in mplayer, but it should play on VLC, SMPlayer, or any decent video program I should think.

rtmpdump --live --rtmp rtmp://202.131.233.170/live/ubslive2009 -o /my_tmp_dir/sumo.flv 2>/dev/null &

[Asojima 2,874]

Now that we have experienced a full basho with the pay-per-view stream, it would be interesting if forum members who subscribed to the service would provide details and an evaluation of the experience. Video/sound quality, availability/usefulness of delayed video, chat and social stream content, etc.

[Asashosakari 20,213]

Now that we have experienced a full basho with the pay-per-view stream, it would be interesting if forum members who subscribed to the service would provide details and an evaluation of the experience. Video/sound quality, availability/usefulness of delayed video, chat and social stream content, etc.

Bump...anybody?

[Masumasumasu 902]

Now that we have experienced a full basho with the pay-per-view stream, it would be interesting if forum members who subscribed to the service would provide details and an evaluation of the experience. Video/sound quality, availability/usefulness of delayed video, chat and social stream content, etc.

Great quality. Available. Useful. Social.

It beats sitting on my ass!!

[kuroimori 1,634]

Well, not too many faithful NSK followers / turned customers hanging around SF I guess.

On the same note, I really wonder if the NSK already cared to have a look at the revenue generated during the first pay-per-view basho, especially if the numbers are anywhere near to what they expected (if they or UStream set any target at all).

I guess it is difficult if not impossible to find any information on that topic...

[Mark.Buckton 68]

On the same note, I really wonder if the NSK already cared to have a look at the revenue generated during the first pay-per-view basho, especially if the numbers are anywhere near to what they expected (if they or UStream set any target at all).

I guess it is difficult if not impossible to find any information on that topic...

have you asked? Both agencies far more approachable than many think.

[kuroimori 1,634]

On the same note, I really wonder if the NSK already cared to have a look at the revenue generated during the first pay-per-view basho, especially if the numbers are anywhere near to what they expected (if they or UStream set any target at all).

I guess it is difficult if not impossible to find any information on that topic...

have you asked? Both agencies far more approachable than many think.

hmmm, my impression was they (NSK) don't like to be approached - at least not via FB, neither in English or Japanese...

no response or statement whatsoever - so far, maybe you know more and care to share...?

[Mark.Buckton 68]

On the same note, I really wonder if the NSK already cared to have a look at the revenue generated during the first pay-per-view basho, especially if the numbers are anywhere near to what they expected (if they or UStream set any target at all).

I guess it is difficult if not impossible to find any information on that topic...

have you asked? Both agencies far more approachable than many think.

hmmm, my impression was they (NSK) don't like to be approached - at least not via FB, neither in English or Japanese...

no response or statement whatsoever - so far, maybe you know more and care to share...?

FB is an SNS - how many major sporting associations answer fans that way? Some may use FB as a PR tool but I am not aware of any who answer individual comments (but of course I have not checked too many).

With regards to (my) bold - your own question / that posed by another?

I have spoken to / exchanged mails on this with both the NSK and Ustream and will be using that information in a piece later this month. Mentioned it briefly in an article out yesterday too.

[Mark.Buckton 68]

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/2014/02/03/voices/tokyo-what-do-you-make-of-the-japan-sumo-associations-decision-to-charge-fans-120-to-watch-live-tournaments-online/#.Uu_5USgijzI

perhaps of some interest.

[kuroimori 1,634]

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/2014/02/03/voices/tokyo-what-do-you-make-of-the-japan-sumo-associations-decision-to-charge-fans-120-to-watch-live-tournaments-online/#.Uu_5USgijzI

perhaps of some interest.

thnx!

how nice if there were an easy 1-click polling tool as well, like ESPN has it - just a thought.

[Mark.Buckton 68]

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

Mentioned this and the issue of Ustream / the PPV concept / Mongolian TV in a piece out last Friday or Saturday. More on it mid-Feb but a larger story brewing at the moment that might take precedence.

[Mark.Buckton 68]

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/2014/02/03/voices/tokyo-what-do-you-make-of-the-japan-sumo-associations-decision-to-charge-fans-120-to-watch-live-tournaments-online/#.Uu_5USgijzI

perhaps of some interest.

thnx!

how nice if there were an easy 1-click polling tool as well, like ESPN has it - just a thought.

this does exist on comments made.

[kuroimori 1,634]

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

Mentioned this and the issue of Ustream / the PPV concept / Mongolian TV in a piece out last Friday or Saturday. More on it mid-Feb but a larger story brewing at the moment that might take precedence.

tip of the iceberg...? ;-)

another wave should come at the start of the Haru basho

as I am not a tweeter, I have no idea about the activity there.

Maybe someone can sum up what happened?

[Mark.Buckton 68]

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

Mentioned this and the issue of Ustream / the PPV concept / Mongolian TV in a piece out last Friday or Saturday. More on it mid-Feb but a larger story brewing at the moment that might take precedence.

as I am not a tweeter, I have no idea about the activity there.

Maybe someone can sum up what happened?

seen absolutely nothing on twitter and I follow a fair few sumo types.

[Benevolance 2,534]

Maybe someone can sum up what happened?

You missed Osunaarashi lamenting the shuttering of Araibira's channel. But he was the only 'official' sumo type to make any complaints. I think the rest knew better than to step out of line. With a quick #sumo search you could find a lot of angry conversations peppered with the usual commentary about the matches once everyone found the Mongol station. The most frequent complaints I saw were J-League baseball streams are cheaper than the basho pricing model. But I have no idea if that's actually true, as I don't live in Japan. If Haru starts at its the same song and dance, the hens will probably be a-clucking once more.

But Ustream's TOS meant nothing could be changed after the basho started. So we'll see what happens for Haru. I'd be curious to hear what the numbers were from Ustream. Total number of subscribers, number of repeat subscriptions (if people bought more than one day, but not the package), which days were popular. And how they compared overall to other PPV events on UStream.

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

It's one platform. Gotta have a facebook account to join the group. And even this place is pretty dead for a month between tournaments. People only care about sumo when there is sumo to be watched.

I know two dozen people locally that are upset about the change, but they aren't going to suddenly join facebook just to join a group and complain. And with Canadian Olympic hockey soon to be underway, even the people normally interested in sumo around here aren't thinking about sumo; they're more concerned about who will replace Stamkos on the roster.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Benevolance

[Mark.Buckton 68]

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

Mentioned this and the issue of Ustream / the PPV concept / Mongolian TV in a piece out last Friday or Saturday. More on it mid-Feb but a larger story brewing at the moment that might take precedence.

462 signatures (English) on the ipetition araibira started (and I wonder how many commented on the NSK Facebook fan page...we must assume MB knows, as like most modern journalists he conducts the bulk of his research there).

So, if 5 people sign up for the full basho ....... Not quite 'Occupy'. ;)

Edited February 6, 2014 by Mark.Buckton

[Kintamayama 47,171]

So, if 5 people sign up for the full basho ....... Not quite 'Occupy'. ;)

(Whatever above, it is funny...)

Were the five who ponied up for Ustream friends of yours? What'd they say after they found out about the free stream elsewhere, and the cheaper paid options like Niji?

Niji is free, BTW. For now, at least.

[kuroimori 1,634]

Niji is free, BTW. For now, at least.

Ah, right. It was jpPlayer that was one of the cheaper paid options, along with cable and satellite television. :-)

well, in my case, NSK helped creating revenue at

- jpPlayer (2×10$ for 3 days, most JP TV and BS TV channels, very good video&audio quality)

and in a first panic driven move on shonichi also at

- KeyholeTV (5$ for 30 days, most JP TV channels at low-mid video & audio quality)

as well ad donations to Araibira & Moti:

UStream revenue: zero

NSK share from UStream: 50% of zero is.... 0 i guess

I even don't visit the new NSK website very often since they changed to the new tablet friendly setup, maybe except for kyujo updates for Gaming reasons...

Edited February 6, 2014 by kuroimori

[kuroimori 1,634]

think it also speaks volumes that until (earlier) today, just 157 people (unchanged since at least the 28th of Jan) had joined the Facebook site to bring back a free sumo stream.

Mentioned this and the issue of Ustream / the PPV concept / Mongolian TV in a piece out last Friday or Saturday. More on it mid-Feb but a larger story brewing at the moment that might take precedence.

462 signatures (English) on the ipetition araibira started (and I wonder how many commented on the NSK Facebook fan page...we must assume MB knows, as like most modern journalists he conducts the bulk of his research there).

So, if 5 people sign up for the full basho ....... Not quite 'Occupy'. ;)

playing around with numbers from a different angle:

462 x 10$ = 4,620$ of potential/expected revenue per day (6930$ at Day 15)

4, 620$ × 14 days + 6,930$ = 53,130$ for the whole basho

318,780$ for all 6 honbasho in 2014