Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) Summary for now, as some things are a bit unclear at this point, like what's Ex-Kasuganishiki's punishment.. The Kyokai has "advised" these rikishi to retire today: Makuuchi Tokusegawa Kouryuu Kasugaou Moukonami Juryo; Masatsukasa Asoufuji Sakaizawa Wakatenrou Kyokunankai Makushita: Kirinowaka Shirononami Sandanme: Yamamotoyama Ex-Kaihou (Tanigawa Oyakata) as well. Kitanoumi Oyakata, Kokonoe Oyakata and Michinoku Oyakata will resign from their riji posts and should be demoted two classes. Sandanme Enatsukasa who admitted to being the go-between was suspended for two years, and has announced his intention to retire. Edited April 1, 2011 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 Reactions: Ex-Kaihou: "This is idiotic. I was ranked close to Ex-Kasuganishiki at a certain time, so to blame me as well is funny. The committee's investigation was sloppy and I told them as much. It goes without saying that I intend to sue them!!" Yamamotoyama: "The investigative committee has found me guilty. I was told not to sue as the Kyokai will win anyway.. It's driving me nuts. They just kicked me out without even listening to my side of the story and that's really funny.. I never did any yaocho!!" Wakatenrou: ""Hearsay and my name appearing in some mobile mail got me kicked out, and I cannot accept that! I'm speechless. I have done nothing. I was told by the rijicho that if I'm not happy with the findings, I should sue." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryafuji 815 Posted April 1, 2011 So as these are "advised retirements" and not dismissals/expulsions, they will get severance pay and retirement benefits? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Harry 67 Posted April 1, 2011 What a black day for sumo... what a mess. Laugh or cry? I don't know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 So as these are "advised retirements" and not dismissals/expulsions, they will get severance pay and retirement benefits? AFAIK, yes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) Kasugaou: "I was advised to retire and I am seething with anger from the bottom of my heart. I never admitted anything and I'm in shock. The investigation was not undertaken properly. I was called for questioning three times but I really didn't understand what was being said.." Kirinowaka: "The investigation was not a fair one. The first thing I told them was that I did not do it. The rijicho told me to hand in my retirement papers by April 5th, so I said Ok..' Masatsukasa: "This is too funny.. The whole thing is too funny.. I was told by the rijicho that if I don't accept this punishment I will receive a worse one." Shimotori: "I said I did not do it. I was given a piece of paper with the reason and told of my punishment. I just hope my fans will believe me. As for my future actions, I will consult my shisho." Kotokasuga: "I don't agree with this." Asoufuji: "I don't agree with this. If you want the details you better ask the Kyokai.." Kiyoseumi: "I can't agree with this. There are rikishi who were deemed innocent just a few hours ago that are now on the list. I and the others of course have nothing to do with this. I have a lot I want to say.." Shirononami: "I can't accept this in any way. Is it this easy to fire someone from his job? I'd like us all to think together on our response to this." Sakaizawa: "I didn't get a chance to explain anything at the rijikai. I guess it was all decided in advance. I cannot accept this!" Tokusegawa: "They have no proof so what the?? I did not accept this. I don't hold a grudge against the Kyokai but I cannot accept the punishment!" Enatsukasa: "I'd like to apologize to all sumo fans. In order to reflect on my bad deeds, I told the committee everything I knew and cooperated with them. I have caused a lot of trouble for rikishi who are going all out and I am really sorry. After accepting the punishment, I have decided to retire." Chiyohakuhou: "I have caused a lot of trouble for the Kyokai and Kokonoe beya. What I would like to say is that it is really inexcusable ." Edited April 1, 2011 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) Final list of punishments for now: The Kyokai has "advised" these rikishi to retire today: Makuuchi Tokusegawa Hakuba Kouryuu Kasugaou Moukonami Kotokasuga Shimotori Juryo; Masatsukasa Asoufuji Sakaizawa Wakatenrou Kyokunankai Toyozakura Kiyoseumi Makushita: Hoshihikari Juumonji Kirinowaka Shirononami Sandanme: Yamamotoyama Ex-Kaihou (Tanigawa Oyakata) as well. 2 year suspension, presumably for admitting: Ex-Kasuganishiki- has asked to retire Chiyohakuhou- retirement papers accepted. Enatsukasa- will retire. Oyakata demotions: Kitanoumi Kokonoe Michinoku Ooshima Hakkaku Magaki Kiriyama Irumagawa Isegahama Hanakago Kasugayama Tatsunami Kasugano Onoe Kise Tokitsukaze Sadogatake (The last three demoted to jun- toshiyori for three years) Edited April 1, 2011 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 19,653 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) So, difference to the last rumour list: Sokokurai and Shimotori not in (or rather, not out), Hoshihikari added. But wait, Shimotori has a quote about his punishment...? BTW, last night's Mainichi suddenly added Gagamaru as a supposedly judged "black" rikishi, and also claimed that the committee still has additional information forthcoming and will reserve the right to add further punishment suggestions in the coming weeks. Edited April 1, 2011 by Asashosakari Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 So, difference to the last rumour list: Sokokurai and Shimotori not in ( Shimotori in-missed him on the list. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) And now, the alleged yaocho dates (all just one example): Makuuchi Tokusegawa-Aki 2009 day 11-against Kasuganishiki. Kyushu 2009-against Kasuganishiki. Hakuba- Nagoya 2009 day 8 against Kasuganishiki. Kouryuu - Kyushu 2009-senshuraku against Kasuganishiki Kasugaou - January 2010 Day 11 against Kasuganishiki Moukonami- March 2009 Day 2-against Kasuganishiki Kotokasuga - May 2010 - Day 14 against Kasuganishiki Shimotori- January 2009-Day 9 against Kasuganishiki Juryo; Masatsukasa- May 2010 day 8 against Kasuganishiki Asoufuji - January 2010 day 4 against Kasuganishiki, May 2010 day 13 against Kasuganishiki Sakaizawa- Haru 2010 day 12 against Kasuganishiki, May 2010 Day 1 against Kasuganishiki Wakatenrou- March 2019 day 4 against Chiyohakuhou, Day 8 against Kasuganishiki, May 2010 against Kasuganishiki Kyokunankai- January 2010 day 5 against Kasuganishiki, March 2010 day 14 against Kasuganishiki Toyozakura- January 2010 Day 7 against Kasuganishiki, March 2010 Day 13 against Kasuganishiki Kiyoseumi- March 2010 Senshuraku against Kasuganishiki, May 2010 day 3 against Kasuganishiki, January 2011 day 2 against Chiyohakuhou Makushita: Hoshihikari - May 2009 day 14 against Kasuganishiki, Nagoya 2010 day 7 against Kasuganishiki Juumonji - January 2010 day 6 against Kasuganishiki Kirinowaka- Kyushu 2009 day 9 against Kasuganishiki, day 11 against Chiyohakuhou Shirononami- January 2010 day 2 against Kasuganishiki, March 2010 day 9 against Kasuganishiki Sandanme: Yamamotoyama - January 2010 day 10 against Kasuganishiki, May 2010 day 4 against Kasuganishiki Ex-Kaihou - January 2010 day 13 against Kasuganishiki, March 2010 day 7 against Kasuganishiki 2 year suspension, presumably for admitting: Ex-Kasuganishiki -obvious Chiyohakuhou- Kyushu 2009, day 10 against Kasuganishiki, day 11 against Kirinowaka, March 2010 day 4 against Wakatenrou, January 2011 day 2 against Kiyoseumi. Enatsukasa - for being the intermediate on numerous occasions. Edited April 1, 2011 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilovesumo 12 Posted April 1, 2011 Now this is the "sweeping under the carpet"-move, quietly doing it - while Japan has some real problems... Great chance to kick em foreigners and Daigakusei out. Nobody of em ever understood tatakiage... This is it? Come on.... Some real investigation would have found out a lot more IMHO. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 19,653 Posted April 1, 2011 Great chance to kick em foreigners and Daigakusei out. Nobody of em ever understood tatakiage... Of the 15 punished sekitori, 8 are foreign or collegiate (53%). Of the 70 sekitori on the March non-banzuke, 40 are foreign or collegiate (57%). Yeah, this is totally a witch hunt against foreigners and college rikishi... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 (edited) I asked myself what will happen if a rikishi decides not to heed the Kyokai's retirement "advice'. I got an immediate answer from the rijicho himself. "Jomei or kaiko!, probably!" Gotcha. "Thiiis big!!" Edited April 1, 2011 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilovesumo 12 Posted April 1, 2011 Ahm - just asking - the date has nothing to do with all those news? After all it's April the 1st. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Babaryutaikai 1 Posted April 1, 2011 Ahm - just asking - the date has nothing to do with all those news? After all it's April the 1st. No. It was announced on the NHK news this morning (evening News 9 in Japan). There was even a correction because they put up an incorrect photo of one of the boys. :-( Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilovesumo 12 Posted April 1, 2011 Oh dear... Would have been Moti's greatest coup... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Washuyama 641 Posted April 1, 2011 With all those oyakata demotions, who the heck is going to run sumo? (Assuming there is sumo to run...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 Oh dear...Would have been Moti's greatest coup... The day ain't over yet here.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shumitto 418 Posted April 1, 2011 Some real investigation would have found out a lot more IMHO. By the results one might think they decided to kick out only the rikishi whose involvement has been more conspicuous and therefore proved (provable). The lesser guilty got away with some sort of free pass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintaro 7 Posted April 1, 2011 Black day indeed. I sure hope they got it right, but I need to be convinced. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jonosuke 28 Posted April 1, 2011 Just as most suspected, there was no hard evidence beyond those admitted. Basically a few guys saying the other 20 are involved. Just one hearsay after another that does not stand up in any court of law. Intentionally or non intentionally broken mobile devises or refusal to hand over such a devise is no proof of they committed yaocho as there may have been a variety of reasons some wanted to keep their call logs private besides the Kyokai has no right to do this as they have no police power. There is no proof and this has not resolved anything. However if the Kyokai is successful in following through with this, Ministry of EduSci will let them hold a basho but oh, at what price? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jaak 7 Posted April 1, 2011 Now that specific tainted bashos and matches are known: how many demotions out of juryo had been avoided in each basho? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 45,524 Posted April 1, 2011 Another reaction-Juumonji: "There is no proof, now is there.. I claimed I did not do it. No way I can agree to that. I'm mulling my next step." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryafuji 815 Posted April 1, 2011 Just as most suspected, there was no hard evidence beyond those admitted. Basically a few guys saying the other 20 are involved. Just one hearsay after another that does not stand up in any court of law. But this isn't a court of law; none of the rikishi are on trial. The Kyokai don't have to prove yaocho beyond a reasonable doubt. By being mentioned in those text messages they have brought sumo into disrepute and that's enough grounds for dismissal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sashohitowa 6 Posted April 1, 2011 The guilty rikishi are "advised to retire" -- this can be a move to ensure no (or, at least, less) law suits. It will be harder to sue, when they, formally, have retired themselves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
