Yaocho by mobile scandal-

[Jonosuke 28]

But this isn't a court of law; none of the rikishi are on trial. The Kyokai don't have to prove yaocho beyond a reasonable doubt. By being mentioned in those text messages they have brought sumo into disrepute and that's enough grounds for dismissal.

Oh they definitely will need to prove beyond whatever rasonable doubt.

The Kyokai took the publishers of weekly magazines to court whenever the magazines published articles claiming their rikishi committed yaocho. The Kyokai demanded the editors to produce solid evidence proving there was yaocho committed. They really cannot have it both ways.

Simply someone accusing them for committing yaocho was not good enough and the Kyokai won the case every time out but onus in now on them to do the same.

[Peterao 3]

Does anybody have any idea what the Kyokai's initial work contract with the rikishi looks like? Does it offer them any discretion in firing their employees that might cover a situation such as this?

Ahm - just asking - the date has nothing to do with all those news? After all it's April the 1st.

This is the era of "jishuku" self-restraint. Even Google Japan held back on their annual April Fools joke this year...

The guilty rikishi are "advised to retire" -- this can be a move to ensure no (or, at least, less) law suits. It will be harder to sue, when they, formally, have retired themselves.

Then they simply wouldn't retire, and receive the forced punishment instead.

Edited April 1, 2011 by Peterao

[alpineviolet 0]

With all those oyakata demotions, who the heck is going to run sumo? (Assuming there is sumo to run...)

I'm wondering this, too. How is this going to work? (In a state of confusion...)

[Peterao 3]

Demon Kogure has announced that he's taking over all of sumo's operations.

Picture from the press conference:

[Kuroyama 715]

Demon Kogure has announced that he's taking over all of sumo's operations.

That would... be a fantastic idea, actually.

The only problem is that his makeup scheme would become part of the rijicho's official costume a generation down the line.

[Kuroyama 715]

Just as most suspected, there was no hard evidence beyond those admitted. Basically a few guys saying the other 20 are involved. Just one hearsay after another that does not stand up in any court of law.

That's not really what hearsay means. If someone involved in it admitted to doing it, and described the circumstances and the others involved, then you need to make a decision about how credible he is compared to those who deny those things ever happened. But that's not hearsay.

A statement like "Yaochononishki told me that he took a dive in the bout with Yaochoyama at the 2009 Nagoya basho," would be hearsay with respect to whether or not the bout was actually thrown -- but it would be direct testimony of what was said; that the conversation between the witness and Yaochononishiki took place. Someone acting as a go-between might have no direct knowledge of what actually happened in any particular bout, but he would know what arrangements were made beforehand, and anything he had to say about those arrangements would not be hearsay.

Even if it was -- hearsay is often admitted in countries with civil law traditions such as France and Germany, where Japan derived its legal system from for the most part. It's common law countries like the US and the UK where hearsay is generally inadmissible, although even then there are exceptions. I know nothing about Japanese law specifically, but if it's anything like its European models the judge has fairly broad discretion about what he may consider in his decision.

Edited April 2, 2011 by Kuroyama

[Kintamayama 44,275]

Mainichi by Eddie Torial

[Peterao 3]

Mainichi reports that there are still 10 other "grey" rikishi under suspicion, but with not enough evidence to confirm or deny their yaocho involvement one way or the other. As the Ministry's condition for resuming running basho was a full accounting of the yaocho involvement, the investigation committee has not disbanded, and investigation of some sort or other will continue.

I think the question has changed from "Will they wrap this up in time to run Natsu Basho?" to "Will they wrap this up in time to run Nagoya Basho?"

Edited April 2, 2011 by Peterao

[Fujisan 530]

(In a state of confusion...) What a complete mess....

Edited April 2, 2011 by Fujisan

[Kintamayama 44,275]

24 hours after the Kyokai dropped its bombshell, two meetings were held in Tokyo. One by the Oyakata, one by the rikishi. 20-odd non-officer Oyakata, including 7 of the Oyakata who were punished, held their own meeting, where they voiced their displeasure over the punishments. They intend to hold a temporary hyogiin-kai meeting where they will be asking the rijicho for explanations. When asked if they will be offering any proposals, the newly appointed toshiyori-kai chairman Izutsu Oyakata said there was nothing concrete.

In another part of town, 20 of the guilty rikishi gathered at a restaurant. "We had something to eat, encouraged each other, and talked about stuff," said Ex-Kaihou. Some of them are discussing suing the Kyokai. "If they do that, there is a good chance that we may dig deeper and bring to light stuff nobody really wants to be known, so I hope they think about this, " said one investigation committee member. Still, three rikishi have declared they will be suing-Asoufuji, Masatsukasa and ex-Kaihou. Asoufuji has declared he will not hand in his retirement by April 5th, therefore possibly suffering the consequences of a dismissal without severance pay, or even "banishment"= jomei.

Yamamotoyama, Shirononami and Sakaizawa at the meeting:

Edited April 2, 2011 by Kintamayama

[Babaryutaikai 1]

24 hours after the Kyokai dropped its bombshell, two meetings were held in Tokyo. One by the Oyakata, one by the rikishi. 20-odd non-officer Oyakata, including 7 of the Oyakata who were punished, held their own meeting, where they voiced their displeasure over the punishments. They intend to hold a temporary hyogiin-kai meeting where they will be asking the rijicho for explanations. When asked if they will be offering any proposals, the newly appointed toshiyori-kai chairman Izutsu Oyakata said there was nothing concrete.

In another part of town, 20 of the guilty rikishi gathered at a restaurant. "We had something to eat, encouraged each other, and talked about stuff," said Ex-Kaihou. Some of them are discussing suing the Kyokai. "If they do that, there is a good chance that we may dig deeper and bring to light stuff nobody really wants to be known, so I hope they think about this, " said one investigation committee member. Still, three rikishi have declared they will be suing-Asoufuji, Masatsukasa and ex-Kaihou. Asoufuji has declared he will not hand in his retirement by April 5th, therefore possibly suffering the consequences of a dismissal without severance pay, or even "banishment"= jomei.

Yamamotoyama, Shirononami and Sakaizawa at the meeting:

If they went to that Mongolian Restaurant for the meeting, it must have been crowded. The place can barely hold 20 average-sized persons. Good food, though - really good, authentic Mongolian food.

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

Mainichi by Eddie Torial

Same same, but different...

No more sumo until bout-fixing rooted out

The Yomiuri Shimbun

Penalties meted out to many sumo wrestlers involved in bout-fixing must be a catalyst for eliminating this unseemly practice from the sumo world.

The Japan Sumo Association announced Friday that it had punished 23 wrestlers and sumo elders who had rigged bouts.

The penalties, including "a recommendation to voluntarily retire" and two-year suspensions from sumo tournaments, were imposed on 21 active wrestlers and two oyakata elders, who allegedly fixed bouts during their competitive careers. No wrestlers in the three ranks below yokozuna were among the 23 slapped with disciplinary action.

The punishments are harsh and effectively boot the offenders from the sumo arena. Oyakata of stables to which the tainted wrestlers belong also have been punished for failing to properly manage their proteges. The JSA this time has taken an uncompromising line on bout-rigging.

===

Investigations insufficient

However, we have doubts about the accuracy and exhaustiveness of the JSA investigation...

===

Face up to scandal

Sumo cannot exist without support from its fans. Bearing this in mind, the JSA should use the penalties handed out this time as a starting point for strengthening its efforts to prevent match-fixing...

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/dy/editorial/T110402002593.htm

[Peterao 3]

I personally will never believe that any yaocho investigation is complete until at least one ozeki, past or present, is implicated.

[Kintamayama 44,275]

So, who's sending in retirement papers and who's going for a trial? So far, Kasugaou and Kiyoseumi have said they will retire, through their shishos. The three Aomori rikishi Asoufuji, ex-Kaihou (although this morning he said maybe they should calm down and think this over..) and Masatsukasa have openly declared "war" and intend to sue. Mongolians? They are apparently split as to what to do. And a lot is at stake of course, with the severance pay etc..

Edited April 3, 2011 by Kintamayama

[Asameshimae 220]

If they do that, there is a good chance that we may dig deeper and bring to light stuff nobody really wants to be known, so I hope they think about this, " said one investigation committee member.

It would seem to me any suing going on would also very possibly uncover lots n lots of yaocho beyond the implicated wrestlers and elders. I would think the kyokai would be anxious to avoid a lawsuit. Of course, a lot of incriminating communications must have been disposed of on all sides, and even accused rikishi who might have liked to have this evidence as their final grenade won't have anything but their own word to prove yaocho is a lot wider than a small circle of wrestlers.

I have been distracted of late (you know the earthquake thing and all). Was there ever any news about whether all/most wrestlers' bank accounts were thoroughly investigated (looking for transactions between wrestlers)? I suppose if they were smart, any others who yaocho'ed would have used cash. Kasuganishiki seems to have been especially careless in this regard.

[Naganoyama 5,818]

Can anyone clarify what suspending an oyakata actually means?

[Peterao 3]

Can anyone clarify what suspending an oyakata actually means?

You take apart Hakuho's tsuna, tie the rope around the oyakata's ankles, then hoist him as high as he'll go.

Oh wait, April 1st is over with. Darn...

[Kintamayama 44,275]

"Soukokurai and Hoshikaze are not off the hook yet. They have been suspects for quite a while now. The investigation is continuing," said Mr. Fullmoon, a member of the committee. Next meeting-April 9th.

Soukokurai- "All I can do is to continue to say I am innocent!"

Hoshikaze - "I did not do it. I feel really bad about it!"

Gagamaru was also implicated at one point. Mr. Fullmoon: "We found no evidence that he is guilty."

Edited April 3, 2011 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 44,275]

The hyogiin-kai consisting of Oyakata and gyoji met today for more than four hours and debated the results of the investigations loudly and proudly, amid a lot of disagreements. Many demanded a reduction of the punishments and questioned the seriousness of the investigations.. After receiving some explanations from committee members on how the investigations went and what was unearthed, the voices quieted down somewhat. The Oyakata whose deshi were involved were naturally the ones asking the most questions "Do you think some testimony is enough proof?" and "Couldn't the Kyokai put up some resistance and argue with the committee regarding the punishments??" were the main questions thrown about. Then, demands were directed at the Kyokai brass headed by the rijicho to reduce the sentences. After the riji left, the Oyakata were left to discuss this amongst themselves, and the general atmosphere as they were leaving was that of agreement with the punishments.

At some point Onogawa Oyakata (ex- Kitazakura) got up and asked to clarify that he was never questioned or suspected, despite rumors to the contrary. The committee members there verified this, and said he was never under any suspicion whatsoever. "I have a family who were put in a delicate situation for no reason. I demand public clarifications and an apology!" he demanded.

Demanding job?

Edited April 3, 2011 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 44,275]

The sekitori also convened today at the rikishikai for more than three hours. The guilty sekitori were not there but most of the rest were. "We held an emergency meeting today and exchanged views. There were many different views. Run Spot run. As for myself, I will try to do my best to pull everyone after me." said the chairman Yokozuna Hakuhou. Asked if rikishi asked the Kyokai to reduce the punishments, he did not answer.

Hakuhou (are my glasses tainted??), KaioU (something doesn't smell right) at the famous Tokyo Metropolitan hotel where the meeting was held:

Edited April 3, 2011 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 44,275]

If they went to that Mongolian Restaurant for the meeting, it must have been crowded. The place can barely hold 20 average-sized persons. Good food, though - really good, authentic Mongolian food.

They did. It apparently belongs to Hakuba's mother.

[Kintamayama 44,275]

Can anyone clarify what suspending an oyakata actually means?

They are not suspended, they are relegated in class, each of them two classes. It means that an oyakata who was a riji like Kokonoe may find himself talking to old ladies at the KKan, or worse yet, guarding an emergency exit door. It's mostly a job thing, and maybe a salary cut, although I could not find anything regarding that.

[Asashosakari 18,670]

After receiving some explanations from committee members on how the investigations went and what was unearthed, the voices quieted down somewhat.

I have to admit, stuff like that makes me wonder if the whole "nearly everything is based on Kasuganishiki's testimony" notion is just a smokescreen, and other rikishi and Kyokai members did talk openly to the committee...

Then again: Notwithstanding their decisions to retire, given that Kasuganishiki and Chiyohakuho got away with two-year suspensions (though I wonder what that would have looked like for an oyakata), one would have to assume that any other whistle-blowers would have got off without a retirement demand, I guess. Hmm, could rikishi still escape punishment by starting to talk between now and April 5th?

[Treblemaker 254]

I personally will never believe that any yaocho investigation is complete until at least one ozeki, past or present, is implicated.

And I completely agree. Frankly, there's almost NO way someone reaches that level without SOME kind of slight-of-hand going on somewhere. This is perhaps absolutely a case of "Don't ask, Don't tell". With any REAL investigation, all kinds of skeletons would fall out of numerous closets. The fact that the Kyokai is choosing anally drastic measures with what appears to be incomplete testimony only speaks to the point that they want this over as soon as possible, for obvious reasons.

I said in the other forum, and I say here: Give everyone in the organization, from the top down, a polygraph test. Everyone. From Hakuho to the lowest Sandame. Test ALL Oyakatas (without exception), x-Yokozunas, everyone. You want a complete investigation? That's the way to do it. The technology today makes it almost impossible to escape reality. I think you'll find that at least 80% if not more of Makuuchi, including the sanyaku, have at one time or another dipped into the pool.

The findings, I think, will indicate that almost everyone in sumo has pulled this stunt, (and for many years) and with that, the reality will be that it was/is so commonplace that it is part and parcel of what sumo is.

If the Kyokai is going to hand out such harsh punishment, so be it, but put everyone on the same playing field. And I mean EVERYONE. From the guys in white cotton to the MIB.

[alaninjapan 18]

I personally will never believe that any yaocho investigation is complete until at least one ozeki, past or present, is implicated.

And I completely agree. Frankly, there's almost NO way someone reaches that level without SOME kind of slight-of-hand going on somewhere. This is perhaps absolutely a case of "Don't ask, Don't tell". With any REAL investigation, all kinds of skeletons would fall out of numerous closets. The fact that the Kyokai is choosing anally drastic measures with what appears to be incomplete testimony only speaks to the point that they want this over as soon as possible, for obvious reasons.

I said in the other forum, and I say here: Give everyone in the organization, from the top down, a polygraph test. Everyone. From Hakuho to the lowest Sandame. Test ALL Oyakatas (without exception), x-Yokozunas, everyone. You want a complete investigation? That's the way to do it. The technology today makes it almost impossible to escape reality. I think you'll find that at least 80% if not more of Makuuchi, including the sanyaku, have at one time or another dipped into the pool.

The findings, I think, will indicate that almost everyone in sumo has pulled this stunt, (and for many years) and with that, the reality will be that it was/is so commonplace that it is part and parcel of what sumo is.

If the Kyokai is going to hand out such harsh punishment, so be it, but put everyone on the same playing field. And I mean EVERYONE. From the guys in white cotton to the MIB.

do you actually want another tournament?