Amamaniac

Are Abi's days numbered?

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Posted (edited)

This reminds me of the Harumafuji scandal back in November (late-October to be precise) of 2017 where Harumafuji chose to tender his resignation before allowing the NSK to convene and pass judgement.  Many thought that if he had waited, he could well have been handed a punishment that did not involve hanging up his tsuna.  There seems to be a preference for these matters to get handled "out of court" so to say, so that the Kyokai/Rijikai doesn't look like the bad guy.  In other words, the Oyakata responsible for the wrestler who is the source of the trouble will encourage his deshi to fall on his own sword.

Edited by Amamaniac

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I really wouldn't say he's got no warning. If you mean "no warning about breaking COVID rules", maybe, but considering his cockups over the last year someone's probably already warned him that any more goofs would be big trouble. Not in very much sympathy with him at all, although I will agree the intai submission, while appropriate, comes a bit out of the blue. 

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Posted (edited)

So disappointing to learn this is transpiring. Not much to add that hasn’t been said already. Feels like a rather poor start to a day when many of us are still getting over basho withdrawals. Coming so close on the heels of Tochiozan’s retirement announcement makes it worse.

Edited by since_94

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It's not surprising, given that he put the entire organization, not to mention fans in attendance, at risk through his actions. 

The writing was on the wall the day this became public. Shikoroyama-oyakata happened to be doing NHK commentary that day and he was livid. He said: "yuruseru koto jya nai" (unforgivable)--words he wouldn't use lightly on live television.

I was a fan of the knucklehead and I'll miss him on the dohyo, but as they say in Japan: shikata ga nai. 

 

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I wonder what his wife makes of all this. She thought she was marrying a rising sumo star earning big Makuuchi bucks.

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2 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

It's not surprising, given that he put the entire organization, not to mention fans in attendance, at risk through his actions. 

The writing was on the wall the day this became public. Shikoroyama-oyakata happened to be doing NHK commentary that day and he was livid. He said: "yuruseru koto jya nai" (unforgivable)--words he wouldn't use lightly on live television.

I was a fan of the knucklehead and I'll miss him on the dohyo, but as they say in Japan: shikata ga nai. 

 

That's what you call a new avatar?  You must be a real Abi fan.  (Laughing...)

Unable to "quote"/show the fact that your avatar has turned bum up...

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Amamaniac said:

That's what you call a new avatar?  You must be a real Abi fan.  (Laughing...)

Unable to "quote"/show the fact that your avatar has turned bum up...

It's Abi teetering on the brink. 

Full replacement will come once he's officially out of sumo.

Edited by Kaninoyama
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Whether Abi is on the banzuke (or have a hole left for him) will presumably be apparent by the number of Juryo promotions.  It's not like there is either a dearth of candidates or surplus of them where we might see people overdemoted or hanging on with a demotable record.  They'll be pulling a 5-2 Ms4 who's even a former Komusubi, which isn't nearly an auto-promote or way less than what it normally takes.  If there are 4 promotions, Abi or a hole is on the banzuke.  If there are 5, he isn't.

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32 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

Whether Abi is on the banzuke (or have a hole left for him) will presumably be apparent by the number of Juryo promotions.  It's not like there is either a dearth of candidates or surplus of them where we might see people overdemoted or hanging on with a demotable record.  They'll be pulling a 5-2 Ms4 who's even a former Komusubi, which isn't nearly an auto-promote or way less than what it normally takes.  If there are 4 promotions, Abi or a hole is on the banzuke.  If there are 5, he isn't.

This answers that immediate question

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7 hours ago, orandashoho said:

Yes, but those were hardly 'hanging offenses', were they? Intai sounds like there are irreconcilable differences that could never come to right. Whereas I thought Abi was just being immature and irresponsible and could do with some lessons.

It seems to be coming from Abi himself (with a lot of support from his Oyakata..), just like Harumafuji at the time. When that happens, shikataganai.

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I wasn't a particularly big fan of Abi, but I was a big fan of Shikoroyama-san back was he was Terao, so I was very pleased for him to have such a promising deshi.

I'm disappointed that matters have come to such a head, but I'm way sadder for Shikoroyama than I am for Abi.

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31 minutes ago, RabidJohn said:

I wasn't a particularly big fan of Abi, but I was a big fan of Shikoroyama-san back was he was Terao, so I was very pleased for him to have such a promising deshi.

I'm disappointed that matters have come to such a head, but I'm way sadder for Shikoroyama than I am for Abi.

He has a big newcomer in Ouki who just got promoted to Juryo, so maybe that can cushion the loss somewhat.

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Just listened to Ross Mihara's day 4 commentary on NHK, and I think it sums things up nicely: "Like his (Abi's) personality, his sumo is on the wild side."

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Posted (edited)

Sad news about Abi offering an informal resignation. Obviously, what he did was dreadful and put not only his fellow wrestlers and the audience at risk, but the sumo tournament itself as well. No sporting event is guaranteed in times of coronavirus, let alone with audience, and if wrestlers or officials can't even follow their own rules it's entirely possible that the next one won't be allowed to happen. So it's understandable.

I'm still not 100% sure if the main driving force behind his retirement is the NSK itself or Shikoroyama, and whether, if it's the latter, he would've definitely been forced out as well had it just been up to just the NSK. I think it's fair to say most people who posted in this topic prior to the retirement offer expected lighter punishment.

I was hoping for him to be able to stay in sumo even though his actions were extremely stupid. Partly because of Tagonoura doing the same thing and getting off on a technicality. (You're never going to convince me that he "doesn't remember" whether it happened during the basho or not. Even if you drink yourself into a complete blackout, you'll understand you went out the morning after. It did happen during the basho and he's just afraid to say it.)

But also partly because the guidelines around coronavirus don't feel strict enough to me in general, with sustained active infections higher than first peak in April, new cases going up every day, and yet most of daily life goes on unimpeded. Schools and offices are full again, kids are playing sports, masks not required. I understand that sumo wrestlers are held to a higher standard because they're athletes and they're particularly vulnerable to the disease, and the rules were very clear, but still it somehow feels a little lopsided for Abi to have to resign for something that tons of people do every day who then go on to work the next day without a care in the world.

That said, I don't really disagree with the decision either. I'm sure we'll see Abi either joining MMA or pro wrestling soon. He'd make a great heel. (Pokingtheotherguy...)

Edited by dada78641
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Not sure how much this is a factor, but Abi screwing up in such a massive fashion was probably a good excuse to be done and rid of him.

Shikoroyama and the board can't think it's fun to have to pick up after his messes each time he screws up. He's proven to be a massive goof, and it probably was a matter of time before he screwed something else up, so why not just get rid of him when the golden opportunity proves itself?

His personality might be refreshing in an otherwise staid display, but Japan tends to love to hammer down the nails that stick out. For me though, his sumo just looked wild, chaotic and uncoordinated, with none of the deliberate purpose of old Takakeisho or Enho's deft movements. And I'll forever remember the epic ashitori against him. I don't see him as any great loss to the world of sumo from a personality or technical perspective, and if he's going to continue thumbing his nose at rules getting rid of him is the best course of action now.

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...anyone else not seen this yet? (Signofdisapproval...)

 

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Posted (edited)

Just watch it till the end

“Pot calling the kettle black” to NSK?

Edited by code_number3
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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, code_number3 said:

Just watch it till the end

calling the kettle black” to NSK?

Bollocks.By this logic, every single rikishi ever to be thrown out of sumo should not have been.  As for holding the basho with fans, well, nothing happened, so more bollocks again. Some condescending bollocks. 

Edited by Kintamayama
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20 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

Bollocks.By this logic, every single rikishi ever to be thrown out of sumo should not have been. Bollocks. As for holding the basho with fans, well, nothing happened, so more bollocks again. Some condescending bollocks. 

You can't know that nothing happened. It takes weeks before a contamination can be confirmed, the basho ended just days ago. 

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Yay, YouTube war! (Whistling...)

Honestly, you could easily give the impression of being slightly irate about Mr Gould's latest. 

Doesn't really matter how many rikishi are breaking or bending the rules, Abi broke the 11th Commandment... His fate may not be announced until tomorrow, but thing's is looking bleak.

Yeah, that disquietingly subdued audience, all wearing facemasks, all socially distanced, no one shouting or cheering, just polite applause; i.e. seen on TV to be obeying the rules. I agree, a load of old bollocks.

Have you seen Chris's vid today about the Shikihide rebellion? He more or less calls them snowflakes, which I really did not expect. Just part of his eccentric Englishman abroad schtick, I suppose.

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7 hours ago, dada78641 said:

(You're never going to convince me that he "doesn't remember" whether it happened during the basho or not. Even if you drink yourself into a complete blackout, you'll understand you went out the morning after. It did happen during the basho and he's just afraid to say it.)

If they really wanted to, they could have verified quite easily when the picture was taken. Read out the meta data of the image, and everything´s solved, every computer freak can do that. I suppose they don´t use analog cameras anymore... But perhaps that would have stirred up too much attention. 

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, orandashoho said:

You can't know that nothing happened. It takes weeks before a contamination can be confirmed, the basho ended just days ago. 

Right. and who exactly was forcing the fans to come at gunpoint? Shibatayama? If you're not feeling secure, don't go out. If you choose to go to public places and possibly contract the virus, it's on you. Baseball and soccer are being played as well. With fans. Where's the major catastrophe?  And the basho started more than two weeks ago. The first sick people should be in hospital by now.

Edited by Kintamayama

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6 minutes ago, RabidJohn said:

Yay, YouTube war! (Whistling...)

I am back to "not mentioning". Don't bait me.. And no YouTube wars. If I didn't start one when he directly attacked me in his famous tirade, I'm not going to start now. I am being specific-what he said about Abi is .. well, you know..

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2 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

Don't bait me.. And no YouTube wars. If I didn't start one when he directly attacked me in his famous tirade, I'm not going to start now. 

Ah, bugger! I missed that - or possibly completely forgot all about it...

Wouldn't have lit the blue touchpaper if I'd known/remembered there was some previous. (Oops!)

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