Sumo Reference Updates

[Gurowake 4,104]

57 minutes ago, Asashosakari said:

it was meant to be read Otachi, but he ended up going by Odachi

Is there ever a case of "rendaku optional"?  Like, I know in French liaison has some places where it's optional and different people have different styles that are seen as acceptable.  I personally don't care how you pronounce my last name because the way my family pronounces it is definitely "wrong" going back to the original Polish, so if you have some pronunciation that's justifiable, I don't care.

[Naganoyama 5,947]

9 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

...

FWIW, my very old (2007) edition of the all-time makuuchi rikishi directory also furiganas his shikona as おおだち Odachi, but it might be good to get verification from somebody with a more recent edition, just to make sure it wasn't revised as an error eventually.

...

My 2016 edition also has おおだち Odachi.

[Naganoyama 5,947]

The following birthdays are incorrect:

Toyonoshima - should be June 26, 1983

Kyokuhikari - should be July 6, 1976

Terunosato - should be January 17, 1978

 

[Asashosakari 19,653]

Not really a bug report at this stage, more a note to self and maybe others for further investigation: Today I stumbled upon a match in 1944 that ostensibly had Takasago-beya rikishi on both sides of the dohyo, which made me check if there are further cases in the DB. There are, quite a few in fact. I would guess that most (all?) of them are a matter of incomplete heya histories that obscure that two rikishi actually weren't in the same heya at the time of their torikumi, but that's going to require research into each case. For now, all heya for which the bout query turned up results other than playoff matches:

Dewanoumi - various sekitori matches from 1909 to 1940, then two lower division matches in 1966 and 1968 (with a common rikishi)
Futagoyama - three matches in 1982 with a common rikishi, two more in 1992 and 1994
Irumagawa - one match in 1913
Isegahama - one match in 1992
Isenoumi - three matches in 1968 and 1970, all with a common rikishi (Nagasawa = Kiyozakura)
Kitanoumi - one match in 1989
Kokonoe - one match in 1970, another in 1994
Kumegawa - one match in 1937
Minezaki - three matches in 1910 to 1912 with a common rikishi
Takasago - 15 matches with a common rikishi from 1925 to 1934, 8 more with another one from 1944 to 1947
Tatsunami - 14 matches from 1924 to 1928, all with a single common rikishi

Not sure what's going to be easier to investigate, the questionable sekitori matches of old or the more recent cases in the lower divisions.

(And last not least, one case that we know to be true and real: Asahiyama - a maezumo match in 2019, noted as a screw-up as it happened.)

Edited February 26 by Asashosakari

[Asashosakari 19,653]

An actual bug report: I believe that Wakanoumi's 1944.11 record is wrong. That tournament was one of three in which, for war-related reasons, only the sekitori matches were held in public while the makushita-and-under bouts took place behind closed doors and at an earlier time. That meant that the practice of makushita rikishi filling in for holes in the juryo schedule couldn't take place as usual, and such bouts ended up being extra performances for them. Can be seen in the results of the previous tournament, 1944.05, which had three such matches and the makushita wrestlers involved in them were the only ones to finish with 6-bout records:

Result	East	Rank	West	Result
3-3	Wakanoumi	Ms1	Mihamanada	4-2 ↑
3-3	Kuninobori	Ms2	Maenoyama	3-2 ↑
2-3	Honamiyama	Ms3	Kagamisato	3-2
3-2	Towadanishiki	Ms4	Sadamisaki	2-3
1-4	Aranami	Ms5	Futagoiwa	4-1 ↑

Now, for 1944.11 there were six matches with Wakanoumi involved in two of them, and while the other four rikishi again have 6-bout records, his score is currently listed as 4-1:

4-1 ↑	Wakanoumi	Ms1	Kagamisato	0-0-5
2-4	Kuninobori	Ms2	Towadanishiki	0-0-5
0-0-5 ↓	Kokura#	Ms3	Chikuozan	4-2 ↑
2-3	Ryugasaki	Ms4	Gotenyama#	2-3
4-2 ↑	Akisegawa	Ms5	Tochinoyama	1-4
1-1-3	Jinryu	Ms6	Honamiyama	4-1 ↑
3-3 ↑	Motoyoshi	Ms7	Otarunada	1-4

The Gans hoshitori website does have him at 5-2, FWIW.

[Asashosakari 19,653]

For Seihakuho his basho in maezumo is not marked as a new division high (unlike every other foreigner).

[Doitsuyama 1,192]

On 26/02/2025 at 19:23, Asashosakari said:

Not really a bug report at this stage, more a note to self and maybe others for further investigation: Today I stumbled upon a match in 1944 that ostensibly had Takasago-beya rikishi on both sides of the dohyo, which made me check if there are further cases in the DB. There are, quite a few in fact. I would guess that most (all?) of them are a matter of incomplete heya histories that obscure that two rikishi actually weren't in the same heya at the time of their torikumi, but that's going to require research into each case. For now, all heya for which the bout query turned up results other than playoff matches:

Dewanoumi - various sekitori matches from 1909 to 1940, then two lower division matches in 1966 and 1968 (with a common rikishi)
Futagoyama - three matches in 1982 with a common rikishi, two more in 1992 and 1994
Irumagawa - one match in 1913
Isegahama - one match in 1992
Isenoumi - three matches in 1968 and 1970, all with a common rikishi (Nagasawa = Kiyozakura)
Kitanoumi - one match in 1989
Kokonoe - one match in 1970, another in 1994
Kumegawa - one match in 1937
Minezaki - three matches in 1910 to 1912 with a common rikishi
Takasago - 15 matches with a common rikishi from 1925 to 1934, 8 more with another one from 1944 to 1947
Tatsunami - 14 matches from 1924 to 1928, all with a single common rikishi

Not sure what's going to be easier to investigate, the questionable sekitori matches of old or the more recent cases in the lower divisions.

(And last not least, one case that we know to be true and real: Asahiyama - a maezumo match in 2019, noted as a screw-up as it happened.)

I looked at all these cases and could clear up most of them, for rikishi who reached makuuchi the japanese wikipedia has a heya history, but sometimes with unclear time of the change - here the kabu history in sumo reference often was very helpful, leaving only a few debatable cases where I assumed the time of the heya change. Some lower division cases I could solve because they were obviously part of a bigger heya move and it's clear from the shikona convention which of the two involved rikishi moved. There still are some cases left where I have no clue, four with a single bout (Isegahama, Kitanoumi, Kokonoe and Kumegawa), the remaining case in Dewanoumi with two bouts and the Isenoumi case with one common rikishi in 3 bouts.

Edited March 3 by Doitsuyama

[Ripe 73]

On the List of Ozeki, Kotozakura is still listed as Kotonowaka... probably due to him fighting in 1st basho as Ozeki under that name and only changing it later (unlike most others who changed the name when becoming Ozeki).

[Jejima 1,414]

https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Rikishi_opp.aspx?r=12352&r2=12840https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Rikishi_opp.aspx?r=12352&r2=12840

This has the record as 2-1, but only two bouts shown.

[Tamanaogijima 765]

On 26/01/2025 at 18:46, Tamanaogijima said:

Edit: After a quick look into it it seems that everything from Hidenoyama branchout on is missing. The last change before that was Aoiyama->Iwatomo, which is in the list.

And just six weeks later the changes (branchout of Hidenoyama/Kotoshogiku and start-of-oyakata-life of Terunofuji) are finally uploaded. The last half year was so uneventful in terms of kabu babu that I had simply forgotten it again...

Edited March 9 by Tamanaogijima

[Asashosakari 19,653]

29 minutes ago, Reonito said:

Ms27e Toseiryu 2-0

hatakikomi 1-0

Ms28e Oshoryu 1-1

This seems to be a mistake in sumodb. I noticed it because Oshoryu fights Matsui tomorrow in the undefeated bracket. I rewatched the day 4 bout to make sure and Oshoryu won.

 

[Bunbukuchagama 770]

SumoDB continues to show Oshoryu as having a perfect 5-0 record on the Torikumi page; however, his  record is displayed as 4-1 everywhere else:

Day 1 tsukiotoshi Ms27w Yuma 0-1 (2-3) 1-0   Day 4 hatakikomi Ms27e Toseiryu 2-0 (3-2) 0-1   Day 6 hatakikomi Ms25e Matsui 2-1 (2-3) 1-0   Day 7 oshidashi Ms23e Hananoumi 3-1 (4-1) 1-0   Day 9 hatakikomi Ms30w Enho 4-1 1-0   Day 11     Ms6w Akua 5-0 0-0

[Bunbukuchagama 770]

On 18/03/2025 at 05:21, Bunbukuchagama said:

SumoDB continues to show Oshoryu as having a perfect 5-0 record on the Torikumi page; however, his  record is displayed as 4-1 everywhere else:

Day 1 tsukiotoshi Ms27w Yuma 0-1 (2-3) 1-0   Day 4 hatakikomi Ms27e Toseiryu 2-0 (3-2) 0-1   Day 6 hatakikomi Ms25e Matsui 2-1 (2-3) 1-0   Day 7 oshidashi Ms23e Hananoumi 3-1 (4-1) 1-0   Day 9 hatakikomi Ms30w Enho 4-1 1-0   Day 11     Ms6w Akua 5-0 0-0

The result of Oshoryu - Toseiryu bout is still not fixed.

Edited March 21 by Bunbukuchagama

[Asashosakari 19,653]

MsTd Nomura in 1974.03 has a wrong interim record after (and/or before) his sixth match; his score goes from 3-2 to 4-2 on a loss. Makes that match show up as a bogus result on a "4 wins before the bout vs 3 wins before the bout" query.

[Asashosakari 19,653]

On 25/01/2021 at 23:13, Asashosakari said:

After digging deep into archive.org's copies of old SML posts, it looks like the Kyushu 1996 makuuchi playoff has the East-West assignments wrong for two of the four matches in the 5-way playoff.
 

Official information from the original(?) 1990s era NSK site: https://web.archive.org/web/20010118182500/http://www.wnn.or.jp/wnn-t/relay/96_11/15/yusho_e.html

Supported also by this contemporary account of an SML member who watched it live.
 

Matches 1 and 3 are currently listed the other (wrong) way around on the DB. The correct order makes a lot more sense in that it would be inconceivable that Musashimaru fought his two tomoe-sen matches from different sides, as the DB currently has it.

(Stewart Nelson, if you're still out there, many thanks for including that Kyokai site URL in this SML post - I think it's the only reason archive.org managed to pick it up at some point, no playoff pages from other tournament seem to be there.)

I just came across this again. Further evidence on video that matches 1 and 3 should have their sides reversed:

 

[Yubinhaad 11,761]

It was announced earlier that the kimarite in Kirishima's Day 13 win has been corrected, from uwatenage to shitatenage. The Kyokai site already shows this, but I don't know if Sumo Reference would automatically catch it so I thought it best to mention it.

[Oskanohana 293]

37 minutes ago, Yubinhaad said:

It was announced earlier that the kimarite in Kirishima's Day 13 win has been corrected, from uwatenage to shitatenage. The Kyokai site already shows this, but I don't know if Sumo Reference would automatically catch it so I thought it best to mention it.

Are you telling me that the kyokai recognized a mistake they made and corrected it? Another sign of the apocalypse, might as well pop the champagne to celebrate the Takayusho then.

[Asashosakari 19,653]

0-win/0-loss fix for the Haru results, please. 

[Asashosakari 19,653]

Just now, Asashosakari said:

NHK World News had a segment about Daishi, who apparently has been enjoying a career resurgence after quite a few lean years:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zr6W85swVp0

Former stablemate Raio makes an appearance in the segment at 4:12 as Daishi's personal assistant (for lack of a better term), and I think we can confirm "Masataka" as the reading of his given name based on that.

[Asashosakari 19,653]

I don't know if this warrants an adjustment, but Tamanofuji's ja.wiki article states that his initial retirement was accepted in May 1968, meaning his first two basho would have to be Bg, not Kg. The claim is referenced with the December 2009 issue of the "Sumo" print magazine, not sure if anybody might have that laying around to verify (and/or another source where it might have come up).

In addition, and I think this definitely needs to be changed: His final basho in 1981.11 shows 12 yasumi but a tournament record of 0-0 rather than 0-0-12. The Kyokai used to show him with a total scoreline of 425-419-14 in his oyakata days (apparently not counting the 6-1-21 from before his restart at all), and those 14 absences only make sense if he is credited with the 12 for his last tournament.

[Asashosakari 19,653]

A Discord user recently visited a ramen shop in Las Vegas that turned out to be run by an ex-rikishi. Among the various memorabilia present there was also a large printout of a local magazine article about him, and it turns out that the article is actually still available on the net as well (in fact the oldest one they have on the website, whew):  Las Vegas Japan Times March 2017 or direct link to the article.

Anyway, the shop owner is the former Matsuuragata, and it's another opportunity to fix a name: The confirmed given name reading for 浩嗣 is Koji こうじ rather than the presently listed Hirotsugu, and presumably that's true also for the period that he used it as part of his shikona.

Furthermore, as the article says that his shikona was taken from his uncle, we can address that rikishi as well. It's a bit confusing that he's listed as Matsuragata while the nephew is Matsuuragata, but I haven't found any references that would support doubting that; I suppose it's not totally unheard of to re-use a (kanji) shikona but alter the pronunciation. But we can still confirm that his real surname was indeed Makiyama as well. As he went all the way up to komusubi there's actually a ja.wiki article about him, and now it gets a bit messy: Its listed real given name matches the DB's data with 強臣, but gives the reading Tsuyomi つよみ. (I'm actually not sure at all why the DB has "Torinosuke"...that seems weird for 強臣 even with the vagaries of nanori readings.) The problem is that he also used those kanji as his shikona given name for the two basho that he fought as Orochigata, but the DB - and other sources like Takayama - have the reading as Tsuyoomi つよおみ there. I have no idea if one or the other is wrong, or if maybe both are right and the readings in fact differed.

(I also can't help but notice that Takayama uses the archaic 枩 matsu kanji instead of the modern variant for all tournaments other than the very last one of his career...)

Edited April 10 by Asashosakari

[Sensonoasase 1]

Gentlemen,

I may have found three possible errors in early Kabu data in SumoDB. I recognize these are all about a century old and hard dates can be hazy, but I'm trying to reconcile heya iterations as far best as I can and ran into these seemingly erroneous dates with invalid month numbers in the MM.YYYY format:

The first row for Irumagawa has the end date as '31.1922'. Judging by the start date of the next row, I'm guessing that's supposed to be 01.1923 instead?


Similar issue for Tatsunami where the first row has an end date of '13.1915'. I'm guessing that should be '12.1915' based on the start date of the next row?


Same thing for Tokiwayama but on the second row this time with and end date of '13.1927'. Should that be '12.1927' based on the start date of the next row?


I apologize if this isn't the proper place to post this. I was unable to find any firm sources other than SumoDB for these dates to confirm or reconcile the numbers.

戦争の浅瀬

[Asashosakari 19,653]

FWIW, the Irumagawa line used to read "12.31.1922" with day and month erroneously reversed, and with Irumagawa in the wrong stable. I guess that date got messed up a bit when this bug report was implemented?

On 25/01/2022 at 22:44, Asashosakari said:

Ugh, I went down the toshiyori rabbit hole...

In trying to figure out how long the Chiganoura share has been a Dewanoumi property, one ends up going back to the first holder listed on the DB, the first of two Ayagawa Goroji - who is listed as having competed out of (and eventually branched out of) Irumagawa-beya.

The problem here: There's no corresponding Irumagawa-beya listed for that time period. According to the ja.wiki article about the stable, the DB data about one of the several Ryogoku Kajinosuke is currently wrong in that he didn't stay affiliated to Dewanoumi-beya when he retired from active competition in January 1912, but rather set out immediately and created Irumagawa-beya. What's correct is that he took over Dewanoumi-beya in 1923 after the death of Hitachiyama, but he did so by merging his Irumagawa-beya into it, not from a position as already-affiliated oyakata.

(Customary @Tamanaogijima ping. Small addendum: Should the first vacancy period for the Irumagawa kabu start at 01.1923 rather than 02.1923?)

And I think I'd like to re-raise the question from the last sentence there. If we're listing Ryogoku as Irumagawa to 12.1922 (presumably what "31.1922" is meant to be) and as Dewanoumi from 01.1923, IMHO the Irumagawa vacancy should start at 01.1923 as well. (And for consistency's sake maybe the end of it should just be "04.1925" rather than "30.04.1925" since the next entry starts with only "05.1925".)

Edit: BTW, there might be another issue in how Ryogoku's Irumagawa shisho stint is coded. DB listing as of the end of 1922:

Ikazuchi[11] Gondayu	Y Umegatani Totaro	11.03.1878	Ikazuchi
Shiratama[8] Kenjiro	S Tamatsubaki Kentaro	10.11.1883	Ikazuchi
Chiganoura[8] Goroji	S Ayagawa Goroji	25.11.1883	Irumagawa
Inagawa[6] Juro	O Kyushuzan Juro	12.05.1889	Irumagawa
Irumagawa[12] Kajinosuke#	K Ryogoku Kajinosuke	15.03.1874	Irumagawa
Matsuchiyama[8] Uhachiro	M18 Kunigaiwa Uhachi	04.01.1875	Irumagawa
Isenoumi[9] Godayu	K Kashiwado Sogoro	10.10.1881	Isenoumi
Shikihide[4] (Shikimori Hidegoro)	K Ariake Goro	23.03.1875	Isenoumi

Should be at the top of his heya's set of oyakata, but currently isn't. (Ikazuchi and Isenoumi included just for demonstration purposes.)

Edited 15 hours ago by Asashosakari

[Asashosakari 19,653]

Vaguely but not really related to the other two reports: Are "before / during / after" style dates supposed to always be identical in the two affected entries? If they are, then Mutsuarashi is another one with a discrepancy:

Time	Kabu Name	Holder	Heya	Ichimon	Owner
31.03.1976 (KA) - during 12.1976 (HCa)	Ajigawa[3] Hiroaki	S Mutsuarashi Yukio	Miyagino	Tatsunami
during 01.1977 (HCa) - 22.04.1979 (HB)	Ajigawa[3] Hiroaki	S Mutsuarashi Yukio	Tomozuna	Tatsunami
23.04.1979 (HB) - 25.04.1993 (RC)	Ajigawa[3] Hiroaki	S Mutsuarashi Yukio	Ajigawa	Tatsunami