Preparations of the Y/O- November 2020

[Eikokurai 3,437]

On 15/10/2020 at 07:41, Katsunorifuji said:

Out of curiosity, can a Yokozuna be forced to retire if they keep missing basho? I know that the powers that be can reprimand or recommend retiring, but if Hakuho or Kakuryu want to sit out three or more basho, could they theoretically do that with out being forced out of sumo?

It’d be hilarious if there was no way to force a Yokozuna out. We could end up with 65 year olds who haven’t finished a basho in thirty years turning up occasionally to aggravate an old injury on purpose so they can go kyujo for six more months.

”Yokozuna Hakuho has withdrawn from Aki 2050 on day two, his 124th kyujo in a row, citing the flare up of arthritis in his hips, gout in his toes, a swollen prostate, high blood pressure, cataracts, diabetes and a mild stroke. The YDC expressed their disappointment and urged the long-reigning champion* to please please please show some self-respect and stop stealing a salary from the now nearly bankrupt Kyokai.”

*Last championship thirty years ago.

[pricklypomegranate 730]

45 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

stop stealing a salary from the now nearly bankrupt Kyokai

When Hakuho retires, the rikishi retirement bonus will already bankrupt the Kyokai 

But yeah, I don't think Hakuho will go further than July or whenever the Olympics happen, because deshis need to punished (cough cough Enho cough Ishiura) 

Edited October 16, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[pricklypomegranate 730]

Information about the degeiko held at 8am today at the Kokugikan has surfaced. Degeiko will continue now till the 22nd. Here is the information I collated from the Nikkan Sports and Sports Hochi, apologies in advance if I interpret it wrongly - I am trying to decipher and amalgamate the puzzles Google Translate has provided me: 

Sources:

https://hochi.news/articles/20201016-OHT1T50074.html

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202010160000355.html

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202010160000359.html?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=nikkansports_ogp

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202010160000370.html

Attendees: Hakuho, Shodai, Takakeisho, Mitakeumi, Kiribayama, Aoiyama, Ichinojo, Nishikigi (and Ikioi, who is clearly pictured here, yet not mentioned in the articles). 

Hakuho did not fight any bouts and stuck to regular training as well as lent his chest to the shin-Ozeki Shodai for about 5 minutes. While doing so, he jokingly commented that there was only 30 minutes left of degeiko, implying he didn't want to leave. He seemed to be in good spirits and was very talkative (all following comments are not pinpoint precision translation, just the gist): 

[About degeiko]: "It's been a long time. I'm glad I was able to come back from surgery and do degeiko for the first time in two and a half months. It was comfortable and I am grateful. I was a little swollen and was afraid and impatient to get back to training. However, after consulting my body, I decided to go at the last minute. [Shodai] is starting to gain momentum and it's time I started to gain momentum too. I'm also a representative for the sumo world so it is my duty to show up and increase the standard of the training." 

[About the YDC's remarks]: "I've been here a long time. Over 30, the amount of injuries inevitably increase. Old injuries get worse, and new ones crop up. However, I would like to respond to that by saying that whenever I heal and return from injury, I post good results. I want you to understand this a little more." 

Shodai was also positive about the experience: 

[About degeiko] "I was able to practice well. I haven't been able to do much since I started training so I am hope to progress gradually from here and prepare properly as an Ozeki. The feeling of degeiko is not something you can experience in your own heya, so it is good stimuli. I am not participating in it just because I am a shin-Ozeki, but because I have this kind of opportunity. I still have more time to prepare, and would like to prepare well. I felt things were normal just for a day." 

Takakeisho made good practice, winning 6 out of 10 bouts with Shodai (though I am not super sure about this, Japanese proficient people please confirm): 

[About degeiko] "It's a very valuable experience, so I want to make it my own. I want to improve my sumo. I want to consult my body, decide on a plan and execute it well." 

Epilogue 

Here is some spicy news from the Nikkan Gendai: https://www.nikkan-gendai.com/articles/view/sports/280065 

If you don't want to add to the readership figures of Japanese Daily Mail, it basically accuses Hakuho of entering in the last minute to affirm that Shodai was going to show up, thus allowing him to beat Shodai into a mush and intimidate him. Obviously, the predictions did not come true, as usual. 

Edited October 16, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Yago was there as well, among other Makushita guys.

Hanakago Oyakata, in charge of the keiko: "It was good. The content was so-so since the guys have all just started training. It's not 100% from the start. We have only a week but this will carry us on till banzuke announcement day. I'm glad we have advanced to this. They haven't been able to face anyone outside their heya for more than half a year, so this is good. Facing guys from other heya makes for a different atmosphere. Just being a part of it strengthens your body.. These days, the keiko methods have changed. After the banzuke announcement, they will have to make do with serious training at the heya only.  That is new. Truth be told, the old system was better, but.."

Edited October 16, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Seiyashi 4,109]

1 hour ago, pricklypomegranate said:

If you don't want to add to the readership figures of Japanese Daily Mail, it basically accuses Hakuho of entering in the last minute to affirm that Shodai was going to show up, thus allowing him to beat Shodai into a mush and intimidate him. Obviously, the predictions did not come true, as usual. 

Considering that Hakuho is generally agreed to be a serious doubt for November anyway, I don't think he entered specifically to thrash Shodai like he did Asanoyama the last time. More likely he decided he needed to, er, show up to remind everyone including the YDC geezers that he was still alive, intending to do sumo, and conveniently got in a word about injuries and healing from them.

That said, he's now made Kakuryu look a little worse, because so much less is known about Kakuryu's condition; some wag is bound to say "Hakuho showed up as befits a yokozuna, even with bum knees recovering from surgery. What's Kakuryu got? High WBC count? Pfffffft!"

[Seiyashi 4,109]

1 hour ago, pricklypomegranate said:

Takakeisho made good practice, winning 6 out of 10 bouts with Shodai (though I am not super sure about this, Japanese proficient people please confirm): 

Yep, correct.

1 hour ago, pricklypomegranate said:

Attendees: Hakuho, Shodai, Takakeisho, Mitakeumi, Kiribayama, Aoiyama, Ichinojo, Nishikigi (and Ikioi, who is clearly pictured here, yet not mentioned in the articles). 

He's mentioned in the articles under the juryo heading with Nishikigi (my guess is if you're using Google Translate, there's a pretty good chance his shikona will be mistranslated). (EDIT: checked with GT and it is indeed omitted entirely.)

1 hour ago, pricklypomegranate said:

Hakuho did not fight any bouts and stuck to regular training as well as lent his chest to the shin-Ozeki Shodai for about 5 minutes.

It's mentioned in particular that he had tachi-ai practice with Ikioi as well.

 

Edited October 16, 2020 by Seiyashi

[pricklypomegranate 730]

27 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Considering that Hakuho is generally agreed to be a serious doubt for November anyway, I don't think he entered specifically to thrash Shodai like he did Asanoyama the last time. More likely he decided he needed to, er, show up to remind everyone including the YDC geezers that he was still alive, intending to do sumo, and conveniently got in a word about injuries and healing from them.

Now, I am not a Hakuho jingoist and have previously been quite critical about his ill thought-out decision to use dangerous tactics during practice so close to the basho, I think he wanted to assert his position more than he intended to hurt Asanoyama - the two intentions are not necessarily mutual. I think it was not a pre-meditated move, but an accident, albeit one which Asanoyama should have expected to be prevented. I think it's so easy to be cynical about the sumo world, but I try to avoid that without romanticising the sport too much - I don't think we should count Hakuho out yet and I don't think he was there just for image purposes - he was a known degeiko nut and might be genuinely happy about somewhat returning to his routine and interacting with his other colleagues again, treasured (see Ikioi) or otherwise, and though it may be frowned upon in Japanese circles, I think he has a right to politely respond the YDC comments about him. 

27 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

That said, he's now made Kakuryu look a little worse, because so much less is known about Kakuryu's condition; some wag is bound to say "Hakuho showed up as befits a yokozuna, even with bum knees recovering from surgery. What's Kakuryu got? High WBC count? Pfffffft!"

No! Kakuryu must survive! 

Asanoyama conspicuously absent. 

P.S. Thanks for clarifying the errors in my post.

Edited October 16, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[Seiyashi 4,109]

1 hour ago, Kintamayama said:

These days, the keiko methods have changed. After the banzuke announcement, they will have to make do with serious training at the heya only.  That is new. Truth be told, the old system was better, but..

Does he mean pre-COVID days, or the days where quite a few other implements from different sports (like golf clubs) were used?

[Kintamayama 47,379]

2 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

Does he mean pre-COVID days, or the days where quite a few other implements from different sports (like golf clubs) were used?

i think he means covid with all the no degeiko stuff, as he is speaking on this subject.

[Iwayama 25]

I am curious if seeing Takakeisho, Shodai, and Hakuho taking part in joint-keiko will motivate Asanoyama to make an appearance as well. Just training with Asabenkei and Asagyokusei isn't going to give him the same kind of intensity he would get if he was at the kokugikan. 

[pricklypomegranate 730]

53 minutes ago, Iwayama said:

I am curious if seeing Takakeisho, Shodai, and Hakuho taking part in joint-keiko will motivate Asanoyama to make an appearance as well. Just training with Asabenkei and Asagyokusei isn't going to give him the same kind of intensity he would get if he was at the kokugikan. 

It's not a regular degeiko where Asanoyama can just show up - he's has to do and score negative on the PCR Test. But yes, I do hope he shows up if he isn't hurt too bad. 

Edited October 16, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[Kintamayama 47,379]

10 minutes ago, pricklypomegranate said:

It's not a regular degeiko where Asanoyama can just show up - he's has to do and score negative on the PCR Test. But yes, I do hope he shows up if he isn't hurt too bad. 

AND, there is a 10-sekitori limit..

[Seiyashi 4,109]

2 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

AND, there is a 10-sekitori limit..

I count nine sekitori at the combo practice. That said, if these go on till the 22nd, there's plenty of opportunities for Asanoyama to do so; he might just have wanted to wait and see who turns up and what these sessions were like before actually turning up himself, and got upstaged by the other two ozeki and Hakuho showing up from the get-go.

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Some more stuff Shoudai said today:

Regarding his session with Takakeishou (4-6): "In  no way am I even close to being in good shape yet, so I wanted to see  where I'm lacking. I feel I'm lacking in everything.. "

Asked if he had done any sumo in training prior to today: "Yesterday I started doing sumo with some Makushita guys and was getting pushed back so I was wondering what to do, but I heard the other sekitori were not doing any real sumo either, so I thought what the heck and gave it a try. l still got a long way to go, though.." 

Did the Yokozuna say anything to you? "He congratulated me and that made me very happy.."

Are your muscles aching as you start real training?: "Yes.. I have to be careful with that as well. I just want to come here this whole week without getting injured.."

Edited October 16, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 47,379]

18 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

I count nine sekitori at the combo practice. That said, if these go on till the 22nd, there's plenty of opportunities for Asanoyama to do so; he might just have wanted to wait and see who turns up and what these sessions were like before actually turning up himself, and got upstaged by the other two ozeki and Hakuho showing up from the get-go.

Asanoyama is the only one who specifically said he will not be joining the bubble. I think there will be a rush tomorrow to join. Everyone was waiting to see who will join as nobody really committed 100% to coming till this morning. Yutakayama and Tochinoshin, if they were healthy, would have been the first ones banging on the door early in the morning. Aoiyama, Nishikigi, Ikioi and Mitakeumi (although he famously sucks at keiko) are known for their keiko seriousness. I'm pretty sure we'll see some Juryo guy joining and perhaps Takayasu. I don't think the guys from multi-sekitori heya (Isegahama, Sadogatake, Oitekaze and Kokonoe) will be joining for fear of catching something.

Edited October 17, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Today, Hakuhou again called on Ikioi to train his tachiai and his various grips. He was seen being pushed back but recovering and winning. The temperature was lower than yesterday. "We've had some cold days lately but I'm somehow coping with it. I get a bit stiff when it's cold," he explained. "I'm thinking if I could do real sumo in the second half of the training sessions, it will be good.." he summed.

Shoudai took on Takakeishou again today, 12 bouts, 6-6. "I'm still not there.. My stamina has weakened. I need a bit more softness. These sessions are a breath of fresh air. The YDC Soken is different- we're more conscious of what's going on.  This is a bit different.  We're not that conscious, so the atmosphere is good," he said

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Takakeishou today: 12 bouts against Shoudai, winning the first four of five and looking good, no pulling and even winning by a left shitatenage at some point...  "I'm surprised I'm able to fight well so quickly as I have not trained this well for a while. Shoudai and I are both straightforward attackers so this should make us stronger. We have the same goal so if we both go at it seriously, it will be good." He has been mainly doing the fundamentals for a while now during training. "I feel  I can always do the fundamentals, but this opportunity has been given to me so when it arises, I'm glad to be a part of it," he said. He does have guys like Takanoshou and Takagenji to train with at his heya, but he understands the importance of this chance to face the other guys. 

Edited October 17, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 47,379]

And Asanoyama? He did some muscle training and fundamentals at the heya today. "I am me and will be training at the heya and doing the best I can," he said. He intends to start doing sumo on Monday. "The cold weather? I'm from Toyama so I'm used to that. It's still pretty cool so no problem for me.." he said. He is being sent rice and water from his hometown. "Reminds me of home.. It's not only myself-the whole heya is enjoying it," he summed.

Butsugari:

 

[Hakuryuho 335]

1 hour ago, Kintamayama said:

oday, Hakuhou again called on Ikioi to train his tachiai and his various grips. He was seen being pushed back but recovering and winning. The temperature was lower than yesterday. "We've had some cold days lately but I'm somehow coping with it. I get a bit stiff when it's cold," he explained. "I'm thinking if I could do real sumo in the second half of the training sessions, it will be good.." he summed.

Does this mean there's a real possibility of Hakuho in the November basho? 

[Shinobi Steve 146]

I certainly hope we get to see him in November. 

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Hakuhou did semi-sumo, doing moves against fellow Mongolian Kiribayama and looking good. Very strong and quick first step, right hand grip, and good retaliation.. "I felt that slowly the anxiety is subsiding. I want to up the pace, " he said. He is planning on doing sumo on the 20th- the day after tomorrow. Seeing Shoudai and Takakeishou going at it fiercely, he said: "I think it's a bit early for this kind of pace but hey, to each his own.. They're bringing out the best in them.  Takakeishou pushing, Shoudai surviving.." he added.

 

 

Edited October 18, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama 47,379]

Takakeishou and Shoudai were at it for the third day running. 13 bouts, 8-5 in Takakeishou's favor. He was seen winning most of the time by winning the tachiai battle."There are things I have slowly gotten used to. I think I am gradually getting faster. We are from different Ichimons and he won the yusho last basho, so I came here to train because I felt it would be good keiko. Now that I'm here, I want the training to mean something. "He has started sumo in training at an earlier stage than usual. "That's my strong point, I like the challenge. I'm glad that it's earlier than usual. We never have a chance to battle it out Ozeki on Ozeki on a daily basis so I want to take advantage of that the best I can."

"My body aches all over, so I find it hard to concentrate. But still, I think my body has been moving.. I hope to continue at this pace. What's going to happen? Well, I want to do the best I can," said Shoudai after the 5-8 against Takakeishou, the old negativity briefly reappearing..  Tomorrow is a day off from the keiko and it will resume on Tuesday. 

Edited October 18, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Hakuryuho 335]

42 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

Hakuhou did semi-sumo, doing moves against fellow Mongolian Kiribayama and looking good. Very strong and quick first step, right hand grip, and good retaliation

Nice to hear that he's using and training his grips, I thought his grips were (compared to his usual self) not on point in his last tournament in July, missed and lost grips he should've held on, probably because he wasn't at 100%.

[pricklypomegranate 730]

News about Hakuho's sanban, Shodai's progress and (gasp!) Kakuryu's condition has been revealed. All comments below are just the gist, as I don't read Japanese, so sorry for the inaccuracies or omissions: 

Sources: 

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202010200000301.html

https://hochi.news/amp/articles/20201020-OHT1T50063.html

https://www.tokyo-sports.co.jp/sports/sumou/2312952/

https://www.tokyo-sports.co.jp/sports/sumou/2312862/

Not really sure if this is a good indicator of Hakuho's condition as Mitakeumi is notoriously bad at practice. Nevertheless, Hakuho had 23 bouts with Mitakeumi today, winning 22 in an eager attempt to pay the Sekiwake back for that devastating loss in July. He also responded to reporters' questions about whether he will be practicing with Shodai with a Hakuho-esque sly smile. Here are the Yokozuna's comments: 

Hakuho: [On sanban] "I originally intended to do 30 bouts today, but my tsukebito are not here to keep count for me. I feel good today and heard that I did good sumo. The fact that I could even practice today is one step forward. It's more of the number than content at this point. I was very conscious about the wrestling, pushing and movement inside the dohyo today. It might be evidence that the pain is slowly disappearing." 

Hakuho: [On practicing with Shodai]: "It might be tomorrow or the day after tomorrow. If I say too much, he might not come." 

What about Kakuryu? Well, it seems that he is still on basic training, and the threat of imminent retirement weighs heavy on his mind: 

Kakuryu: [On his current situation] "I know [my kyujo record] myself. Especially in times like this, I don't overlook it. I have to do it well but I do not have to rush. If I go all out till the end, I know I will have a result."

Things are not rosy for Shodai either and it seems that the aching body he's been complaining about on Sunday is starting to take a toll his performance. Today, he only won 2 out of 8 of the bouts he fought with Ichinojo and Aoiyama today. Perhaps Hakuho was right about Shodai taking it too quickly in the first half: 

Shodai: [On his performance] "Everyone who has practiced earlier is getting better. I couldn't win normally. I wish I won more. I'm rather confused." 

Thanks @Kintamayama for being so speedy for the past two days. 

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[Kintamayama 47,379]

More Kakuryuu: Regarding his back pains: "The fatigue is there lately. I've been taking care the best I can but the pain exists." Why is he not at the Kyokai training camp? He has been a vocal advocate of allowing degeiko again lately. "I thought it would be held a bit later, but as it started earlier, I could not go." He knows the situation is grave as his Oyakata already said when he enters it will be a do or die situation. "I just can't get into gear, I can't do it well.." The death of his former shisho seems to be weighing on him as well. "I will not forget him till the day I die," he said.

Edited October 20, 2020 by Kintamayama