Asashouryuu-will he show up tomorrow?

[Kintamayama 45,543]

Takasago Oyakata spoke to the press this afternoon at the heya. "Worst case scenario, he goes kyujo . He has asked to think this over a bit more, so he will be deciding by mid-morning tomorrow. If he says he wants to participate, I will allow it". Takasago has not spoken directly to Asashouryuu, so it's more like an educated guess, but it seems there is no talk of immediate intai. Asa intends to return next basho and see what's what. OTOH, if he shows up tomorrow and loses, the intai question may be raised by assorted people..

[Hashira 0]

Kitanofuji was the colour commentator on NHK today, and said flat out that he should not show up tomorrow

if he's not (seriously) injured, I'd like to see him continue, but he sure better win.

[Bealzbob 0]

Surely if he was to go kyujo while everyone knows he's not technically injured - i.e. he is pulling a sickie - that will just add yet more ammunition to the anti-Asa bandwagon who claim he doesn't act like a yokozuna.

He is clearly troubled, but I think he should just grin and bear this basho and try and get ready for Kyushu mentally.

[Doitsuyama 1,194]

Surely if he was to go kyujo while everyone knows he's not technically injured - i.e. he is pulling a sickie - that will just add yet more ammunition to the anti-Asa bandwagon who claim he doesn't act like a yokozuna.

He is clearly troubled, but I think he should just grin and bear this basho and try and get ready for Kyushu mentally.

But if Asashoryu would go kyujo now he would act exactly in a time-honoured way yokozuna always did. Was that sarcasm from you (where is the emoticon then?) or did you really mean what you wrote?

[Bealzbob 0]

I meant what I wrote. If he went kyujo without being kyujo, even though it is 'time honoured' behaviour for a yokozuna, the anti-Asa bandwagon would still throw it at him as a negative.

[Asashosakari 19,687]

I meant what I wrote. If he went kyujo without being kyujo, even though it is 'time honoured' behaviour for a yokozuna, the anti-Asa bandwagon would still throw it at him as a negative.

Post bookmarked for future gloating. (In jonokuchi...) I'm with Doitsuyama on this.

[Bealzbob 0]

In the interests of fairness, what would need to happen in order for me to gloat :) I assume if an anti-Asa bandwagonner was to suggest that it was typically disrespectful of Asa to go kyujo if he does go kyujo then I would be right ?

[Kintamayama 45,543]

Surely if he was to go kyujo while everyone knows he's not technically injured - i.e. he is pulling a sickie u mentally.

Everyone actually knows (and the online papers have been reminding us daily) that Asa is suffering from an elbow injury that has not healed "as quickly as expected". If he goes kyujo, he will get a letter from the infirmary saying -"Diagnosis- left elbow ligament sprain and possible elbow fatigue-three weeks to heal" or something similar.

Just like all prior Yokozuna/Ozeki premature kyujoculations.

Edited September 22, 2008 by Kintamayama

[Asashosakari 19,687]

In the interests of fairness, what would need to happen in order for me to gloat :) I assume if an anti-Asa bandwagonner was to suggest that it was typically disrespectful of Asa to go kyujo if he does go kyujo then I would be right ?

Well, if you actually find such a thing, feel free to gloat then. I think it's much more likely that his detractors will take the opposite approach, i.e. blasting him for not keeping in sufficient shape and getting injured again, than it is that he'll be criticized for going kyujo despite not being injured enough.

And yeah, what Moti said. The public facade will be maintained; his main detractors are (or at least profess to be) concerned with keeping the reputation of the yokozuna rank intact - they're not going to break the fourth wall on a "time-honoured tradition" and damage the rank just to get at Asashoryu. There are plenty of other ways to do that.

Edited September 22, 2008 by Asashosakari

[paolo 0]

IMHO: There is no way anymore in which Asashoryu can avoid to be criticized: he is the naughty Yokozuna, the situation is clear and consolidated, right or wrong that it be, and no behaviour, no circumstance, no nothing can change it. Many people, expecially in important places in Sumo, do not like him and will not change their minds whatever can happen. Therefore if Asashoryu wants to go on, he must accept reality, without caring too much about being liked or not. The only reason why he could wish to go on in Sumo ought to be a possible proud desire to come back to number 1 in the standings: being number 2 is not for him. To try and achieve that he must: a. first of all heal from his injuries - b. train much better than he has done in the last times. To heal means to stop the basho now and to undergo whatever medical treatment is needed, including surgery if necessary; no waters, no photo books, no minor tournaments, no TV interviews, no business, every single moment devoted to healing: no sportsman can play at his top when injured. Then training: in all sports the older you get, the more you must train. If he gained weight, this probably made him less quick without giving him more power, and what would have Asashoryu been without his speed ? The change in his fat percentage was worrying because it possibly meant that he gained weight gaining mass but not power, becoming one like all the others: he needs his speed back. If Asashoryu's current determination does not allow him to do the above, then it would be useless for him to go on as a second level Yokozuna, and intai would be the only way out.

Augh, i said. (In jonokuchi...)

[Jonosuke 28]

Asashoryu is hurt. His elbow has not been healed for a long while now.

He did quite a bit more of pre-basho training this basho (well this is relatively speaking compared to the last couple of years) but even then the quantity and quality of his training sessions have been poor and often he was covering up his elbow as I believe he was trying to discover ways of being successful without pressuring his injured elbow much. Asashoryu is left handed so it really makes a lot of difference especially he has not been doing too many training sessions. He cannot really regain his sumo sense by just going to a gym and working out alone.

So if there is any anti Asashoryu force to gather a storm, it must be his all out efforts to make a jungyo successful while not taking care of himself prepared for a hon-basho. But then you really cannot fault a yokozuna for this. A jungyo is as much of Kyokai event as a hon basho.

A yokozuna is supposed to be invincible as that's how he got there. He is expected to win. If he does not, something is wrong That means either injury or illness. He does not go on kyujo for any time honored tradition but obviously as a yokozuna, he should not really give out a kinboshi that easily as it will reflect on all past yokozuna. Any time honored tradition did not force Wakanohana III to go on kyujo when he started losing more than he won so that theory won't wash.

[Gacktoh 0]

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/sports/sumo/news/....htm?from=main3

Asasyouryu KYUJYO from DAY 10

[madorosumaru 7]

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/sports/sumo/news/....htm?from=main3

Asasyouryu KYUJYO from DAY 10

According to the Yomiuri Online report that Gacktoh-san cites, it has become a certainty that Asashoryu will go kyujo from Aki Basho starting with Day 10.

The report also said that, after Ryu lost to Miyabiyama, he discussed retirement (intai) with his shisho, Takasago Oyakata. He apparently confessed to the oyakata that he didn't know what to do. At that time, the oyakata persuaded him to continue, and after further discussing the matter with friends and associates, the yokozuna decided to give it another try. However, he lost again on Day 8 and on Day 9 he lost to Ama.

After the Ama bout, Takasago Oyakata told the media that he would have a statement once they have come to a decision. Later, he said, "At the worst, it would be kyujo [not intai]."

Now that he is kyujo for two basho in a row, his performance at Kyushu Basho will determine whether Ryu will intai.

Asked if that would be the case, Musashigawa Rijicho said succintly, "When a yokozuna takes off two straight basho, that would be the obvious consequence."

Edited September 22, 2008 by madorosumaru

[Pak 0]

Hopefully this will give his elbow a chance to heal and train so he will be in good form next basho.

Regards,

Pak

[Jonosuke 28]

The report also said that, after Ryu lost to Miyabiyama, he discussed retirement (intai) with his shisho, Takasago Oyakata. He apparently confessed to the oyakata that he didn't know what to do. At that time, the oyakata persuaded him to continue, and after further discussing the matter with friends and associates, the yokozuna decided to give it another try.

If this story is true, even if Asashoryu can come back at the Kyushu, how long will he stay on?

When he lost to Miyabiyama, it was only Day 3 and it was his first loss of the basho. Was the injury that serious to even consider his retirement after suffering his first loss rather than simply thinking about going on kyujo?

Or has he lost the will to go on, feeling he has reached the limit mentally? He is only 28 years old and in some ways I am sure he wants to reach a couple of records. For instance he and Takanohana are tied with 22 yusho. If he gets one more, he will overtake Takanohana. Two more he will tie Kitanoumi. These records are within easy reach of Asashoryu.

He did not look too bad during the Mongolian Jungyo and was looking reasonably well just prior to the basho so his elbow injury should have not gotten that much worse in such a short time as I have not heard he aggravated it in any way since the start of the basho. Even the diagnosis sounds like a pretty minor injury.

So I wonder what else is going on with him to make him go talk to his shisho about his retirement on Day 3 after only one loss. Maybe he felt he had enough already. If that is the case then even if he comes back for the Kyusho, how much more can we expect from him?

[Gusoyama 104]

He needs to snap out of it, find the fire again, and become the gym rat/training monster that he used to be. The rest of Makuuchi isn't afraid of him any more, and maybe he needs to regain that.