Bye, Bye, Kosho.

[Takanorappa 97]

It looks like GTB will be a bit different for Haru... (Feeling guilty...)

From Sponichi: Link in Japanese (http://www.sponichi.co.jp/others/kiji/2003/09/26/01.html)

(Translation via Excite)

The Japan Sumo Association held the executive board in Ryogoku Kokugikan in Tokyo, and determined abolition of the "injury-incurred-while-on-duty system" of a wrestler, and amendment of the capacity of a sumo wrestler unanimously on the 25th. The 40 present persons to 42 persons and juryo also reinforce Makuuchi from the 26 present persons to 28 persons. It is falling, when Ozeki's descent regulation turns strictly substantially and suffers a greater number of loss by 2 place continuation by this. However, when mentioning ten or more victories of following places, the bailout which can return left. A new system will be applied from the New Year's sumo tournament next year.

The sumo world which faces inactivation of sumo wrestling popularity drew large decision at last. It will be full abolition from the New Year's sumo tournament next year about an injury wrestler's relief system continued from the New Year's sumo tournament for 72 years. The brakes will be applied to an absence wrestler's rapid increase, and the further substantial sumo ring will be aimed at. An executive board and the Kitanoumi chairman of the board of directors (a former yokozuna and Kitanoumi) interviewed after the teacher meeting end "useless, when there is no severity in a sumo ring. There is also an example which fell from Makuuchi to Makushita by the injury, and became a yokozuna like Mr. Kokonoe (a former yokozuna, Fuji of 1000 generation). There was no injury-incurred-while-on-duty system a long time ago. It declared to the wrestler that I have the starting point return."

Institutional abolition was an important examination subject from before. A certain Makuuchi wrestler presents a question to "since it is unavoidable that it is injured, an injury-incurred-while-on-duty system is required to some extent", and this determination. However, the wrestler who makes an injury-incurred-while-on-duty application increases rapidly in recent years. Absence wrestlers increased in number with a wrestler's increase in weight, and record 21 persons of ten Makuuchi and 11 juryo received injury-incurred-while-on-duty authorization last year. Furthermore, there was also an example of Ozeki and Musoyama. The left shoulder was dislocated by the spring sumo tournament, and it was dismissed as "Participation of a place is possible at an old wound summer" by the Department of Appeal, applying for an injury incurred while on duty. Nevertheless, it led by wins in the place the summer which carried out forcible participation, and the mood of system abolition increased at a stretch within the association by having escaped from the break game.

At an association, while asking a wrestler for severity, "American" prepares. It was decided that 40 old Makuuchi and the capacity of four of 26 juryo were reinforced to a 2 person increase coconut and a breath, respectively. A Makuuchi wrestler's increase of the personnel will be the increase of the personnel with the juryo it is the same and first henceforth [ a 26 person capacity system ] since May, 67. "one-person increasing is also big -- write That but, I have a young person have a dream and want to take animate sumo wrestling", the Kitanoumi chairman of the board of directors. Whether a large reform after a long time can apply "Hold on!" to a sumo wrestling detached building of a fan attracts attention.

[Kintamayama 47,170]

More coherent translation..

The Kosho system is dead. Kitanoumi Rijicho held a press conference explaining the details. The NSK decided unanimously to abolish the kosho status. Makuuchi will grow to 42 rikishi (from 40) and Juryo will grow to 28 (from 26). Ozeki demotions rules will be much stricter from now on. 2 consecutive Bashos of MK and down you go. But, the "ten wins next basho and you're back" rule stays as it is. All this- from Hatsu 2004.

The old system which was in place since 1972 will be abolished, due to the huge number of rikishi who have been going kyujo in all divisions lately. "We've got to be strict on the dohyo, otherwise it's not good. Kokonoe Oyakata (former Yokozuna Chiyonofuji) fell to Makushita after being injured and became Yokozuna eventually. There was no kosho system in the old days. We're back to how it used to be", said Kitanoumi Chairman man.

The Kosho system has been a subject of debates since its introduction. Some Makuuchi rikishi say, "Injuries happen and nothing can be done about that, so it is important to have this system". They question the point of the system abolishment. But, in recent years, the rikishi's use of the system has gotten out of hand. The average weight of the rikishi has risen, bringing about a rise in injuries as well. Last year, 10 Makuuchi and 11 Juryo rikishi received the status making a ground total of 21. OTOH, there was the case of Musouyama, who didn't get the status. He applied for it, it was turned down as an old injury , he was "forced" to participate, and got a KK. This gave the NSK to "proof" that the kosho status was irrelevant.

The NSK will try to "soften" this decision by adding 4 new Sekitori spots, 2 in each division, as a "cushion". This increase in Makuuchi rikishi will be a first since May 1967. First time increase for Juryo numbers as well. "Adding even one rikishi to the ranks is a big thing. But, there are young wrestlers with dreams, and I'd like to see them do Sumo with a lot of energy", said Kitanoumi.

It would be interesting to see if this first major change in ages will do a "matta" against the fans who have stopped following Sumo, and bring them back.

To see an illustration of injuries from 1958-2003 , see:

http://www.dichne.com/injuries.html

Kintamayama Mochiron

Edited September 26, 2003 by Kintamayama

[Asashosakari 20,211]

More coherent translation..

Thanks! (Feeling guilty...)

Bunch of random thoughts...

Ozeki demotions rules will be much stricter from now on. 2 consecutive Bashos of MK and down you go. But, the "ten wins next basho and you're back" rule stays as it is.

That's quite surprising, after all the rumours about the rule actually getting easier. I think it's going in the right direction.

The rest of it though...

"Kokonoe Oyakata (former Yokozuna Chiyonofuji)fell to makushita after being injured and became Yokozuna eventually."

Translation: "Hey, if a future Yokozuna can come back from a two-division demotion, everyone can!" Or something like that anyway...

"There was no kosho system in the old days. we're back to how i used to be", said Kitanoumi Chairman man.

Nevermind that neither him nor Chiyonofuji spent the majority of their careers in those "old days". (Yeah, I'm nitpicking.)

The NSK will try to "soften" this decision by adding 4 new Sekitori spots, 2 in each division, as a "cushion". This increase in Makuuchi rikishi will be a first since May 1967.

Still in nitpicking mode...the article's wrong about that part.

"Adding even one rikishi to the ranks is a big thing. But, there are young wrestlers with dreams, and I'd like to see them do Sumo with a lot of energy"

"Just don't get yourself injured while doing so!"

Edit: Makushita should be even more interesting in Kyushu now, what with there being 4 additional promotion spots to be had. (I'm assuming here that Juryo guys with sufficiently bad records will still get demoted, so it'll be 4+x promotees from Makushita, with x being anywhere between 2 and 5 as usual...)

Edited September 26, 2003 by Asashosakari

[Kintamayama 47,170]

The NSK will try to "soften" this decision by adding 4 new Sekitori spots, 2 in each division, as a "cushion". This increase in Makuuchi rikishi will be a first since May 1967.

Still in nitpicking mode...the article's wrong about that part.

When was the last time there was an increase in number of Makuuchi rikishi?

Edit: Hmm.. I see that the number changed from 38 to 40 in January 1991..

Edited September 26, 2003 by Kintamayama

[Kotoseiya Yuichi 3]

Won't this be the first time the number of juryo division rikishi has been changed? Hasn't the number always been 26 ever since... 1888 (?) when juryo was separated from makushita? Someone with the numbers on hand?

[Zuikakuyama 1]

Thank you for the translation.

Too bad I spent 5 minutes trying to decipher the computerized translation first. (Feeling guilty...)

Anyway, kosho is getting out of hand, really, and they do need to tighten the rules a bit.

[Takanobaka 0]

At an association, while asking a wrestler for severity, "American" prepares. It was decided that 40 old Makuuchi and the capacity of four of 26 juryo were reinforced to a 2 person increase coconut and a breath, respectively.

And this, my friends, would be why Excite (or babelfish for that matter) isn't the best way to translate...

In any case, I personally fully support these moves. And since (as Mike Wesseman might say) I KNOW that Kitanoumi Richijo is reading this post, this means he won't change his mind (Feeling guilty...)

My only potential qualm is the addition of 4 more salaried ranks when NSK is supposedly not doing very well financially. On the other hand, if booting subpar performers down and giving more opportunity for lower ranked popular rikishi to become perennial Sekiwake (read: Robocop) will increase revenues, then the move should be one that's positive all the way around.

[Jesinofuji 11]

It is my opinion this this will backfire. Its possible that we could see some really really good rikishi bumped down to Makushita just for being injured. I think they should set a limit for how far a rikishi can fall if the miss an entire basho on injury. Limit to say 5 or 6 ranks. Sure if the rikishi is good enough, he can bounce back, but it could take a year or more to do so. I don't think thats what Sumo needs. I want to see good rikishi compete with those of similar ability,

[Manekineko 200]

I predict (once again) the return of you-wash-my-back-I'll-wash-yours yaocho, more showmanship and less real fight in sumo - best way to limit injuries, no? (Feeling guilty...)

[Kashunowaka 300]

Obviously this change will make it harder for injured or semi-injured ozeki to stay on their rank. In all likelihood the resulting effect will be fewer ozeki. I think that is a good thing. Ever since Natsu basho 2000 we have had four or five rikishi on the ozeki rank, except for one basho with three ozeki. (Source: Chiyozakura's sumoinfo.de.) The ozeki rank can accomodate two or three good rikishi without problems - but when the number of ozeki increases to four or five, it virtually guarantees that we will see one or several ozeki with bad results, since it is mathematically impossible for everyone to get good results. That is not a bad thing in itself, since it means that the system is self-regulating.

When the ozeki take turns at being absent with kosho status like they have done lately, the self-regulation mechanism doesn't work anymore, since only two or three ozeki at a time are competing. (Or even one. (Feeling guilty...))

[Asashosakari 20,211]

The ozeki rank can accomodate two or three good rikishi without problems - but when the number of ozeki increases to four or five, it virtually guarantees that we will see one or several ozeki with bad results, since it is mathematically impossible for everyone to get good results.

I think this can't be phrased as such an absolute statement (unless you meant it along the lines of "impossible for everyone to get good results all the time")...I think two of the mitigating factors here are the number of Yokozuna who are actually competing (which hasn't been all that high for the last two years) and the strength of lower sanyaku and maku-joi. The time when everyone between Komusubi and M04 were mostly spank toys for the Ozeki seems to be over for now...whether that's the cause of the Ozeki weaknesses or its result is debatable, of course.

Edited September 26, 2003 by Asashosakari

[Kotoseiya Yuichi 3]

(...) the return of you-wash-my-back-I'll-wash-yours yaocho

The alleged yaocho, shouts the little lawyer inside me... (Feeling guilty...)

[Kashunowaka 300]

The ozeki rank can accomodate two or three good rikishi without problems - but when the number of ozeki increases to four or five, it virtually guarantees that we will see one or several ozeki with bad results, since it is mathematically impossible for everyone to get good results.

I think this can't be phrased as such an absolute statement (unless you meant it along the lines of "impossible for everyone to get good results all the time")...I think two of the mitigating factors here are the number of Yokozuna who are actually competing (which hasn't been all that high for the last two years) and the strength of lower sanyaku and maku-joi. The time when everyone between Komusubi and M04 were mostly spank toys for the Ozeki seems to be over for now...whether that's the cause of the Ozeki weaknesses or its result is debatable, of course.

I shouldn't have said that it was "mathematically" or theoretically impossible. (Blushing...) I should have said "practically impossible", if you take at least 10 wins as the boundary for what is considered a good result.

The average number of double digit results in the upper half of makuuchi (joijin) is 5. Sometimes there are as few as 2-3 rikishi with double digits, and occasionally it goes up to 7-8, in which case most of the double digit results will be 10-5 or 11-4. This year's Nagoya basho is an example of that.

If there are one or more competing yokozuna, the chances for the ozeki to get good results decrease. If lower sanyaku and maku-joi are strong, the chances also decrease. (D'oh!)

One could argue that 9-6 is a good result for an ozeki. In that case, the premises become a little different. I would argue that 8-7 is not a good result for an ozeki. (Feeling guilty...)

Mini-quiz: when was the last time that all ozeki on the banzuke got at least 10 wins? How many ozeki were there at the time?

[Guest Toljokinodo]

Mini-quiz: when was the last time that all ozeki on the banzuke got at least 10 wins? How many ozeki were there at the time?

hmmm, this was Aki Basho 1998 with Ozeki Musashimaru (11-4) and Ozeki Takanonami (10-5)....

...all Yokozuna had double digit wins, too; and from the others, only Toki at M15 got 10 wins!

Toljokinodo

[Asashosakari 20,211]

One could argue that 9-6 is a good result for an ozeki. In that case, the premises become a little different. I would argue that 8-7 is not a good result for an ozeki. :-/

8-7 is perfectly fine for me when there are four or five Ozeki, as long as it's not always the same guy who goes 8-7 (or worse).

Mini-quiz: when was the last time that all ozeki on the banzuke got at least 10 wins? How many ozeki were there at the time?

If I didn't miss a basho in between...Aki 1998 with two Ozeki (Maru 11-4, Nami 10-5)? Edit: I see Toljokinodo beat me to it by 3 minutes. (Holiday feeling...) That's a bit of a red herring though, because in the meantime we've also had Kyushu 2000 (5 Ozeki with them recording an 11-4 and four 9-6's...plus three active Yokozuna who went 11-4, 14-1, 11-4), Hatsu 2002 (four Ozeki - 9-6, 10-5, 13-2, 13-2) and Natsu 2002 (four Ozeki - 11-4, 10-5, 9-5-1, 11-4).

The entire three-basho stretch right after Tochiazuma's promotion from Hatsu to Natsu 2002 was pretty good actually, after that it was ruined by injuries of pretty much every Ozeki.

I just don't think the mere existence of 4 or 5 Ozeki at once is a precursor to results getting worse. The 2000/2001 situation included Miyabiyama, who was just plain bad during his Ozeki run...I doubt he would have fared any better if there had been three Ozeki total instead of four/five. And right now, the injury factor is playing havoc with the results. It's not that having 4/5 Ozeki automatically means one of them will be demoted soon...rather when there are so many Ozeki on the banzuke, chances are higher that one of them happens to be on the way out anyway at that time. (That demotion process is certainly accelerated by having many Ozeki, but I wouldn't agree that it's started by it.)

I do agree with your conclusion though, that the excessive application of kosho in the Ozeki ranks has prevented a situation that normally would have seen one or more demotions by now, and that's not healthy for the rank and sumo as a whole.

Edited September 26, 2003 by Asashosakari

[Kashunowaka 300]

That's a bit of a red herring though, because in the meantime we've also had Kyushu 2000 (5 Ozeki with them recording an 11-4 and four 9-6's...plus three active Yokozuna who went 11-4, 14-1, 11-4), Hatsu 2002 (four Ozeki - 9-6, 10-5, 13-2, 13-2) and Natsu 2002 (four Ozeki - 11-4, 10-5, 9-5-1, 11-4).

I think the result in Kyushu 2000 was rather remarkable, when all the top eight yokozuna/ozeki on the banzuke all got at least 9-6. (Sign of approval) In Hatsu 2002 both yokozuna withdrew. In view of that, Kaio's 9-6 as east ozeki doesn't look quite so good anymore. (Holiday feeling...) But hey, it most definitely is OK for an ozeki to go 8-7 and 9-6 once in a while.

I just don't think the mere existence of 4 or 5 Ozeki at once is a precursor to results getting worse.

Agreed. :-) The difference is that among those with bad results, a few more will be ozeki.

(There will also be more ozeki among those with good results. :-/)

The 2000/2001 situation included Miyabiyama, who was just plain bad during his Ozeki run...I doubt he would have fared any better if there had been three Ozeki total instead of four/five.

Perhaps he would have fared better in a period with less stiff competition. We will never know.

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

While I'm not the biggest fan of this rule change (nor of Kitanoumi Rijicho, but that's a separate matter), I say let's treat it as an interesting experiment and see what happens. It's premature (though fun (Holiday feeling...) ) to comment without giving this system a few basho to prove itself, or prove itself as bad.

[Kashunowaka 300]

It's premature (though fun  :-) ) to comment without giving this system a few basho to prove itself, or prove itself as bad.

Bah! As if that would stop us. (Holiday feeling...) :-/

[Tokimori 0]

red herring

What's this red herring thing? I'm not familiar with the expression.

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

See formal definition here.

It's also commonly used as a "red flag" i.e. cause for alarm, something that draws attention.

[Takanorappa 97]

At an association, while asking a wrestler for severity, "American" prepares. It was decided that 40 old Makuuchi and the capacity of four of 26 juryo were reinforced to a 2 person increase coconut and a breath, respectively.

And this, my friends, would be why Excite (or babelfish for that matter) isn't the best way to translate...

Totally agree, but much better than me doing it without knowing any Japanese :-/ I am in favor, however, of increased breathing, but do not favor the coconuts. (Holiday feeling...)

Obviously this change will make it harder for injured or semi-injured ozeki to stay on their rank. In all likelihood the resulting effect will be fewer ozeki. I think that is a good thing

Fewer Ozeki, yes, but I wonder what will be the effect on intais in the future?

It's not inconceivable that, say, a former Ozeki gets injured & rapidly descends out of the paid ranks in a couple of basho. Are we going to see a change in attitude that says it's okay for these lofty veterans to hang around in the lower ranks (i.e., "Hey, I was in Makuuchi just two basho ago. Why should I retire! I'm still young...").

I'm willing to give this change a try, but have a gut feel think it's going to be a sensational flop. I'm betting that the rule won't last a year.

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

Won't this be the first time the number of juryo division rikishi has been changed? Hasn't the number always been 26 ever since... 1888 (?) when juryo was separated from makushita? Someone with the numbers on hand?

No, this has indeed changed many times, the last of them being at the same time Makunouchi changed, in the late 1960s. A moment and I'll check the details...

EDIT: It changed in May 1967 from 36 to 26. After that it has been constantly capped at 26 although there are a few basho in the 1970s when only 25 rikishi were actually ranked in Juryo. In the 50s, the number of Juryo could be even greater (at least up to 44 but there might have been more at some point).

(You are going off-topic...)

The actual discussion here: I have more or less stated my point many times before but it pretty much boils down to:

I agree the stricter Ozeki judgment seems good. B-)

I think the general kosho abolishment is bad and that it won't hold for long before a new, possibly somewhat changed version of the current system will be set in place. (Being mellow...)

I think adding 2 more Juryo and 2 more Makunouchi is pretty strange and definitely won't mean much regarding the kosho rule, but it doesn't really bother me. If the Kyokai wants to give more rikishi monthly salary it's up to them ;-)

Edited September 26, 2003 by Yubiquitoyama

[Kotoseiya Yuichi 3]

Once again my memory failed miserably... (You are going off-topic...)

[Kashunowaka 300]

red herring

See formal definition here.

It's also commonly used as a "red flag" i.e. cause for alarm, something that draws attention.

In other words a false clue (ett villosp

Edited September 26, 2003 by Kashunowaka

[Fujisan 533]

I dont think they need to increase Makuuchi with all the Rikishi who will drop to Juryo and below thanks to this frankly insane decision.

Watch for a few forced retirements aswell-

The older and the injury prone will be the first to fall-