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#1 Doitsuyama

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 09:30

I will announce the updates on the Sumo Reference site on this forum - I feel that's better than somewhere hidden on the site.

Firstly I could correct a few errors found by Asashosakari and Randomitsuki. Next I want to thank Gans-san for sharing a lot of material which will be worked into the database, but it's so much it will last some months. Gochisozan also is providing me with a lot of missing lower division results in the Heisei era from his Sumo magazine archive. Of course Nishinoshima also is active and I received a fat letter with lots of material from him.

It's so much, I actually could need help in entering all that new data. So, if there is another person or two insane dedicated enough to enter data into Excel sheets, I happily can throw loads of work at them. Ability to read kanji or at least hiragana is widening the range of possible tasks, but there actually also are enough tasks where only kanji for "east" and "west" must be distinguished or even less than this.

Actually I can understand if no one wants to do that time-consuming job, but I'm accepting volunteers - just send a PM or email.

Now what's new in the database since last week?

I have added the missing juryo kimarite from 1974 to 1988 with some rare kimarite (like ipponzeoi, sabaori, gasshohineri etc) among them. There still are a lot more available from Haru 1956 to 1973 waiting to be entered.

Then I was able to get the correct W-L records for Aki 1988 and Kyushu 1988. Until now these two full banzuke were entered from the banzuke itself (it was nice training to read the jonidan and jonokuchi shikona on the real banzuke), with the wins implicitly deduced from banzuke movement - naturally no distinction was possible between losses and absences, and final scores from intai rikishi were guessed with 0-0-7. Now everything is correct here. Some minor errors between Hatsu 1989 and Aki 1989 also were corrected and hoshitori added.

And lastly I completed the records of Kitamayama's favorite oldest rikishi in Ozumo, Ichinoya.

Edited by Doitsuyama, 02 July 2007 - 09:41.


#2 Oimeru

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 11:19

I'm wondering, how do you deal with Mongolian names? The transliteration seems rather inconsistent at times. Sometimes it looks Japanese, sometimes it looks Mongolian.

I don't speak Mongolian, but I can read Cyrillic. Assuming, that the "ын"-ending is not transliterated, and following the BGN/PCGN transliteration (which has the advantage of needing few accents):

Asashoryu: Долгорсүрэн Дагвадорж -> "Dolgursuren Dagvadorj" (you have a "w" instead of "v" in the DB, which seems inconsistent)
Hakuho: Мөнхбатын Даваажаргал -> "Mönkhbat Davaajargal"
Kyokutenho: Нямжавын Цэвэгням -> "Nyamjav Tsevegnyam" or his Japanese name Masaru Ota
Ama: Даваанямын Бямбадорж -> "Davaanyam Byambadorj"
Tokitenku: Алтангадасын Хүчитбаатар -> "Altangadas Khüchitbaatar"
Asasekiryu: Бадарч Дашням -> "Badarch Dashnyam"

For Kakuryu and Ryuo, I couldn't find the cyrillic Mongolian spelling, unfortunately -- and lower down the banzuke it probably becomes totally impossible.

If nothing else, I learned something about Mongolian naming conventions today B-)
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#3 Doitsuyama

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 12:56

I'm wondering, how do you deal with Mongolian names? The transliteration seems rather inconsistent at times. Sometimes it looks Japanese, sometimes it looks Mongolian.

I don't speak Mongolian, but I can read Cyrillic. Assuming, that the "ын"-ending is not transliterated, and following the BGN/PCGN transliteration (which has the advantage of needing few accents):

Asashoryu: Долгорсүрэн Дагвадорж -> "Dolgursuren Dagvadorj" (you have a "w" instead of "v" in the DB, which seems inconsistent)
Hakuho: Мөнхбатын Даваажаргал -> "Mönkhbat Davaajargal"
Kyokutenho: Нямжавын Цэвэгням -> "Nyamjav Tsevegnyam" or his Japanese name Masaru Ota
Ama: Даваанямын Бямбадорж -> "Davaanyam Byambadorj"
Tokitenku: Алтангадасын Хүчитбаатар -> "Altangadas Khüchitbaatar"
Asasekiryu: Бадарч Дашням -> "Badarch Dashnyam"

For Kakuryu and Ryuo, I couldn't find the cyrillic Mongolian spelling, unfortunately -- and lower down the banzuke it probably becomes totally impossible.

If nothing else, I learned something about Mongolian naming conventions today B-)

I don't have any idea about Mongolian names, and I can't read Cyrillic. All I have usually is in katakana. So any help is appreciated. I have changed those names, except Ama which already was as you wrote it. Still one question, is Asashoryu really Dolgursuren? I left it at Dolgorsuren as the Cyrillic also has an o.

#4 Oimeru

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 13:27

I don't have any idea about Mongolian names, and I can't read Cyrillic. All I have usually is in katakana. So any help is appreciated. I have changed those names, except Ama which already was as you wrote it. Still one question, is Asashoryu really Dolgursuren? I left it at Dolgorsuren as the Cyrillic also has an o.


Oops, sorry, you are right. That was my mistake.
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#5 Oimeru

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Posted 02 July 2007 - 14:30

Some more:

Kyokushuzan: Батбаярын Даваа = "Batbayar Davaa"
Kakuryu: M. Ананд = "M. Anand " -- I could not find the first name in Cyrillic, the English Kyokai website has it "Mangaljalav". Shame on that chess player for making googling so difficult.
Ryuo: Эрхэм-Очир Санчирболд= "Erkhem-Ochir Sanchirbold"
Hakuba: A. Єнєржаргал = "A. Yönyörjargal" or, by Wikipedia's convention, "A. Yenyerjargal"? The Kyokai has it as "Unurjargal" instead. I'm unsure about this one. First name is listed as "Ariunbajar" by the Kyokai.
Mokonami: Г. Базарсад = "G. Bazarsad", the Kyokai has the first name as "Ganbold" -- it's also like that in the DB
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#6 Doitsuyama

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 13:06

The database had some updates for the Heisei era in the last week as I found a nice site with lots of rikishi information for lower division rikishi of the Heisei era. I have completed rikishi data for all rikishi with hatsu dohyo from 1989 to 1992 (newer rikishi will follow next). Now all those rikishi (even those who never appeared on the banzuke) have complete details like birth date, real name, shusshin, heya, height and weight - some rikishi with hitherto unknown shusshin are foreigners, Akebono's little brother among them. I also got two Sumo magazines from July 1990 and July 1991, allowing to complete yearly height and weight histories for all rikishi from 1988 until now.

In the biggest news I actually got three volunteers to help with entering the masses of data in Fay, Jakusotsu and Randomitsuki which already allowed the completion of most of the missing hoshitori tables between 1990 and 1996. Only ten basho are still missing which should not last long.

Finally I completed the missing records for all still active rikishi, which weren't many. The following rikishi are now complete:

Hatsu dohyo 1988.03: Minezakura, Fusanohana, Kotonomine
Hatsu dohyo 1987.03: Koriyama, Kitazakura
Hatsu dohyo 1986.05: Dewanosato
Hatsu dohyo 1986.03: Kasachikara, Hanakaze, Hokutoryu
Hatsu dohyo 1985.03: Kimenryu
Hatsu dohyo 1982.03: Tochitenko

Tochitenko is especially impressive as he has been a makushita fixture since he was 18 years old, overall 127 basho in makushita or higher which is two more than Terao had. 127 basho means more than 21 years which is a lot.

Also impressive, but in a different way is Kasachikara who spent more basho in jonokuchi than in jonidan (73 to 52, 32 kachi-koshi). His jonidan debut actually was after a 1-6 in low jonokuchi. He also is a dai-persistent rikishi with make-koshi in his first 14 basho.

Edited by Doitsuyama, 09 July 2007 - 13:08.


#7 Asashosakari

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Posted 09 July 2007 - 18:14

Many thanks to you and the volunteers for all the updates! (Holiday feeling...)

#8 Doitsuyama

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Posted 16 July 2007 - 16:03

The Heisei data for all rikishi is complete now after checking more than 2,000 rikishi. The personal data for about 100 rikishi with very short careers have been added (and even about a dozen rikishi added who never were listed on the banzuke), and the banzuke-gai rikishi listings should be complete now as all intai dates are verified now. The shikona first names for Heisei are mostly complete as well, but still need a lot of verifications for non-final shikona and times of change. For the 2007.05 entrants I assumed the real first name as the shikona first name, corrections are very welcome. Does anyone know the shikona first name of Kyokushuho (certainly not Erdenbator...)?

The Hoshitori tables for Heisei are almost complete now with only Hatsu and Haru 1994 missing.

#9 Oimeru

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Posted 16 July 2007 - 20:17

The Heisei data for all rikishi is complete now after checking more than 2,000 rikishi. The personal data for about 100 rikishi with very short careers have been added (and even about a dozen rikishi added who never were listed on the banzuke), and the banzuke-gai rikishi listings should be complete now as all intai dates are verified now. The shikona first names for Heisei are mostly complete as well, but still need a lot of verifications for non-final shikona and times of change. For the 2007.05 entrants I assumed the real first name as the shikona first name, corrections are very welcome. Does anyone know the shikona first name of Kyokushuho (certainly not Erdenbator...)?

The Hoshitori tables for Heisei are almost complete now with only Hatsu and Haru 1994 missing.



Excellent news! Thanks for all your effort! (Sigh...)
The best thing about being young is not knowing how stupid you are.
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#10 Tsukinowa

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 15:22

For the 2007.05 entrants I assumed the real first name as the shikona first name, corrections are very welcome. Does anyone know the shikona first name of Kyokushuho (certainly not Erdenbator...)?

旭秀鵬 佑司(きょくしゅうほう ゆうじ KYOKUSHUHO Yuji)

#11 Doitsuyama

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Posted 17 July 2007 - 15:53

For the 2007.05 entrants I assumed the real first name as the shikona first name, corrections are very welcome. Does anyone know the shikona first name of Kyokushuho (certainly not Erdenbator...)?

旭秀鵬 佑司(きょくしゅうほう ゆうじ KYOKUSHUHO Yuji)

Thanks! It's in the database now.

#12 Doitsuyama

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 15:49

I have started to add some more full banzuke (including mae-zumo and banzuke-gai information) from the Showa-era, Aki 1986, Kyushu 1986, Hatsu 1987, Haru 1988 and Natsu 1988 have been added, Hoshitori tables will follow.

In another project the missing kimarite of lower division bouts from Nagoya 2001 and earlier will be added. A start is made with Nagoya 2001, here the kimarite stat of the added kimarite.

And of course the Nagoya 2007 basho is in the books, except mae-zumo results which will hopefully be provided by Tsukinowa in the next weeks.

#13 Chienoshima

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 09:49

Hi Doitsuyama,

Thanks a lot for your great site !! This will help a lot the sumomaniacs who are looking for statistics !!

Finally, I may have found a way to return the favor you gave when I wrote my article on ozeki Raiden Tameemon. I checked your website and here is a list of missing data I have in my hand, that may be interesting for you :

1. All basho results (from maezuma to retirement) of the former ozeki KIRISHIMA
2. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna CHIYONOFUJI
3. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna TAIHO
4. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III
5. Complete hoshitori of the mazeumo and the first basho of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III

If you want those data, you will get them.

One suggestion for your site: You should put your great rikishi strength analysis on yokozuna, ozeki, sekiwake, etc.. in your site, especially you keep on updating it.

Greetings from Paris,
Chienoshima

#14 Doitsuyama

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Posted 30 July 2007 - 09:13

Finally, I may have found a way to return the favor you gave when I wrote my article on ozeki Raiden Tameemon. I checked your website and here is a list of missing data I have in my hand, that may be interesting for you :

1. All basho results (from maezuma to retirement) of the former ozeki KIRISHIMA
2. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna CHIYONOFUJI
3. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna TAIHO
4. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III
5. Complete hoshitori of the mazeumo and the first basho of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III

If you want those data, you will get them.

I got a LOT of data for individual rikishi from Nishinoshima already. Weights and heights once per year are enough I think, and this I like to have for all rikishi, not just a few.

One suggestion for your site: You should put your great rikishi strength analysis on yokozuna, ozeki, sekiwake, etc.. in your site, especially you keep on updating it.

Yes, one future project is to make a new calculation of strength ratings with the juryo bouts now available before 1989 (my last strength analysis was still without these) and include strength ratings to banzuke and rikishi profiles. The "career strength ratings" would be another option for the rikishi profiles. I think working in more basic data is still the bigger priority.

#15 Doitsuyama

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Posted 30 July 2007 - 09:29

More full banzuke from the Showa-era have been added in the last week with Haru 1987, Natsu 1987, Nagoya 1987, Aki 1987 and Kyushu 1987, the Hoshitori tables will be added later.

Fay was very hard-working and thanks to her the lower division kimarite for Aki 2000, Kyushu 2000, Hatsu 2001, Haru 2001 and Natsu 2001 are available now. While adding those kimarite I came across Mizakura who has a broad range of kimarite in his profile. He won his bouts with 35 different kimarite so far, among them izori, tasukizori, tsutaezori, ipponzeoi and a lot more rare kimarite. He has 4 from the 8 tasukizori which are in the database. There is a lot of room to increase the kimarite number for him, as several more regular kimarite are missing yet.

The Nagoya 2007 mae-zumo results and bouts from Tsukinowa are in the database.

Edited by Doitsuyama, 30 July 2007 - 09:29.


#16 Doitsuyama

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Posted 06 August 2007 - 15:53

There are a few more full banzuke from the Showa-era in the database now with Kyushu 1985, Hatsu 1986, Haru 1986 and Natsu 1986. Full banzuke now are complete from Nagoya 1985 until now. I also have added rikishi details (hatsu dohyo, birth date, real name and shusshin with city or village) for about 270 rikishi. Height and weight also is given for all rikishi on the Kyushu 1985 basho.

Thanks to Fay the lower division kimarite are complete back to Natsu 1999. Juryo kimarite from 1970 to 1973 have been added from Randomitsuki.

Edited by Doitsuyama, 06 August 2007 - 15:54.


#17 Hananotaka

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Posted 07 August 2007 - 21:37

Doitsu, any plans in the future to add 得意技?

#18 Doitsuyama

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Posted 08 August 2007 - 06:31

Doitsu, any plans in the future to add 得意技?

I haven't collected them yet, but it would be a possibility, sure. No time for me to do that, but if someone is willing to enter them, I will add them to the database, even with corresponding search options in the bout query.

#19 Chienoshima

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Posted 08 August 2007 - 19:20

Finally, I may have found a way to return the favor you gave when I wrote my article on ozeki Raiden Tameemon. I checked your website and here is a list of missing data I have in my hand, that may be interesting for you :

1. All basho results (from maezuma to retirement) of the former ozeki KIRISHIMA
2. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna CHIYONOFUJI
3. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna TAIHO
4. All official weight and height measurements of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III
5. Complete hoshitori of the mazeumo and the first basho of the former yokozuna WAKANOHANA III

If you want those data, you will get them.

I got a LOT of data for individual rikishi from Nishinoshima already. Weights and heights once per year are enough I think, and this I like to have for all rikishi, not just a few.


OK, I can imagine that Nishinoshima has A LOT of data on rikishi, but you never know, you may miss the complete hoshitori of ozeki Kirishima Kazuhiro. I guess you can read japanese, and the great Liliane Fujimori did a wonderfull job. You can find all the hoshitori, with opponents and sometimes kimarite in her website. Here is the link : All hoshitori of Kirishima before makuuchi promotion

If you need help on this case, let me know.

Keep up the good work,
Chienoshima

Edited by Chienoshima, 08 August 2007 - 19:25.


#20 Hananotaka

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Posted 11 August 2007 - 21:28

Doitsu, any plans in the future to add 得意技?

I haven't collected them yet, but it would be a possibility, sure. No time for me to do that, but if someone is willing to enter them, I will add them to the database, even with corresponding search options in the bout query.


I just grabbed the 2007 Ozumo Meikan from the local library, with the tokui-te 得意手 data for all Makuuchi rikishi since the Meiji Era. Just let me know what you need me to do. I'm on vacation the rest of the month!

#21 Doitsuyama

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Posted 14 August 2007 - 13:03

Another batch of full Showa era banzuke has been added with Nagoya 1984, Aki 1984, Kyushu 1984, Hatsu 1985, Haru 1985 and Natsu 1985. Thanks to Jakusotsu hoshitori tables have been added for several Showa era banzuke.

#22 Zentoryu

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Posted 17 August 2007 - 22:38

Is there a page that lists all kinboshi, like the Yusho lists?

Or is such information only available on individual rikishi pages?
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#23 Doitsuyama

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Posted 18 August 2007 - 06:39

Is there a page that lists all kinboshi, like the Yusho lists?

Or is such information only available on individual rikishi pages?

No, there isn't. But the Bout Query can be helpful here too.

#24 Zentoryu

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Posted 18 August 2007 - 16:43

Ahh... excellent. That's exactly what I was looking for. Thank-you, I hadn't thought to use the bout query in this case. :-)
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#25 ryafuji

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Posted 20 August 2007 - 20:35

I notice Takamiyama's record is incomplete. I have all his scores if anyone's interested.


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