What makes a university rikishi successful in pro sumo.

[kedevash 43]

When you take a look at all the great university rikishi you can see that a lot of them climb the ranks fast but they tend to hit the wall sooner than excepted.
As an actual exemple, Mitakeumi and Shodai just lost their rank of Ozeki. I agree being Ozeki is a great achievement that not so many will be able to achieve. But in the case of Mitakeumi, with 3 yusho, i excepted him to be yokozuna.

These two became Ozeki, but look at Hokutofuji, Myogiryu, Chiyotairyu, Daimamami, Mitoryu. All these guys struggles to meet their expectations.
 

Why? I'm very curious to know what you think about that.

My guess is, the university sumo scene is a grueling place. You fight a lot of top guys each tournaments and when you arrive to pro sumo, you already a bit spent mentally. When you finish you're collegiate career your style is already define and the bad habbits that come with it, it is maybe difficult to change your craft after a lot of years of fighting the way you did.

 

Thanks for reading me, i'm not a native english speaker so expect a lot of mistakes and maybe a childish language :)

[Millwood 41]

US Pro Football has a similar phenomenon. Top college players, particularly Quarterbacks, have to learn what is essentially a different game, and many college stars fail in the pros.

[rokudenashi 329]

The lads who enter fresh out of middle school are still at a formative age where they become disciples of sumōdō; it becomes their entire life, whereas for university wrestlers who have other life opportunities afforded to them by way of their education, it could feel more like just a “job”. Maybe they’ve already got their future planned out beyond Ōzumō, so they adopt a kind of salaryman mentality to it, content enough with the money and lifestyle afforded to them as a salaried rikishi.

Rikishi with accomplishments at university level clearly have a lot of skill, but what it takes is the desire to work extremely hard to become the very best they can be, something which I think is more easily inculcated at a young age (combined with considerable raw talent of course).

Coming from the university scene where you are a big fish in a small pond, it must be difficult to shed your ego and recognise that you are surrounded by competition just as good as or better than yourself. Easier just to settle in and coast off the talent you’ve already developed prior to joining Ōzumō, perhaps.

Edited December 29, 2022 by rokudenashi

[Hankegami 537]

Although we should be cautious with conclusions especially because this "University talent" thing is relatively recent, at a first glance the University sumo world is not as great as a pipeline as many oyakata probably hoped for. Or better, it's no Yokozuna-making machine. Let's be honest, most University alumni in sumo did great. Reaching Maakuchi alone (top 42 wrestlers of something like 1000 hopefuls) is a done deal. But clearly being a student Yokozuna does almost never translate into an actual Yokozuna. Of many grand university talents that entered Ozumo throughout the years, only two got the rope. Wajima, who was a total monster that became Yokozuna only three years after his debut - from tsukidashi, sure, but no other University Yokozuna ever managed to get any close in fifty years -. And, although not everyone counts him as such, Asahifuji. He was no University Yokozuna like Wajima, but still entered sumo at 20 while enrolled at Kinki University and even won a national tournament for his university (Wikipedia). Wikipedia is not clear whether he graduated or dropped out of college to enter ozumo. He didn't stick around as closely as Wajima for sure, though.

On the other hand, entering ozumo at 15 like tradition wants does not necessarily translate in greater performances. Actually, entering at 18 after high school could be better. Asashoryu shows that, but also Akebono, Musashimaru, and more recently Terunofuji. Notice that all of them are foreigners and, while Asashoryu and Terunofuji were enrolled in Japanese high schools with plans to join ozumo, the Hawaiaans hailed from mighty 'Murica whose high schools have no sumo programs. Other Yokozuna who entered at 18 - either after high school or while working already like Wakanohana I who was spotted while at his job as a dock laborer - include Kotozakura, Sadanoumi, Asashio III, Yoshibayama, Kagamisato, Akinoumi, Haguroyama, and even more. People like Kotozakura, Yoshibayama, and Haguroyama also show that joining at 18 can prospect a long career on the ring. Anyway, joining at 18 is absolutely not problematic at all.

In conclusion, University sumo itself should be the problem. @rokudenashi here above noticed that the University sumo world is a "small pond". Perhaps a parallel can be drawn with Osaka sumo before merging with Tokyo in 1927: the level was too low. University Yokozuna are by no means actual Yokozuna, and they come to learn that at 21-22 years old the hard way. If I remember correctly, moto-Asahifuji of all people (perhaps talking from experience) once warned then-Ozeki Harumafuji that "you don't become Yokozuna just because you want it" (I could be attributing this anecdote wrongly, through, I cannot find its source). Perhaps correcting yourself at 21 after several years of amateur experience is much harder than doing that at 18 with much less preconceptions.

Edited December 29, 2022 by Hankegami

[Katooshu 3,335]

It's important to remember that university rikishi tend to do very well overall. Someone ran the numbers a few years ago, and they make juryo, makuuchi, komusubi, sekiwake, and ozeki at much higher rates than non-collegiate rikishi. Yokozuna was the only rank where this wasn't the case, and even just one more yokozuna from college would've significantly changed the numbers.

I think when rikishi like Hokutofuji, Myogiryu, and Endo are considered to be letdowns, despite spending years in the top division, beating elite opponents, reaching sanyaku, winning several sansho, etc.... it's as much a problem with excessive expectations as it is with them underperforming. And this goes even further when rikishi who reach ozeki like Mitakeumi and Shodai are considered underperformers.

As someone who follows the college scene closely, there is no level of performance in college that would ever convince me someone should be an ozeki or yokozuna, before I've seen them handle the pro ranks. No one should ever assume that being college yokozuna automatically makes someone a strong ozeki prospect or anything like that. 

When it comes to what factors into their pro success, I think some of the following do, which are relevant to any rikishi:

Injury resistance and history: many top amateurs have spent 15 years or more doing sumo and have accumulated wear and tear already from years of tough competition and daily training. Those who are more resistant to injury and who aren't as broken down have an advantage in the pros. Asashiyu's an example of someone underperforming in ozumo due to injuries he also experienced in the amateurs, and I believe Mitoryu's back problem, which he's had since college, has led to him underperforming to a lesser degree. 

Size and strength: collegiate rikishi are smaller on average than sekitori, and this can allow smaller competitors to go further as amateurs, but then find themselves overwhelmed by ozumo's hulks (currently Osanai is experiencing this). Obviously we've had some notable little guys from college doing well in ozumo too, but having the size and strength to hold your own against 160kg+ opponents with ability becomes very important as you climb the ranks.

Mentality: Someone may be able to achieve elite results in college purely on ability, even if they lack motivation or a strong mental game. The highest level of the pros is more challenging than the highest level of the amateurs though, and weaknesses like this, which was perhaps masked in the amateurs, can hold someone back from being able to reach that new level.

Continued development: some collegiate rikishi join ozumo about as good as they ever end up being, others make big strides - look at the trajectories of Asanoyama and Yutakayama. Being in a good heya, with good training partners and coaches, with an open mind to trying new things, can take collegiate competitors to another level.

Arguably the most successful amateur in history, Kushimaumi, spent years and years unmatched through high school and college, and I think it ultimately hurt him, because he'd spent nearly a decade stagnating and winning in the same routine fashion before joining the pros, becoming hardened in a style that proved very basic against ozumo's elite.

The college scene only encompasses athletes from a 4-year span, while ozumo pools a much larger group of competitors (including top college grads from across the years), so at the top end it will always offer more depth and a higher level. 

Edited December 30, 2022 by Katooshu

[Gurowake 4,109]

14 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Arguably the most successful amateur in history, Kushimaumi, spent years and years unmatched through high school and college, and I think it ultimately hurt him, because he'd spent nearly a decade stagnating and winning in the same routine fashion before joining the pros, becoming hardened in a style that proved very basic against elite pros.

That's what I'm worried about with Namakura now.  Very dominant in college, but he had many years not actually getting to fight anyone better.  That kind of thing is what likely encourages so many sports stars in the US to leave college early or enter after high school; if you can make it in the pros immediately, why waste your time in college?  Sumo doesn't have quite the same earning potential, but if you're that good you have a cushy job waiting for you when you retire, and you can always return to college to graduate if you get injured early, whereas you'll only be the same age once.

[kedevash 43]

10 hours ago, Gurowake said:

That's what I'm worried about with Namakura now.

I'm thinking the same. It will be very interesting to the the grow of Nakamura and Ochiai. they both had a very successful amateur career, but they enter ozuma at different age. We will see how different their developpement will be. Ochiai will have good coaching under Hakuho and a lot of good heymate to fight against. Nakamura's choice of heya will be crucial for me.