Kintamayama 47,171 Posted January 30, 2004 Looks like we'll have at least two M15s (Makushita Tsukedashi) this time, and if I remember correctly, maybe three.. Nakano from Musashigawa who postponed his debut due to a wrist injury (Musashigawa, of course..wrist injury..). Now, November's All Japan Student Championship winner Kanbayashi has announced he is joining Hakkaku-beya, and will start at M15 as well. Anyone remember anyone else starting as Tsukedashi, and have there ever been two or more new entrants at tsukedashi in the same basho before? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yubiquitoyama 4 Posted January 30, 2004 Looks like we'll have at least two M15s (Makushita Tsukedashi) this time, and if I remember correctly, maybe three.. Nakano from Musashigawa who postponed his debut due to a wrist injury (Musashigawa, of course..wrist injury..). Now, November's All Japan Student Championship winner Kanbayashi has announced he is joining Hakkaku-beya, and will start at M15 as well. Anyone remember anyone else starting as Tsukedashi, and have there ever been two or more new entrants at tsukedashi in the same basho before? Without checking I seem to recall that there has been as many as 4 or even 5 tsukedashi starters sometimes 1992 or 1993. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 47,171 Posted January 30, 2004 Have there ever been two or more new entrants at tsukedashi in the same basho before? Well, I plumb forgot March 1999 with the triumvirate of Takamisakari (Katou), Kotomitsuki (Kototamiya) and Hamanishiki (Takahama) entering at under 60.. How foolish of me.. I heard there were 4 in 1992, but since it wasn't written in a newspaper lately, I can't give any details. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintamayama 47,171 Posted January 30, 2004 (edited) Anyone remember anyone else starting as Tsukedashi It has been brought to my attention on the SML by Thierry Perran that Yokoyama (Azumazeki) was awarded Tsukedashi status yesterday, so he will be the third (at least..) Edited January 30, 2004 by Kintamayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yubiquitoyama 4 Posted January 30, 2004 (edited) Have there ever been two or more new entrants at tsukedashi in the same basho before? Well, I plumb forgot March 1999 with the triumvirate of Takamisakari (Katou), Kotomitsuki (Kototamiya) and Hamanishiki (Takahama) entering at under 60.. How foolish of me.. I heard there were 4 in 1992, but since it wasn't written in a newspaper lately, I can't give any details. Yes, after checking I can confirm that there were indeed 4 1992.01, namely Hamashu (Hamanoshima), Sakamotoyama (Higonoumi), Nishidayama (Ohinode) and Otori (unsure of reading). Again 4 in 1992.03 with Narimatsu (Naminohana), Wakaadachi (Asanowaka), Ozawa (Asanosho) and Yorifuji (?). Also 4 in 1996.01 with Kumagai (Kaiho), Suzuki (Yotsukasa), Goto (Tochinonada) and Yanagawa (Masutsuyoshi). And 1997.03 with Harada (Hokutoiwa), Tominagayama (Buyuzan), Tamarikido and Taira (Dewataira) And 1998.03 with Tamanonada (Tamanoshima), Saito (Hayateumi), Tamanokuni and Tanaka (Kaito). Edited January 30, 2004 by Yubiquitoyama 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kashunowaka 300 Posted January 31, 2004 Yes, after checking I can confirm that there were indeed 4 1992.01, namely Hamashu (Hamanoshima), Sakamotoyama (Higonoumi), Nishidayama (Ohinode) and Otori (unsure of reading).Again 4 in 1992.03 with Narimatsu (Naminohana), Wakaadachi (Asanowaka), Ozawa (Asanosho) and Yorifuji (?). Also 4 in 1996.01 with Kumagai (Kaiho), Suzuki (Yotsukasa), Goto (Tochinonada) and Yanagawa (Masutsuyoshi). And 1997.03 with Harada (Hokutoiwa), Tominagayama (Buyuzan), Tamarikido and Taira (Dewataira) And 1998.03 with Tamanonada (Tamanoshima), Saito (Hayateumi), Tamanokuni and Tanaka (Kaito). Interesting to see that they have changed shikona almost all of them. I suppose some of them simply enter with their real names, and then take their time until they reach juryo to decide upon a "real" shikona. Are there two Naminohana? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doitsuyama 1,259 Posted January 31, 2004 Are there two Naminohana? Your question piqued my interest and I decided to check. Narimatsu later became Tomonohana. Naminohana had Hatsu dohyo in 1984.05 as Kudo. Yorifuji changed later to Asanofuji, but it didn't help; he never got to Juryo. The other one of this bunch not to reach Juryo is Daiho (not Otori). Almost Taiho, but... Regarding Hamanoshima, I have a source giving his first shikona as Hamasu, not Hamashu. Since this is his real name, it should be possible to find the truth?... I'm sure it was good for Hamanoshima's popularity in Israel that he did change the shikona anyway. Hamasu doesn't figure to get popular there. (You are going off-topic...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 20,213 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) Regarding Hamanoshima, I have a source giving his first shikona as Hamasu, not Hamashu. Since this is his real name, it should be possible to find the truth? I'm not sure if this helps, but the Kyokai itself has his name and first shikona as Hamasu. In other nitpicky Kyokai stuff (not meaning to hijack the thread, but it's really not important enough to make a new one for it) - it looks like they've settled on "Otake" now as the romaji spelling for ex-Takatoriki's toshiyori and heya; it's been changed throughout the site recently (oyakata page, heya page, database). Not really surprising I guess, considering the hall announcer pretty clearly didn't say "Odake" with a soft d/t sound for Roho's introductions during the basho... Edit: One question that came up after I was reading about all the multiple-tsukedashi basho...how does the Kyokai handle their torikumi? Since they're essentially all at the same rank, will these three guys meet each other early on during Haru basho, or does the Kyokai usually put the tsukedashi against regularly-ranked Makushita first? Edited January 31, 2004 by Asashosakari Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yubiquitoyama 4 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) Are there two Naminohana? Your question piqued my interest and I decided to check. Narimatsu later became Tomonohana. Naminohana had Hatsu dohyo in 1984.05 as Kudo. Yorifuji changed later to Asanofuji, but it didn't help; he never got to Juryo. The other one of this bunch not to reach Juryo is Daiho (not Otori). Almost Taiho, but... Yes, it did say Tomonohana in my lists but I got confused (In a state of confusion...) Regarding Hamanoshima, I have a source giving his first shikona as Hamasu, not Hamashu. Since this is his real name, it should be possible to find the truth?... I'm sure it was good for Hamanoshima's popularity in Israel that he did change the shikona anyway. Hamasu doesn't figure to get popular there. Edited January 31, 2004 by Yubiquitoyama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doitsuyama 1,259 Posted January 31, 2004 One question that came up after I was reading about all the multiple-tsukedashi basho...how does the Kyokai handle their torikumi? Since they're essentially all at the same rank, will these three guys meet each other early on during Haru basho, or does the Kyokai usually put the tsukedashi against regularly-ranked Makushita first? Interesting question. I looked at the Haru 1999 basho with the well known tsukedashi Kototamiya, Kato and Takahama which gives a good enough example. On day 1 Kototamiya was paired against Ms57w Wakashinobu, on day 2 Kato went against Ms57w Komanofuji and Takahama against Ms56w Wakatenro. Normally neighbouring winners are paired against each other for their second bout, but even for the second bout the tsukedashi matchup was avoided: On day 3 Kato and Kototamiya went against Ms56w Wakatenro and Ms55w Nishikikaze. And on day 11 the two 4-1 tsukedashi Kato and Kototamiya finally met to start their onlasting rivalry with a win for Kato. By the way, Ms56w Wakatenro had his third bout on day 5 against Kototamiya and won this too, completing a sweep against all three tsukedashi who of course later went on to reach Makuuchi. Wakatenro reached Juryo in Kyushu 2001 and was in and out of Juryo since then, finishing the last basho with 0-4-11 at his career high rank J8w. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 20,213 Posted January 31, 2004 Interesting question. And an even more interesting answer...thank you very much! (You are going off-topic...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yoavoshimaru 0 Posted February 2, 2004 Two tsukedashi means Ms15e and Ms15w, right? How are three or more ranked? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doitsuyama 1,259 Posted February 2, 2004 No it doesn't mean Ms15e and Ms15w. Those are regular ranks filled with established rikishi. Tsukedashi just means tsukedashi = "attached", plain and simple. They are attached to the banzuke and I don't believe they have an official rank or tozai (= East or West). Formally they are on a level with mae-zumo deshi, in their hatsu-dohyo basho. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kaikitsune Makoto 210 Posted February 3, 2004 Tsukedashi guys are always a golden input! Three is a lot. Talent accumulates. Hopefully capitalization happens. More tsukedashi, more flavour! More tai-chi! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kashunowaka 300 Posted February 3, 2004 No it doesn't mean Ms15e and Ms15w. Those are regular ranks filled with established rikishi. Tsukedashi just means tsukedashi = "attached", plain and simple. They are attached to the banzuke and I don't believe they have an official rank or tozai (= East or West). Formally they are on a level with mae-zumo deshi, in their hatsu-dohyo basho. I thought makushita tsukedashi started at the bottom of makushita (like your Haru 1999 example), not makushita 15 ... Has that been changed? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 20,213 Posted February 3, 2004 No it doesn't mean Ms15e and Ms15w. Those are regular ranks filled with established rikishi. Tsukedashi just means tsukedashi = "attached", plain and simple. They are attached to the banzuke and I don't believe they have an official rank or tozai (= East or West). Formally they are on a level with mae-zumo deshi, in their hatsu-dohyo basho. I thought makushita tsukedashi started at the bottom of makushita (like your Haru 1999 example), not makushita 15 ... Has that been changed? Yep, it's been Ms15 (and possibly Ms10, although that hasn't happened yet) since late 2000. Details here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yoavoshimaru 0 Posted February 3, 2004 So which is it? No rank or Ms15? (Clapping wildly...) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Asashosakari 20,213 Posted February 3, 2004 (edited) So which is it? Edited February 3, 2004 by Asashosakari Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yubiquitoyama 4 Posted February 4, 2004 A photo has emerged of Kanbayashi, together with Hakkaku-oyakata: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kotoseiya Yuichi 3 Posted February 4, 2004 I presume he's from Fukuoka prefecture? Usually the symbol is drawn more thickly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
