Kosho status thingy heating up?

[Kintamayama 47,193]

Hi!

Kitanoumi rijicho said there is no way he was going to listen to the Rikishi-kai's (Rikishi's association) views on the planned Koshou status abolishment. "I won't listen to their requests. If I start listening, we'll never get anything done", he said.

A meeting is planned by the Kyokai after the Nagoya basho, and the aim is to push for a complete and total abolishment of the kosho status for all ranks. A decision like this will surely affect some Rikishi's livelihood, the papers say.

"The rikishi should gear themselves towards strengthening their bodies", added Kitanoumi Rijicho.

The head of the Rikishi Association, one Musashimaru, when asked to comment on this, said, " I would like to hear this directly from the Rijicho. Till then, I can not make any comments,", elegantly skirting the issue at hand.

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

JAPAN TIMES July 7 2003

"Major strike disturbs sumo community"

When the first day of the Nagoya basho took place in Nagoya Prefectural Gymnasium Sunday July 6th, there was nothing normal about it. When the Juryo division (second division) matches came to an end and the highest division of Makunouchi was to start nothing happened. When the wrestlers were to enter the dohyo instead a heavy silence overtook the arena until the announcement came that the Makunouchi matches were cancelled for the day after which the yumitori-shiki was performed in front of a stunned audience.

In fact the crisis started much earlier on the day and came about after a series of disagreements between the head of the Nihon Sumo Kyokai, Kitanoumi-rijicho and the rikishi organization the rikishi-kai. About the same time the first matches of the lower divisions took place in the prefectural gymnasium, the Makunouchi rikishi, lead by active Yokozuna Musashimaru, one of the leaders of the rikishi-kai, took refuge in a chanko restaurant in central Nagoya and barricaded themselves demanding a series of changes in the conditions for rikishi within the Nihon Sumo Kyokai.

The rule change that enranged the rikishi-kai was the abolishment of the kosho, public injury rule, which let a rikishi who injured himselves during a basho, sit out one tournament without losing rank. In the light of an increasing number of injuries especially in the upper divisions, as well as some suspected misuse of the rule in question, Kitanoumi together with the board of directors of the Nihon Sumo Kyokai took the controversial decision to completely abandon the system for every division in Ozumo. The rikishi-kai who had several objections, both to the description of the injury-situation as well as the proposed solution was completely overrun by the decision and their opinions were brutally squashed by Kitanoumi-rijicho, who earlier commented his view on the rikishi-kai:

"I won't listen to their requests. If I start listening, we'll never get anything done. The rikishi should gear themselves towards strengthening their bodies".

The response came early yesterday morning when the whole top division refused to work under the new conditions and saw to make their point by the strike which has already come to be called "the Musashimaru incident". From the chanko restaurant he comments the situation as:

"We're bigger, stronger and better rikishi than the old hawks ever were. If they think that they can make us less injury-prone by demanding we stop getting injured, they are even less reality-minded than we thought. It's not possible to work under conditions where the Kyokai think they can run the show without even caring about the rikishi. This should show them that they have very little to gain by alianating their biggest asset".

A list of demands was handed to Futagoyama-oyakata who came to the restaurant and started negotiations with Musashimaru and the rest of the top division rikishi. The talks are likely to continue today and it's still uncertain whether any top division matches can at all take place in Nagoya this year. Kitanoumi was sought for a comment but was not available all of yesterday.

(Applauding...) :-S :-)

Edited June 5, 2003 by Yubiquitoyama

[Dejimasama 0]

Good post. I really hadnt looked at the problem from that point of view yet. Due to this post I find I need to sit down and rethink my opinon of this whole mess. Thanks! (Applauding...)

[Kintamayama 47,193]

JAPAN TIMES- JULY 8th

After yesterday's surprise last-minute Makuuchi rikishi's strike, all eyes in Japan have suddenly turned to the lately- popularity -dwindled sport of Sumo. All evening TV and radio News broadcasts (and most evening shows) in Japan and in many countries around the world opened with lengthy stories on this subject. At 10 PM, Kitanoumi Rijicho held a press conference in front of 650(!!) reporters, an unheard of number before today, apropos Sumo, the "forgotten sport".

"We were abhorred by the Makuuchi rikishi's undignified action today. Till further notice, ALL Makuuchi rikishi who will not show up for day two will be suspended from the Banzuke. Juuryou rikishi will receive temporary Makuuchi ranks, and for all intents and purposes, their matches will be regarded as Makuuchi matches. We have received word that 4 stables (Takasago, Sadogatake, Futagoyama and Kokonoe) have persuaded their rikishi to return, so we at least have a Yokozuna and an Oozeki. I sincerely hope the other Oyakatas will succeed in reigning in their rikishi as well. As for the ring-leader Musashimaru, the Yokozuna Deliberation Council will hold a special midnight session to decide if his actions warrant appropriate steps to be taken""

An ultimatum has been issued- all those not back by day three will be automatically retired.

As a side note, ALL tickets for the coming days have been sold in a matter of two hours. There have been over 90,000 tickets pre-ordered for the Aki basho as well in a matter of 8 hours, and the orders are still pouring in at this time. Kyokai oficials said off the record that there has never been so much interest in Sumo in modern history.

[Fujisan 533]

It wouldnt surprise me at all Yubi-

I say its time to give Kitanoumi permanent Kosho status for psychiatric reasons-Cos this is mental.

[QttP 0]

JAPAN TIMES- JULY 8th

After yesterday's surprise last-minute Makuuchi rikishi's strike, all eyes in Japan have suddenly turned to the lately- popularity -dwindled sport of Sumo. All evening TV and radio News broadcasts (and most evening shows) in Japan and in many countries around the world opened with lengthy stories on this subject. At 10 PM, Kitanoumi Rijicho held a press conference in front of 650(!!) reporters, an unheard of number before today, apropos Sumo, the "forgotten sport".

"We were abhorred by the Makuuchi rikishi's undignified action today. Till further notice, ALL Makuuchi rikishi who will not show up for day two will be suspended from the Banzuke. Juuryou rikishi will receive temporary Makuuchi ranks, and for all intents and purposes, their matches will be regarded as Makuuchi matches. We have received word that 4 stables (Takasago, Sadogatake, Futagoyama and Kokonoe) have persuaded their rikishi to return, so we at least have a Yokozuna and an Oozeki. I sincerely hope the other Oyakatas will succeed in reigning in their rikishi as well. As for the ring-leader Musashimaru, the Yokozuna Deliberation Council will hold a special midnight session to decide if his actions warrant appropriate steps to be taken""

An ultimatum has been issued- all those not back by day three will be automatically retired.

As a side note, ALL tickets for the coming days have been sold in a matter of two hours. There have been over 90,000 tickets pre-ordered for the Aki basho as well in a matter of 8 hours, and the orders are still pouring in at this time. Kyokai oficials said off the record that there has never been so much interest in Sumo in modern history.

As much as the events described in Yubi's post are unlikely to take place, what's described in your post is simply impossible. LOL, automatically retire all the makuuchi rikishi?

[Kotoseiya Yuichi 3]

We have received word that 4 stables (Takasago, Sadogatake, Futagoyama and Kokonoe) have persuaded their rikishi to return

No way! Mitsuya wouldn't take any of it! >(Applauding...) :-S

[Onnagumo 4]

We have received word that 4 stables (Takasago, Sadogatake, Futagoyama and Kokonoe) have persuaded their rikishi to return

No way! Mitsuya wouldn't take any of it! >:-( :-P

And he would be absolutely right, IMHO. (Applauding...)

I wouldn't dare to accuse any of the rikishi of misusing the kosho rule, but I'm sure Kotonowaka never does that (okay, I just might be a little biased here (In love...) :-S ). Everyone knows by now how bad his left knee is. There were many times when I wondered why the .... he was on the dohyo, when he could hardly put any weight on that leg and he had no balance at all. But he was there anyway. He always shows up, unless it is absolutely impossible.

Gee, Kitanoumi sure has a funny way of saying thank you to such rikishi..... :-)

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

Yubiquitoyama-zeki, I think you should consider a career in journalism: great writing and creativity! :-S

I for one tend to think nothing is impossible.

I also think the (NSK, not our forum) Rijicho has a big mouth, and wants to deliver a message. I don't know what he really intends to do. But he doesn't have the power to eliminate kosho status by himself, right? It must be approved by a council, correct? What have other council members said in public, if anything?

As always, I try to construct parallels with other sports:

- Basketball: team sport, no "ranks" to be demoted. Players get injured, take however long they need to heal (with pay during this time), then come back. Same for soccer, football, other team sports I think.

- Tennis: individual sport, with ranks. Players get injured, and lose points if they can't play, dropping them down in the rankings. How far they drop depends on how they did during the past 12 months and how well their competitors do. I think this is very similar to sumo. Tennis has no kosho equivalent at all. (The above applies to the professional ATP tour)

- Golf: just about the same as tennis (for the professional PGA tour).

- F1: very similar. You get injured, you can't race, other people pick up points, so you could drop in the standings. No kosho rule.

So it appears that eliminating the kosho rule will make sumo more similar to other individual athlete sports, no? I don't know if that's good or bad, just observing. (Applauding...)

[Kintamayama 47,193]

As much as the events described in Yubi's post are unlikely to take place, what's described in your post is simply impossible. LOL, automatically retire all the makuuchi rikishi?

No, you misread me as usual. ONLY THOSE NOT BACK FOR DAY THREE....Since four heyas have already had second thoughts, and maybe , in my story, they all came back on day three, so all this would not have been necessary?

Impossible? There is only one thing impossible in Sumo, and that is of course Chiyotaikai becoming Yokozuna.

And of course mass retirements/firings CAN happen. It happened before, BTW, when the Oosaka branch broke off from the Tokyo branch to make a new Kyokai, The Oosaka Sumo Kyookai. The Tokyo branch then fired the dissidents..

Edited June 6, 2003 by Kintamayama

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

As much as the events described in Yubi's post are unlikely to take place, what's described in your post is simply impossible. LOL, automatically retire all the makuuchi rikishi?

No, you misread me as usual. ONLY THOSE NOT BACK FOR DAY THREE....Since four heyas have already had second thoughts, and maybe , in my story, they all came back on day three, so all this would not have been necessary?

Impossible? There is only one thing impossible in Sumo, and that is of course Chiyotaikai becoming Yokozuna.

And of course mass retirements/firings CAN happen. It happened before, BTW, when the Oosaka branch broke off from the Tokyo branch to make a new Kyokai, The Oosaka Sumo Kyookai. The Tokyo branch then fired the dissidents..

I mainly thought of the Mikawashima incident of 1923 when I wrote the initial post. Indeed, Onishiki, one of the great Yokozunas of the 20th century (although now mainly forgotten despite him being pretty much the equal of the much-more-remembered Tochigiyama of the same time), retired as a consequence of that strike, which was actually the rikishi-kai locking themselves in a restaurant called Mikawashima. The more famous Shunjuen incident of 1932 was in many ways similar but actually ended with the start of new Sumo Organizations whose rikishi of course were "retired" at least during the time of them being part of rebellion organizations. I don't think it would happen exactly that way today, but who knows, if Kitanoumi comes into his stride (Applauding...)

Edited June 6, 2003 by Yubiquitoyama

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

There are big differences between sumo and all the sports you list. It's not really comparable for many reasons.

- Basketball: team sport, no "ranks" to be demoted.

Edited June 6, 2003 by Yubiquitoyama

[Manekineko 200]

Re: July news.

(Applauding...)

[Takanobaka 0]

The worst that could happen is that they have to start qualifying tournaments, but even so, they only lose the time of their injury. If they are good enough, they can still fight for the same titles, and doesn't normally have to start over in another division (although some do, to get the match training while coming back after long-time injuries). Also, the rankings are over a year, so when the new year begins, everyone start at scratch.

Rankings hold over in Tennis, and in certail situations they will hold a person's ranking (see: Monica Seles). Only the money leaders start anew every year, and that doesn't have much to do with rankings (which regard any given 12 month period).

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

Rankings hold over in Tennis, and in certail situations they will hold a person's ranking (see: Monica Seles).

Edited June 7, 2003 by Yubiquitoyama

[Zentoryu 154]

- Basketball: team sport, no "ranks" to be demoted. Players get injured, take however long they need to heal (with pay during this time), then come back. Same for soccer, football, other team sports I think.

Sumo rikishi *don't* recieve the same pay when they come back after a long abscence. A Makuuchi rikishi who gets injured (unless a Yokozuna) and misses a year will find himself either in lower Juryo or high Makushita. The pay levels there a dramatically different. If he ends up in Makushita, we're talking about the difference between say $11,000 US *per month* as a Maegashira to only $1,250 *per basho* as an upper Makushita. For a Sumo wrestler, that's a huge difference and a dramatic price to pay for being injured and dropping down the ranks.

In team sports, you can miss a whole year and still make the same money when you come back that you were making when you were injured and likely made during the time you were injured. They don't have to pay the price that Sumo wrestlers pay for getting injured, except in the rare case that an athlete suffers a career ending injury.

- Tennis: individual sport, with ranks. Players get injured, and lose points if they can't play, dropping them down in the rankings. How far they drop depends on how they did during the past 12 months and how well their competitors do. I think this is very similar to sumo. Tennis has no kosho equivalent at all. (The above applies to the professional ATP tour)

But tennis players don't get paid based on their ranks either. This is an important point to remember.

If a tennis player drops in the ranks, the only thing it really effects is their seeding for upcoming tournaments. They still have the same opportunity to win money as any other player that enters a tournament. Their road may be a bit harder because of the lower seeding, but the opportunity to win the big money by winning a tournament has not changed.

This applies to golf as well.

Chiyotenzan remarked at the end of last basho (when his promotion back to Juryo was announced) how happy he was to return to the Sekitori (paid) ranks. He had a family to support and spending the last couple of basho in Makushita, where he could get little more than the above mentioned $1,000 per basho, was really difficult for him and his family.

This is what every Sekitori ranked wrestler faces, and fears, when they get injured, ie. the loss of rank and the money that goes with it. (Applauding...)