Can any one help me join a Heya?

[Guest Mojo]

Can any one help me join a Heya in Japan?

I am asking here if any one can help me directly or if any one can help me with some good advice on how to join....?

[Guest Mojo]

...........any one?....no?...... (In a state of confusion...) .......no one has any good advice for me... (In a state of confusion...)

(Sigh...)

[Jesinofuji 11]

Daaramu was in a heya briefly. Maybe you could try out at the heya he was in? I think, don't quote me, he contacted Sentoryu http://www.sentoryu.com/ who at least when he was wrestling checked his website regularly and really responded to everyone who posted on his message board. I'm not sure, but what could it hurt to try?

edit: oh and by the way, did you streach your legs today? That excercise where they force you into the splits... (I was stupid...)

Edited March 28, 2004 by Jesinofuji

[Guest Mojo]

Daaramu-san has told me (as I remember) that there is already a new foreigner at Tomozuna beya, so that path will not work for me...

Edit: Yes I did streach my legs today, but I can not yet do Matawari...

Edited March 28, 2004 by Mojo

[Jesinofuji 11]

Hmmm (Oops! ) well in that case, if it were me, I'd seriously look at going to a Japanese university that had a good Sumo program. I think it would be easy to find a sutible heya for one who has alot of success in university sumo.

[Guest Mojo]

Hmmm (Oops! ) well in that case, if it were me, I'd seriously look at going to a Japanese university that had a good Sumo program. I think it would be easy to find a sutible heya for one who has alot of success in university sumo.

Jesinofuji-san, (I am with smart...)

I have given your idea up there alot of thought and I think that it is perhaps the best path to choose. I think I will try to do some searching and hopefully I will find some thing. If any one knows of any good links that could help me please post them. :-)

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

Wouldn't Japanese fluency be a requirement for admission into a Japanese university?

[Guest Mojo]

Wouldn't Japanese fluency be a requirement for admission into a Japanese university?

Yes, I think it would, I have just started learning Japanese so hopefully I will be fluent in a year or so...

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

Good luck, it's tough to do in a year...

[Guest Mojo]

Most Japanese universities require a JLPT-2 level certification (or equivalent). A few require JLPT-1 (which is a higher degree of fluency than some native speakers have).

Unless you have a tremendous ability for learning languages quickly, it will be almost impossible to reach the needed fluency within one year. (It *MIGHT* be possible if you were living in Japan and used nothing but Japanese for the entire year, but even then it would be unlikely.)

However, if you study very hard (for both written and spoken language), you could probably reach JLPT-2 level in 2-3 years. It really depends upon you aptitude for learning languages and your devotion to doing so. And don't be surprised if it takes more like 3-5 years.

Yes, well I'll look in to it in more detail before I make any decisions.....

Ohh yes Daaramu what are you doing now? I don't surpose you still want to be a sumotori? seeing as you gave that up so fast... :-)

Why did you give it up so fast Daaramu? You never said...

[Mark Buckton 1]

Wouldn't Japanese fluency be a requirement for admission into a Japanese university?

Yes, I think it would, I have just started learning Japanese so hopefully I will be fluent in a year or so...

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

[Guest Mojo]

Wouldn't Japanese fluency be a requirement for admission into a Japanese university?

Yes, I think it would, I have just started learning Japanese so hopefully I will be fluent in a year or so...

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

Hmmm.... "ugly thing envy"

[Yubiquitoyama 4]

Wouldn't Japanese fluency be a requirement for admission into a Japanese university?

Yes, I think it would, I have just started learning Japanese so hopefully I will be fluent in a year or so...

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

Hmmm.... "ugly thing envy"

:-)

It does seem rather unrealistic, to me as well. Japanese is quite a difficult language and to learn it away from Japan in less than a year seems difficult bordering to the impossible, at least for most of us. If you are unusually good with languages though, maybe you can do it, but I wouldn't count on it. I wish you well in your quest, but I think you should be prepared for the eventuality that it proves more difficult than that.

;-)

Edited April 2, 2004 by Yubiquitoyama

[Guest Mojo]

I never thought it was going to be easy......

[Kaikitsune Makoto 210]

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

How was it with you btw? Since you are a professional linquist and evidently have lived in Japan for a long time (and do you even have a Japanese wife?) or at least stayed there for a long time, when did you feel you were fluent in Japanese? How long did it take? Can you go to Okinawa and understand their dialect? Do you master many kanji?

Many foreigners in Japan have learned the spoken language well but have not learned much at all in kanji-world. I wonder how Akebono can write in Japanese without relying solely on hiragana and katakana...

[Guest Mojo]

Daaramu-san I am very sorry that my previous post sounded sarcastic, I admit it does but I did not mean it to, sorry.

I have read your post in the Sumo Mailing List, I understand how it may be difficult...

QUOTE (from Daaramu-san's post on the SML)

I should have been told to go home then. But the oyakata is a nice guy

(though quite stern, like a good oyakata should be) and said I could stay

and keep trying until Jan. 21 (original return flight date).

Daaramu-san how long were you meant to be there for? and how long does it take to train a sumo, do you know? :-)

After your return flight home when would you have gone back to tomozuna if you had not quit?

Edited April 3, 2004 by Mojo

[Jesinofuji 11]

Yeah, its a hard language to learn, but if you keep at it your going to learn something. JPL2 in a year might be pushing it. I think, don't quote me, but I think that there are some universities that will allow people in with less than JPL2. When foreigners who do not have enough Nihongo enroll, they are first put into Japanese classes.

Either way, your really going to have to hammer down your Kanji if this is what you want to do. Most, including myself, believe that the reading and writing is the hardest part of the Japanese language to learn, and its whats going to be tested the most when you apply.

Even if you don't go the Uni route, if your going to be a Sumo wrestler in Japan, it would be a great idea to know as much Japanese as possible no? Just keep at it, and learn a little bit more every day and you'll find that its not really that hard.

Oh and BTW, did you streach today? Just thinking of the some of the excercises Rikishi do hurts.

[Gaijinohana 0]

My old roommate from college has lived in Japan for 10 years and considers himself fluent(his wife says he speaks japanese better than more japanese). That being said even he has a very difficult time with Kanji. I have been studying Mandarin for 3 years and work on it 2 hours a night and I still have a difficult time reading. Granted...it's all characters. I would imagine that it will take a minimum of 4-5 hours a day of solid reading and speaking to get to level that could be considered fluent in a year.

[Naganoyama 6,028]

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

...lived in Japan for a long time (and do you even have a Japanese wife?) ...

Perhaps this phrase may contain the seeds of a good idea Mojo. Perhaps what you need to kick-start your Japanese is to go to Japan and get a Japanese girlfriend. I hope this does not offend you as a suggestion. I don't mean it to.

I obviously don't know how difficult this would be. Perhaps you could get enrolled on some sort of course (perhaps with a less demanding language requirement than a University degree) in order to get a visa.

Sorry to be so unspecific, but a good way to learn a language is to need to use it to talk to someone special.

[Mark Buckton 1]

I wonder how Akebono can write in Japanese without relying solely on hiragana and katakana...

Compulsory lessons when he first started - both in the language as a foreigner and in calligraphy as a rikishi

[Mark Buckton 1]

Perhaps you could get enrolled on some sort of course (perhaps with a less demanding language requirement than a University degree) in order to get a visa.

Sorry to be so unspecific, but a good way to learn a language is to need to use it to talk to someone special.

On the first bit - pretty hard and need lots of parental cash behind you, tax returns etc (limited work OK though) Parent's work record is a recent consideration before a visa is issued.

Also - a completed education in your own country is pretty much taken as a given now to ensure no bums or dropouts who just happen to be loaded etc.

And, if a language course is completed that in and of itself isn't always enough to get a Uni place. Back to your school record in country of origin and cash reserves. Justice Ministry site should provide a better guide (immigration falling under their jurisdiction)

Furthermore, some serious crimes committed by foreign students are putting a bit of a grip on this. The crims I refer to were Chinese but the 'grip'......?

The last bit - true indeed :-) ;-) but you pick up feminine Japanese sometimes that way

[Kaikitsune Makoto 210]

kick-start your Japanese is to go to Japan and get a Japanese girlfriend

And think of the advantages in disputes. To "You don't understand anything!!!" you can honestly reply "I don't understand all my dear, after all I am not that good with nihongo yet..." :-)

And imagine the delecate way to get to know someone when you don't have common language and language barrier forces you to read more of the unspoken language/gesture language and also really listen to each other carefully ;-)

But then again you need patience but motivation to learn should be high. (Heart)

[Mark Buckton 1]

How was it with you btw? Since you are a professional linquist and evidently have lived in Japan for a long time (and do you even have a Japanese wife?) or at least stayed there for a long time, when did you feel you were fluent in Japanese? How long did it take? Can you go to Okinawa and understand their dialect? Do you master many kanji?

Kakitsune-san,

First, I think you mistake a linguist as being a person capable of conversing in a language. Far from the case oftentimes. A linguist is often more of a 'scientist' of a language specialising in areas like wealth VS language use or living environment VS same or even why Japanese is linked to Spanish and Turkish linguistically speaking yet is so separated geographically.

I can converse well in Japanese, don't have any major difficulties in day to day life but do have difficulty with various bits of jargon (banking, medical etc)

I can't put a time on how long it took per se as I don't ever see myself as being perfect. I (hope I) improve daily. I do often use some words or phrases that Japanese are unfamiliar with but that goes into the realms of jargon, sociolinguistics and of course education levels of both speaker and listener. My interests carry words not used everyday and not always expected of a foreigner - eg. sumo related jargon

Okinawa - no major problems with the dialect (haven't been there though do have Okinawan friends in Tokyo) Tohoku-ben is more difficult I think.

Kanji - quite a lot. Same situation as in paragraph 3 above but although I can what I consider a fair amount I cannot write that same number. Hiragana, katakana - learnt it before I came in a couple of days in Oz.

Hope this answers your q's

Edited April 3, 2004 by Adachinoryu

[Kaikitsune Makoto 210]

First, I think you mistake a linguist as being a person capable of conversing in a language. Far from the case oftentimes. A linguist is often more of a 'scientist' of a language specialising in areas like wealth VS language use or living environment VS same or even why Japanese is linked to Spanish and Turkish linguistically speaking yet is so separated geographically

All right. I had a bit narrow view. Thought linguist is some kind of a general term for people experts/professionals in languages as such (intepreters, translators, language teachers, professional writers etc.)

Thanks for the answers to questions!

One of the experiences that would be cool to have is to go into a country for a year and not have much target country's language skill at the start and experience the daily development and becoming more or less fluent at the end of the year (depending on how active in communicating in the language of the country of course, Japan must be a good place in this sense as English skills are not so good there, whereas in Finland for example a foreign hockey player can live and play here for 5 years and leave then having a vocabulary of 20 words in Finnish...).

[Guest Mojo]

Very unrealistic if not in the country to start with

...lived in Japan for a long time (and do you even have a Japanese wife?) ...

Perhaps this phrase may contain the seeds of a good idea Mojo. Perhaps what you need to kick-start your Japanese is to go to Japan and get a Japanese girlfriend. I hope this does not offend you as a suggestion. I don't mean it to.

I obviously don't know how difficult this would be. Perhaps you could get enrolled on some sort of course (perhaps with a less demanding language requirement than a University degree) in order to get a visa.

Sorry to be so unspecific, but a good way to learn a language is to need to use it to talk to someone special.

Naganoyama-san, Yes maybe I could get enrolled on some sort of course...

No of course your suggestion does not offend me, I think I would like a Japanese girlfriend (In a state of confusion...) Your idea of enrolling on a course with less demanding language requirement than a University degree is a good idea. (Blinking...)