genghis

Hmm, standards of mongolian sumo... I think Asa and other mongolian rikishi appreciate true sumo more then mongolian equivalent, are not they? IMO mongolian wrestling gives no advantage over Japanese or European rikishi. Asa is where he is because of his talent and sumo workout under eyes of Japanese oyakata. Well, there is an unlimited space (actually an open grassland like a golf court), and no time limit in Monoglian sumo. That is why you have to win by only technique and stamina. No luck, or trick at tawara or giujo decision helps. You have to win in a decisive way. PS: Hakuho, Asashoryu, Ama, Tokitenku, Asasekiryu are all from well known wrestlers' family and they had years of training before they come to Japan. Kyokushuzan was a junior champion before he came to Japan. Heard, that Mokonami and Ryoyu also are from wrestlers' family.

On Hakuho: We already know what future Hakuho holds. But I never liked his style before: backpedalling, hitting, punching, etc.and etc. The bout against Mickey last basho looked quite like a street fight. But this basho, he seems to show a manly competition, at last. So, he is barely getting where he should be, but the follow up remains to be seen. Physically he is already a monster. But he should continue this manly sumo for his dignity. On Asashoryu: I have no word but phenomenal. I think, he brougth the sumo to the equal footing as the other high profile professional sports in terms of athlethism. He even loses with grace, figthing, showing great athletism. His performance is quite remarkable even by the standards of mongolian sumo. I think, his most amazing performances are still to be seen in the coming years, against ever increasing competition. On Tochiazuma: I think our Ozekis remain as ozeki for a reason. What can you say if the council decides them not fit for Yokozuna? The council is doing their job. No current ozeki has shown a Yokozuna authority so far. And I don't see them changing in the coming months. On Kotooshu: Imagine Kotooshu adding just 5 millimeters in his major muscles. There you have a king kong. Barring injuries, he could be a major obstacle in Hakuho's way. However, he has to learn from the fact that he was not even close to the yokozuna with one arm. On the basho: Hakuho's mental strength is still to be seen. He will probably lose one or so to maegeshira rikishi. Asashoryu will still teach the young Mongolian some lesson this time. So, in the end, we are looking at Asashoryu again, only leaner and meaner. (Laughing...)

It's yorikiri, and it's not 60%. Far from it. Still, it's the most frequent kimarite, yes. Far more important is the second sentence here. Interestingly the frequence of yorikiri RISES when you rise the ranks, from Makushita to Makuuchi. Some great Yokozuna like Kitanoumi and Takanohana perfected that so much, that they won really often with yorikiri. I thus think a higher frequency of yorikiri might be indicative of a good wrestler. While I might easily be wrong, I at least gave some examples. Where are your examples? It is easy to put up hypotheses, even bold ones, with great conviction. Those who make the boldest statements, often don't bother to come up with some evidence. I fear you are no different here. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree with that higher ranking wrestlers use yurikiri more often. I agree that yukiri itself is a trip that every rikishi must master. More yurikiri at higher rank might mean that high ranking wrestlers are usually the ones superior in strength and technique, so they are not always in need to resort to highly acrobatic trips at first place. It doesn't mean they forgot the other trips, lost their skills or shape to perform them, is it?

Sain bna uu BuBa, I was delighted to be greated by a fellow mongolian. 1. I never said yurikiri is a bad trip (read the ongoing conversation fully). In fact 60 % of all winning techniques is yurikiri. I said, someone with only yurikiri in his disposal isn't a good wrestler. 2. I think boh and sumo have more in common than a difference. Nevertheless, your philosophical reflection on the difference of boh and sumo is agreed by many, including me. However, I should say that I just don't remember when I actually compared buh with the sumo. You might be confusing my say about mongolian amateur sumo wrestlers (who, you know, were quite successful during early 90s and paved the way for professionals). As a fellow mongolian, I understand as much as you that boh cannot be compared with the sumo. 3. As of Asashoryu, his name is already far often mentioned in all sumo related topic (just google with "sumo", and do some arithmetics), so I just don't understand why I cannot refer to him as much as others do? Nevertheless, you might want to read my posts fully to find out that there are, indeed, mentioned far many different rikishi, and they are just treated as equal, regardless of their nativity. Your post was, however, indicative that you care about mongolians while being critical about their repuatation, which is a very good thing. BTW,

Found this interview from a mongolian paper "Zuunii Medee", which claims got this from Yomiuri. Q: Nagoya basho is getting very interesting, Who, do you think, will get the yusho? T: The basho is not over yet, but Asashoryu is the favourite. Q: Is there anyone who can stop him? T: Hakuho, Roho and Kotooshu are potential upsetters if they try really hard. They, I think, will put a reasonable pressure on Asashoryu. Q: What makes Asashoryu so special? T: Naturally given talent, speed and strenght. Such a good wrestler is a rarity. Q: What are the potentials of ozeki Kaio and Tochiazuma? T: I know how strong is Kaio. To be honest, I don't think Kaio will win a yousho and become Yokozuna. However strong is a wrestler, it is pretty clear that there will be no big achievements after their 30s. But it is quite an achievement that of one of the wrestlers from my generation is still competing equally with youngsters. It is important for him to retire without a serious injury. Q: Why? T: I retired due to a serious injury. Injury was a real problem when I stopped wrestling. The pain is stronger after the training is stopped. I suffered a lot because of this. Q: Who will success Asashoryu's throne? T: There is a potential in Hakuho, Roho and Kotooshu. Q: You favour Kisenosato? T: He is a good wrestler. He clearly lacks an experience. If coached well, he will certainly achieve a lot. Q: Who, from your beya, will achieve Juryo first? T: I recruited quite a few youngsters in my beya and I tried my best in choosing them. I have no doubt that an outstanding wrestlers will rise from among them. But we need at least two years. Q: Will you recruit from abroad T: I thought about it when I become an Oykata and decided to recruit from Latin America. But my father has strongly dissaproved this idea and reminded me that I took over a famious beya, so I should revive this beya only with Japanese wrestlers. So, now I don't need to recruit from abroad and my goal is to groom my beya wrestlers. Q: Your late father's contribution to sumo was great. He closely watched over a unity among wrestlers. But there is a critisism going around that he wasn't able to educate his children. Your say? T: My late father fully committed himself to sumo Q: What is the underlying reason behind the friction with your brother? Last year your father told in an interview that he is to blame for this rift? T: My father has nothing to do with this. We are to blame. My brother is very stubborn and his attitude changed when he become ozeki. He didn't like his younger brother acheiving more than this. I ignored everything at the begining and even let him win in one yousho bout. But I should say that he didn't understand all these. I tried my best but didn't succeed. Our relationship has worsened after my father passed away. Q: Is your brother still playing American Football? T: No, he is looking after his business in Tokyo. Q: Is it true that you are about to hire ex-Ozeki Musoyama as assistant coach? T: I proposed him this position, it is up to him now.

I didn't think that closure of this poll would be so sudden. I am pretty upset by Hakuho's injury. Lets hope that he will recover in September. Thank you all for participating in this poll.

I sure hope it is not a career-threatening injury. It would be overly pessimistic to think that. If it's a smaller injury and he goes kyujo now but can fight in Aki basho, he should be back to sekiwake in no time, i.e. in Kyushu. I hope that makes you feel better. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I hope too. Considering Asashoryu's age and his condition, it is hard to think someone with an injury competing with him on a regular basis. He is pushing the limit to the edge, leaving very little room for any shortcomings for his opponents. If Hakuho hurt his ancle today, it will get hurt tomorrow again. That is a bit disturbing news to me.

Quite a new developments have occured. Asashoryu's upset defeat to Kotooshu was a welcome news, indicating that he is a human after all. However, Hakuho seemed to have injured his ancle, ver worrisome news regarding his entire career. Asashoryu never been injured like this. So, anyone who wants to compete with him should be free from injuries as much as Asa do. I think, Hakuho's chance of going KK is in doubt now. I can't help myself but feel so upset. (Laughing...)

True. Most of the Mongolians joined Ozumo at younger ages though, and then there's the closer cultural proximity. On the other hand, Roho joined at 22, Kokkai and Hakurozan at 20, and Osh shortly before his 20th birthday. And the college rikishi are generally at least 22 when they join, of course. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just to be accurate, Mongols and Japanese are culturally not quite close. Although Roho and Osh joined sumo in their 20s, they started wrestling much younger. In any sport, wrestling or boxing, respect for opponent is a norm. Sumo is no different. Even Mike Tyson acknowledges his defeat fairly and squarely. Roho knows it and does it knowingly. He has no dignity. He would be bowing endlessly to superior wrestlers like Karelin, if he were back in Russia.

And depending on the strength of a heya, this can make a huge difference. Case in point is Akebono. He used to have to face everyone, but Taka wouldn't have to face Waka, Takanonami, Akinoshima (off the top of my head) or any of the Futagoyama boys. This meant that he would often fight lower (and thus weaker) maegashira than Akebono would have to. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Or musashigawa-beya who had 3 ozeki (musoyama, dejima, and miyabiyama) as well as Yokozuna Musashimaru at one time, these 4 would never have to face each other unless it was a tiebreaker for the yusho, talk about teamwork! As a side note an Ozeki may not be required to face all of his fellow Ozeki during a basho or the Yokozuna. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That is interesting. Thanks for the fact. So, Ozeki does not necessarily face all highest ranking wrestlers, while Yokozuna MUST face all of them, except from the same beya.

Thanks kid!

k, i give it up, seem only small childs are writing here. ADMIN, kill my ACC plz! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think request of such kind is made to the admin directly. How to find admin is in the help.

Hakurozan said in his interview that Roho and Kokkai go to the Orthodox Church together. Err..., what will they be talking about on the way to Church now. About nice henka? Roho is clearly the lowest person among rikishi.

Roho's action looked more like a dumb thing. There is a big difference between the Asa's extra-shove which concludes his total dominance in a winning bout and Roho's arrogant refusal to admit his defeat. Kaio did his majestic nage for good.

This poll will be concluded in 2,3 days. Can anyone tell me when Hakuho will meet Yokozuna? Comparing with the previous polls, much fewer people think that he will upset Asashoryu, eventhough Hakuho is up in the banzuke. Even after the disastrious March basho, many people still kept their hope. Now we can at least conclude that the honeymoon for wonderboy is over. So, see you all in few days.

Thanks to all who responded to my question. The picture is getting clear. Statistically, Yokozuna and Ozeki face same opponents and it is the number of wins that tell them apart. If an ozeki collects enough wins, he gets promoted to Yokozuna. Right?

Can anyone tell me how different is the quality of opponents between Yokozuna and Ozeki? Is it the number of wins that make the difference or they actually face different opponents?

It would be better if the Japanese fans had more "home heroes" to root for, to dethrone the "evil" Asashoryu. He makes a great bad guy, even dresses in black! If he had a STRONG Japanese rival, then that would make a ton of difference. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Here comes a cultural difference. Bad boys become money machines in the states, just like the Iron Tyson. Media pay millions even if he is certain to be beaten. Sumo is different, wrestlers are paid monthly and they fight for pride and dignity. Asashoryu is in dilema. He makes sumo more attractive for western media (read all what the western papers write about him) while hurting the centuries old tradition of Japan. I think he is still young and can not contain his fiery temper (to be frank, he is doing quite well compare with the other young Mongolian sumo wrestlers. Hakuho's father was notorious!). Everything will settle down in coming years, so, take it easy.

Hakuho looks more sober this time. So, is this a sign of his revival? Please post your opinions on the poll, whether he can upset Asashoryu or not.

No! I want him to deal to Asa tonight.... another Tochiazuma-type move would be great! (Clapping wildly...) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That will depend on his mood. If he wants to nub Asa, he can certainly do it. The chances are 50-50. I thank him for letting me enjoy his majestic sumo, ... at least once in a while.

Insert caption here [___________________] (todays contest) Asashoryu: "When I was a kid, ... I used to play ping-pong like this and .... bowling like this ..

Well, I'm sorry that Ozumo isn't free-style amateur wrestling and that it isn't Mongolian-style wrestling. If you choose to believe that anyone who does successful sumo by, you know, using traditional sumo techniques like yorikiri is a no-talent loser that doesn't belong in Makuuchi, that's your prerogative, but perhaps sumo is the wrong sport for you to follow, then. You have quite a talent in twisting what people have said. Yurikiri is one of the many tricks in sumo and useful when used appropriately. And I didn't say yurikiri guys can't be in makuuchi, which in fact, 60% of all tricks used in makuuchi is actually yurikiri. While I keep my desire what sport I should follow private, I suggest you to try to know more about what you are trying to follow and what others think. Yeah, that much has been obvious, just like the last time. I rather try to exchange opinions here, not to prove someone right or wrong. Apparently, correcting other's opinions make you happy, which might be quite extreme. Err, time will tell us? Just as a reminder, Miyabiyama is six years older. Nobody expects Miya to be ranked higher than Osh in a few years, so I'm not exactly sure what time is supposed to tell us there. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Comparison can be made according to their achievements and records, regardless of their present performance. I am not trying to prove you wrong. It will just be interesting.

Odd, I have the completely opposite opinion about Kotooshu's sumo. His technical skills can't be denied, but I wouldn't call his sumo particularly watchable. Much of the time, it's limbs flailing in every which direction with little motion control and no grace...basically, the way Kokkai's sumo would look like if only he was 15 cm taller. I'm sure it'll get better with experience, but Osh's not there yet. By contrast, Ama's sumo is what I would call graceful. And Kyokutenho (yeah, that no-talent hack :-/) was the master of graceful sumo until about a year ago when his power started to wane. Anyway, this is the second time you posted something deliberately controversial and outrageous, only to backtrack and backpedal when somebody called you on it and pointed out all the ways you were wrong. I can't help but see a pattern forming there. But I'm going (Punk rocker...) ... :-) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I am not sure how can Kyokutenho' sumo was ever graceful. Yurikiri? Rugby players can do that too. I remember, Mongolian amateur sumo wrestlers lost their throne when they started facing retired rugby and american football players from Izrael and Brazil. If you want to please yourself thinking that I am backpedaling, then it is up to you. It never came to my thought that I was proven wrong in anyway. Time is gonna tell us who is talented, Miyabyama or Osh. Nevertheless, I always wish good luck to all rikishi, and this time to you too.

This is a quote from you: He is a sanyaku regular. He has talent. With what? Your backpeddling? Your obvious total ignorance of what Sumo is and the significance of rank? Of what exactly? I think this conversation has just ended. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If I totally ignored Sumo and its rank, as you, one of the the respected leaders of this forum, said, I wouldn't be committing so much labor into punching my keyboards. I respect what you think about Miyabyama, and I also think you do the same with my opinion, dear compulsive editor. There is nothing to backpedal in here. Wrestlers are different. One becomes Yokozuna, another becomes Ozeki, and yet another becomes a bag of sand or robocop etc. This is why we are here to watch, right? I just wonder if you know any other sport and read about it? If so, there is nothing to be irritated about when someone posts a bit critical opinion. As of Miyabyama, I think, he is a product of an evolution, forced by the two Hawaian giants. The bigger the better. I guess, your remarkable experience will allow you to see that not only Miya, the entire Sumo has lost some of its grace and majesty due to this evolution. In contrast, its so watchable to look at Kotooshu, even in his defeat. Dear compulsive editor, Wrestling is an art. I suggest you to watch Greco-Roman, free style and Judo a little bit. Then you will see at Sumo with great anticipations.

Thank you sir..but you didn't answer my question-how can he be a Sanyaku regular for four years, and yet be a zero? Huh? Huh? If he's a zero, what can you say about Kyokushuuzan and Kyokutenhou? Their records don't begin to compare with his. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is a manifestation of best efforts from his Oyakata and all his hard work. Besides, I didn't say he is zero, I said there is no hope in him for ozeki and it will soon become the same for sanyaku. As of Kyuokushuzan, he has a talent and wisdom. But we all know that he has no will to go for all. He is not the do-or-die kind of guy. Besides, his body frame is naturally not for sanyaku. So, in a sense, he is clever not to go for something he will never have even he tries as hard as he can. What is annoying about him is that he is literraly setting an example of how to stay afloat in makuuchi in a very disrespectful way. However, we sometimes enjoy his majestic sumo. Kyokutenho was a volleyball player before he came to Japan. So, naturally he has no talent and no hope for anything serious. As you can tell, he doesn't have a clue about the bout he is facing. His body build is by no means close to that of a wrestler. Years of physical training, and hard work from his oyakata keeps him afloat in the makuuchi. I bet, any average American foorball player can do as good as him. I think Aminishiki and Kaiho are far better wrestlers. As you asked about two Mongolian rikishi, let me go little further to avoid more questions on mongolian rikishi. I wouldn't comment on Asa, Hakuho, and Ama. I would like to talk about Asasekiryu. He will take from where Miyabyama left. He is exactly the same kind of guy, whose appearance impress inexperienced watchers but never learns how to do sumo. I guess, Asa has lost his interest to do keiko with him. They were together all these years, yet Sekiryu hasn't improved slightest. So, what can you say in this case? Promising or hopeless? Tokitenku is the worst mongolian rikishi. He looks like going for the baits deliberately. He describes all his mistakes in an interview with mongolian newspapers, yet he goes for it again and again. How on earth, a paid rikishi can act like this? Are u satisfied?