Kotoryu intai+

[Araiwa]

I just saw this line in Kyoto News:

"Maegashira Wrestler Kotoryu to retire"

I don't have access to the article but I don't think this is a joke. ;-)

Has anyone else heard it? The first sad happening of the new basho (if it is true)...

Edited April 20, 2005 by Araiwa

[Guest Hamanoyama]

I just saw this line in Kyoto News:

"Maegashira Wrestler Kotoryu to retire"

I don't have access to the article but I don't think this is a joke.  ;-)

Has anyone else heard it? The first sad happening of the new basho (if it is true)...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

http://home.kyodo.co.jp/all/display.jsp?an=20050420220

[Kintamayama]

Danpatsushiki on June 12th at the Kkan. "He did his best, but his illness has weakened him and with it, his resolve to continue doing Sumo", said Sadogatake Oyakata. Kotoryuu has jun-toshiyori status. He has some problem with his liver.

[aderechelsea]

;-)

these are sad news.

He was one of the rikishi i liked and i am sure Kaiho will miss their great "rivalry" ...

i always considered him as one of the strongest sumo bodies in Makuuchi.

[Zuikakuyama]

:'-(

Too bad. I liked his belly.

[Araiwa]

;-) Thanks for confirmation. So he is definitely gone...I didn't thought his illness was that serious so this comes really hard (but not that surprising). I also liked him and especially his battles with Kyokushuzan that lasted over minutes. He also looked like my father so I always rooted for him. I think he did his best to stay in makuuchi for over 8 years.

[Elenrian]

(Depressed...) I liked him... I was used to see him fighting very often! I will miss him!!!

[Fujisan]

Too bad! :'-(

Have a good and successful retirement Kotoryu. ;-)

[Yubiquitoyama]

Too bad... ;-)

Another one of the old guard gone, and one I got to like more and more with time. A pity, but I hope he will get his diabetes and liver problems under control and can get a decent career as oyakata. I suspect Zaonishiki is getting a bit anxious though, as current holder of Sadogatake's spare toshiyori Shiratama...

Edited April 20, 2005 by Yubiquitoyama

[Azumashida]

With his departure, we'll have even fewer tsuri attempts to watch... (Showing respect...)

He was the epitome of the elevator rikishi struggling in the joijin ranks (very useful UDH pick ;-) ) and doing rather well in the hiramaku, so sumo gamers will miss him too (as Hoshifransu has pointed out on info-sumo)...

It sounds like his illness is quite serious, let's hope it's not that bad and he gets better soon... and becomes an oyakata perhaps?

[Asashosakari]

I sure didn't expect this. (Showing respect...) Best wishes to Kotoryu as he tries to get healthy again, and I hope he'll have a long and successful career as oyakata.

I suspect Zaonishiki is getting a bit anxious though, as current holder of Sadogatake's spare toshiyori Shiratama...

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That's a Sadogatake-owned toshiyori? ;-) Colour me surprised...in that case he probably should indeed be worried. Him being in a different ichimon, Sadogatake-beya doesn't really have any reason to play nice if they decide they need it back. Of course, perhaps luckily for him, Nishonoseki-ichimon as a whole has two more spare toshiyori right now, so they might not want Shiratama for Kotoryu...

Edited April 21, 2005 by Asashosakari

[Kasugaran]

I was worried when he left Osaka Basho and now it seems like my worries were confirmed. I hope he will be ok and made enough from Sumo to take care of himself. Does anyone know if they are looked after healthwise by the Sumo Assoc. after retirement?

[sekihiryu]

;-)

So long Harp Dragon, shame about his health, a potential perennial Sanyaku if he could have always been at the top of his game.

(Showing respect...)

[Burainoan]

;-) (Showing respect...) ;-)

Very sad to see him go. great, solid mid-maegashira rikishi. he was a great fighter, and i also enjoyed seeing those one or two basho a year where he'd really come to life with a sansho-level performance. and of course, how can we forget that unique beer-gut build....

hope he gets a kabu; he should make a good oyakata.

(you know, if Kotonowaka's still hanging in there come November, he could serve a stint as Sadogatake until Kotonowaka's ready to go....)

[Gernobono]

....(you know, if Kotonowaka's still hanging in there come November, he could serve a stint as Sadogatake until Kotonowaka's ready to go....)

....

might be a little offtopic...

if a jun-toshiyori owner takes an "official"-toshiyori and has to pass it on....can he return to his jun-toshiyori within the 2 years period, or is this forever lost, if he makes the first change?

[Kintamayama]

Credit to Kaikitsune human- at the beginning of the basho, he immediately said something was very wrong with Kotoryuu - then, after the kyujo notice, he said one word-"intai".

Credit where credit is due..

Also, Kotoryuu was number 9 in the Kyokai ID numbers. I won't go any further than that, but..

And, 1 Kanto-sho, 3 Kinboshi. Against whom?

Edit-OK, 2 against Takanohana(Day 10 Hatsu 1999, Tsukiotoshi- Taka ended that basho with a "real" 8-7, Day 5 Aki 2002, Katasukashi, cost Taka the yusho, finished 12-3..) and one against Musashimaru (Day 2 Hatsu 2000-Yorikiri, Musa went kyujo on day 4).

Edited April 21, 2005 by Kintamayama

[Asashosakari]

if a jun-toshiyori owner takes an "official"-toshiyori and has to pass it on....can he return to his jun-toshiyori within the 2 years period, or is this forever lost, if he makes the first change?

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I'm fairly sure that jun-toshiyori status can only be attained directly after intai...

At any rate, when it comes to a potential interim Sadogatake, I suspect they would go strictly by seniority and Hidenoyama (moto-Hasegawa, now 60 years old) would get the nod. Particularly since he's old enough that having to give up the Sadogatake name again when Kotonowaka retires wouldn't be as awkward as with the other guys (none of whom are older than 44, and who all could conceivably lay claim to the heya if it wasn't for Kotonowaka).

[Pikenoyama]

That's a shame - I'll miss him not being around. (Sign of disapproval) What is more important as many already said is his health getting better.

By the way will he be on the next banzuke or not? ;-)

[Doitsuyama]

That's a shame - I'll miss him not being around. (Sign of disapproval)  What is more important as many already said is his health getting better.

By the way will he be on the next banzuke or not? ;-)

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He should be on the banzuke next basho as he announced the Intai much later than the banzuke was decided upon. It would be a nightmare to redo the banzuke from his rank downward to Jonokuchi. And don't tell this to the gyoji who writes the banzuke...

[Jejima]

Also, Kotoryuu was number 9 in the Kyokai ID numbers. I won't go any further than that, but..

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What's a Kyokai ID number? Are you inferring that having a lowish number is a good thing or a bad thing? Does Asashoryu hold ID #1?

Please expand ;-)

[Asashosakari]

What's a Kyokai ID number?

Edited April 21, 2005 by Asashosakari

[Pikenoyama]

Might be of no interest, but Kotoryu started his Ozumo career in Haru 1987, the same basho as Takanonami and as we know now he will be intai 1 year later than his maezumo collegue. ;-) to both of these oyakata prospects.

[Kintamayama]

What Moti is talking about are these profiles at the Kyokai site.

The database must have gone online for the Aki 1997 basho...the original numbering went up to 58 (if I'm reading the data correctly), and included everyone who was active at the time and had Makuuchi experience. In other words, these are the veteran rikishi of the Kyokai's internet era (and thus the veteran rikishi for many of those who were brought up on the SML and/or Eurosport, as well). After Kotoryu's intai, only 11 of those 58 are still active now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Also, occasionally, a rikishi would get "bumped upwards" (or downwards, depends which way you are looking..) in numbers. Chiyotaikai comes to mind. I don't think this is Asashouryuu's "original" number either..

[Asashosakari]

What Moti is talking about are these profiles at the Kyokai site.

The database must have gone online for the Aki 1997 basho...the original numbering went up to 58 (if I'm reading the data correctly), and included everyone who was active at the time and had Makuuchi experience. In other words, these are the veteran rikishi of the Kyokai's internet era (and thus the veteran rikishi for many of those who were brought up on the SML and/or Eurosport, as well). After Kotoryu's intai, only 11 of those 58 are still active now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Also, occasionally, a rikishi would get "bumped upwards" (or downwards, depends which way you are looking..) in numbers. Chiyotaikai comes to mind. I don't think this is Asashouryuu's "original" number either..

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I dunno about Chiyotaikai...he made his Makuuchi debut in 1997.09, so he should have been in the original group of rikishi. And those original 58 entries don't seem to follow any pattern, so his number seems to make as much sense as any other. Of course, they might have re-sorted a whole lot of them at some point...who knows.

Asashoryu being number (ah, don't want to spoil the surprise for Jejima) does look very convenient, I agree.

[Jejima]

Asashoryu being number (ah, don't want to spoil the surprise for Jejima) does look very convenient, I agree.

That hint gave it away ;-) *100*

No 1 is Takanohana II, and number 2 is Wakanohana III. The highest numbered active rikishi is Tosanoumi at #5.

edit: I must apologise profusely for taking this thread away from Kotoryu. All respect to the great battler.

Trivia:- He actually announced his retirement before, I think, and chopped off his mage. This was something to do with his not getting on with his old oyakata... Anyone else know more details on this story from the past? (At least 6 or 7 years ago, and possibly more)

2nd edit: check this one out, ID #10, before it goes... http://sumo.goo.ne.jp/eng/ozumo_meikan/rik...ikishi.php?A=10

BTW Where are the Hawai'ans?

3rd edit: Okay, found Akebono and 'Maru at 35 and 36 behind such other greats like Gojoro, Asanowaka and Aogiyama. Haven't found Konishiki yet (Showing respect...)

4th edit: Okay found Konishiki http://sumo.goo.ne.jp/eng/ozumo_meikan/rik...ikishi.php?A=48 Looks like he has lost some weight (and some height for that matter).

After going through the first 50 numbers I have no idea how the numbers are assigned. It can't be on banzuke rank at the time, nor on date order of entering sumo, nor on seniroity in the top division. Nor alphabetical... There seems to be no logic to the numbering system... So (back on topic), Kotoryu being numbered 9, probably just means he was the 9th to be entered into the system (and so perhaps the web-site designer's 9 th favourite rikishi) at the time when it was set up.

Edited April 21, 2005 by Jejima