Non-K-November basho 2020 Discussion (spoiler space)

[Dwale]

What a day of sumo! Wow, there was way more going on than I have time to really get into, but we had epic bouts, wild bouts, silly bouts...just a buffet of entertaining stuff. I didn't want Takakeisho to lose, buuuuut now he has, hey, at least it makes the race more interesting. Anything can happen in sumo!

[Seiyashi]

2 minutes ago, robnplunder said:

I tend to contradict myself whenever I predict something.   I am about 50% right (or wrong).

Tobizaru!!!!!!

Mind, I'd still actually like for Takakeisho to win this basho, but today's match against Tobizaru shows he can be beaten in a battle of attrition. It was fairly impressive how both rikishi were balanced, upright, and pawing each other to no apparent effect. Takakeisho has been winning previous matches with superior reflexes over overcommitted opponents; that clearly didn't happen here.

[robnplunder]

4 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Mind, I'd still actually like for Takakeisho to win this basho, but today's match against Tobizaru shows he can be beaten in a battle of attrition. It was fairly impressive how both rikishi were balanced, upright, and pawing each other to no apparent effect. Takakeisho has been winning previous matches with superior reflexes over overcommitted opponents; that clearly didn't happen here.

One can't underestimate Tobizaru (ditto for Daieisho).  On  paper, Tobizaru had no business going toe to toe with Takakeisho.    I loved the "proud" look on Tobizaru's face after the win.  

Edited November 16, 2020 by robnplunder

[Seiyashi]

1 minute ago, robnplunder said:

One can't underestimate Tobizaru (ditto for Daieisho).  On  paper, Tobizaru had no business going toe to toe with Takakeisho.    I loved the "proud" look on Tobizaru's face after the win.  

Completely agreed. That said, that's the most docile sumo from both this basho; you'd think that one or the other would have more effect. If Takakeisho loses the yusho, this will be the bout that started it, yet there was no explosive oshitaoshi or uwatenages, just pawing at each other till one gave up.

[robnplunder]

5 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Completely agreed. That said, that's the most docile sumo from both this basho; you'd think that one or the other would have more effect. If Takakeisho loses the yusho, this will be the bout that started it, yet there was no explosive oshitaoshi or uwatenages, just pawing at each other till one gave up.

I think Takakeisho will come back tomorrow with vengeance (sorry, Myogiru).  The Ozeki just looked clueless against a smaller opponent who stood ground.   Ironic. 

Watch Myogiru tomorrow.  Now I said the above, his chance of beating Takakeisho just jumped up 50%.  

Edited November 16, 2020 by robnplunder

[Amamaniac]

Talk about twists and turns!

So Takarafuji gets his KK, first time in about 7 years that he managed that in the first nine days!  He stays in the hunt (temporarily one behind Takakeisho).  So I start thinking, we are seeing a set up where two Isegahama boys work together towards the yusho.  Instinctively, Terunofuji is the one with the biggest hopes (i.e., working towards Ozeki reinstatement), and so having Takarafuji "by his side" would seem reassuring.

So what happens?  Terunofuji loses his bout (what a clash between former Ozekis that was!!), and appears to suffer a fatal setback.  It would be rather difficult coming back from (temporarily) two behind.

And just when we think that Takakeisho is "shooer than shoo in", Tobizaru sends the sole Ozeki down onto the clay, handing the him his first loss.  

Not only are Terunofuji's hopes still alive, but now we have three men at the top of the leaderboard: Takakeisho, Takarafuji, and ... Shimanoumi!?!  The Abema commentators were casually saying that we might see a third makujiri yusho this year.  The next six days will determine whether that is just crazy talk or not!

Today's developments are seriously mind-blowing! 

Edited November 16, 2020 by Amamaniac

[pricklypomegranate]

1 hour ago, Kaninoyama said:

Enho is back...with a new (old) mawashi and a desperately needed first win this basho. 

Enho showed some semblance of his former self. Used the arms as a distraction, and then got under and attempted ashitori. His inability to pick up Aoiyama's leg is quite concerning, but he was definitely more aggressive and that was a fine follow-through in the shove out. It's not much, but it's something. I hope he can get the 5 wins he needs to stay within Makuuchi. I doubt that Ura will do well enough to come back to Makuuchi in January, but fights between Enho and Midorifuji will certainly be nice to see. This is clear evidence that the swamp mawashi belt is cursed - he needs to dispose of it immediately lest he continue to be cursed. 

32 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

Waka's curse is still strong

Oh. My. God.

Tobizaru did it!!! Turns out, there is a serious downside to being like a planet, like a serious lack of balance. Tobizaru did an excellent job countering Takakeisho's thrusts and slaps as well as taking advantage of Takakeisho's lack of mobility and balance by moving around the dohyo and then slapping the Ozeki down at the most opportune time. Truly one of the better matches I've seen in awhile. It's another match to remind us of the parity John Gunning was talking about. 

I hate to say this, but Terunofuji might have blown it. I love Mr. Neckless, but there's scarcely a better way to close the year than with 3 makujiri yusho. 

Wakanohana's curse is probably the strongest force on the dohyo. Hakuho could not even hope to compare.  

Edited November 16, 2020 by pricklypomegranate

[Amamaniac]

2 hours ago, Kaninoyama said:

Meanwhile, down in Juryo, Midorifuji secures is 7th win and looks poised to make his Makuuchi debut next basho.

... and poised to take the Juryo Division championship, possibly. 

[Eikokurai]

Some great bouts today!

Hoshoryu and Kotonowaka set the tone early for long battles today and the call could have gone either way.

Ichinojo–Kaisei led my son to ask, “Why are they hugging to fight?”

Enho finally gets a win by (sort of) returning to the sumo that got him to Makuuchi in the first place. Good to see him off the mark.

Takarafuji pulled a win out of the bag on the bales, seemingly deciding last second he wasn’t actually beaten and could maybe reverse his situation.

Hokutofuji refused to lose – you could see him thinking on his feet and adjusting to his opponent. Great stuff.

Takayasu was excellent today. Such patient, intelligent sumo, though I did sense Terunofuji gave up and walked himself out. Take nothing from Takayasu though – he forced the situation.

Anyone else sense that Takakeisho thought he’d already won, only to be surprised that Tobizaru stayed in and turned back? There was a moment on Takakeisho’s face where it seemed to dawn on him he’d eased up too early, like a 100m sprinter slowing down at 90m and getting passed. (Edit: Maybe not. It’s funny what you think you see on first viewing in real time. I could have sworn that Takakeisho shove after a few seconds was closer to the bales and he was surprised it hadn’t finished Tobizaru off. On repeat viewing I realize that wasn’t the case.)

Edited November 16, 2020 by Eikokurai

[since_94]

What a day of action on the dohyo. Fighting spirit all over the gosh darn place. Juryo included here. Wow.

[lackmaker]

3 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

Mind, I'd still actually like for Takakeisho to win this basho, but today's match against Tobizaru shows he can be beaten in a battle of attrition. It was fairly impressive how both rikishi were balanced, upright, and pawing each other to no apparent effect. Takakeisho has been winning previous matches with superior reflexes over overcommitted opponents; that clearly didn't happen here.

For some reason he looked way to cautious against an admittedly unpredictable opponent.

[Seiyashi]

On 15/11/2020 at 19:52, Eikokurai said:

Chiyonokuni is similar: a tenacious pugilist who isn’t shy about mashing your face with his palms over and over.

Tokushoryu heartily agrees with you after today's bout. I don't think anyone on this forum needs a warning, but if you're blood sensitive, that's worse than usual.

I've never heard the gyoji sound so angry as when Onosho matta-ed today.

What the hell was up with Mitakeumi's double matta? I'd say he matta-ed himself out of the bout today.

1 hour ago, lackmaker said:

For some reason he looked way to cautious against an admittedly unpredictable opponent.

In some ways, Tobizaru came to this bout with the game plan that Takakeisho could never beat. You'd think Tobizaru would be an active opponent, making it easier to deflect him and exploit openings. But Tobizaru played it slow, dancing just out of Takakeisho's range, and never really taking any impact from Takakeisho. At the same time, Takakeisho seems to have come to this basho with the intent to not overcommit on attack, but that means he can't do anything against Tobizaru's game plan than just tire out and eventually lose.

If anyone can replicate Tobizaru's game plan, Takakeisho will have much more difficulty. 

Edited November 16, 2020 by Seiyashi

[Benihana]

7 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Tokushoryu heartily agrees with you after today's bout.

Chiyonokuni, the honey badger of sumo ^^

 

Where did THAT day come from? Excellent quality sumo.

[code_number3]

3 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Ichinojo–Kaisei led my son to ask, “Why are they hugging to fight?”

Flashback to May 2018, when I watched Ichinojo vs Kaisei. My mom passed by and told me, “damn son, those bosoms are everywhere!”

[Kintamayama]

Rikishi talk day 9:

Takarafuji, tied for the lead: "I managed to frantically save my skin. It wasn't sumo that can be praised, but I didn't give up easily.. I got my kachikoshi pretty quickly  ( on day nine, his fastest ever).  I am astonished myself. " He trained daily with Terunofuji at the heya and the results are obvious. "If I didn't do good sumo he would blast me out of the dohyo.. The keiko was of high quality. " His wife of four years is helping him out with setting a balanced diet. "I can feel the love, and that is what is really important. "

Enhou, finally gets his first win of the basho: "  All i could think of was to win.  I thought to grab his mawashi and  I don't remember the rest. Truth be told, it was very difficult for me to mount the dohyo each day. I lost my confidence. I didn't know what I should be doing to get it right. I was doing sumo while being scared.. But amidst this situation, the fans never stopped cheering me on every day and the people around me continued to support me and that is what has brought me to this point. I would like to dedicate this win to them. It was an extremely important win!"

Kotoshouhou beat a sanyaku opponent the first time he faced one, beating Sekiwake Takanoshou : "I just wanted to do a good tachiai and hoped the rest will follow. I was totally absorbed in the bout. " Takanoshou was his elder in a Chiba sumo club. "The minute I got on the dohyo, it was irrelevant. I went with all my might as usual.."

Takakeishou, first loss of the basho: "A lot happened, but I lost so I have nothing to say. I lost so I must have done something wrong. I'll review this seriously and will gambarize anew from tomorrow."

Takayasu, showing excellent sumo and beating Terunofuji: " I was able to do sumo at my own pace. I was able to hit hard and get in a good position so that was good. My sumo sense is getting better."

Tobizaru, handing Takakeishou his first loss of the basho: "I managed to attack well without running away and that was good. It feels like a dream! I was sure I would be blown away with one push- after all, he was an unbeaten Ozeki.. I'd like to turn things around and do better sumo now."

Ura, three straight wins : "I'm glad I won. I really don't know how well my body is moving. I'm just giving it my all. Winning streak or losing streak, without thinking of the win/loss thing, I will not let up. I just want to go about it without thinking about that."

Makushita 12 Russian Rouga won his fifth straight, beating Taihou's grandson Naya: "I was able to grab his mawashi after the initial hit." If he wins all seven bouts, he will be promoted to Juryo. "I'm trying not to  think about that too much. Bout by bout , I want to be able to do my own sumo till the end."

Shimanoumi wins today, now tied for the lead: "I can't remember a thing. My body was moving well. I don't want to get carried away and hopefully will keep my presence of mind.. All I can do now is gambarize for the last part of the basho."

Kotonowaka, facing Houshouryuu in a battle between two great hopes, and winning: "I just wanted to go about it calmly. I was patient and was able to cope well."

Hokutofuji, winning his first four bouts and then losing his next four - wins today: "I faced today's bout as if it was day one. I want to continue with that feeling tomorrow, while going about it calmly."

 

Edited November 16, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Benevolance]

On 14/11/2020 at 21:21, robnplunder said:

I am very close to ruling out Mitakeumi from the list.  As a fan since his Makushita debut, it hurts me to say that.  You forgot Terunofuji on the list.

I've got no gripes with Terunofuji. His wrestling isn't as dynamic as it was before, but I can still remember when it was great and he gets a pass. We'll call it the Aminishiki factor. 

[maorencze]

Terunofuji was great today, I consider this win of Takayasu as a serious candidate for fight of the year, reeeally great sumo by both men full of pride and wishing to prove their Ozeki stints were deserved and distinguished (and not to be remembered by just the respective ends of those stints)

And Tochinoshin, dear god! That was a MOTHER of all kachiage! He did lose the bout, but that impact might have been heard back in Beijing and Honolulu!

[Sue]

If Yutakayama could ever get consistent about finishing his wins when he's almost won, he'd be laughing his way to a KK. As it is, he's in trouble.

[Amamaniac]

6 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

What the hell was up with Mitakeumi's double matta? I'd say he matta-ed himself out of the bout today.

If you want to see a real matta-fest, check out the Juryo bout today between Daishomaru and Azumaryu.  Talk about getting into one's opponent's head.  Not sure Daishomaru would have won that bout if not for the shenanigans...

[Amamaniac]

2 hours ago, maorencze said:

And Tochinoshin, dear god! That was a MOTHER of all kachiage! He did lose the bout, but that impact might have been heard back in Beijing and Honolulu!

Perhaps even Tbilisi! 

[Kotomiyama]

So much energy in the Takayasu - Terunofuji match. I hope to see both regaining the Ozeki rank in 2021.

[Amamaniac]

Here's a useless tidbit: on day 9, the active wrestler in sole last place (Enho) moved into a shared position with Kiribayama.  On the same day the active Ozeki in sole first place in the yusho race (Takakeisho) moved into a shared position with Takarafuji and Shimanoumi.

The point is, now that Enho has one win under his red belt, we can say: (1) he is on the board, (2) his performance this tournament is no worse than rookie of 2020, Kiribayama [I know, not a fair comparison], (3) his performance is not much worse than that of fellow small man, Terutsuyoshi, and (4) Enho won't be duplicating Onosho's July 2020 embarrassing record, i.e., 13 straight days without a win.

That's my takeaway ... as an Enho fan. 

[sahaven111]

15 hours ago, pricklypomegranate said:

His inability to pick up Aoiyama's leg is quite concerning,

definitely... concerning for Aoiyama's weight...

[jsolo]

November Basho Day 1-9, articles, videos, photos, stats, standings, 

Day 9 complete, except for NHK highlights, which have not yet been posted. Will add when they are.

Enjoy

Feedback welcomed.

 

 

[Jakusotsu]

Trivia question: has there ever been a rikishi before Akua sporting his own image on the kesho-mawashi?

(no, Tosayutaka doesn't count)