Hatsu Basho 2019 Discussion [SPOILERS]

[Rocks]

Terrible start for Kisenosato. What happened to he was going to not be so predictable with going inside left and using pushes, etc. instead? Pathetic. 

[Morty]

25 minutes ago, Yatagarasu said:

As for Kisenosato, it's only day 1and I don't want to undermine Mitakeumi's sumo today either, but I think we're inching ever closer to the inevitable.

 

As soon as that match was finished the first words out of my mouth were "he's done". He can't match it with the top rankers anymore. The young up and comers are too strong for him and the older guys know how to exploit his weakness. And the fact he was always so one dimensional and relied on his strength, size and techniques that supported those attributes mean he can't change his style. A shame, but I think we only have two active Yokozunae at the end of this basho. A real shame that he was brought low by an injury that almost perfectly diminished all his strengths as a rikishi.

[SumpaX]

17 minutes ago, Rocks said:

Terrible start for Kisenosato. What happened to he was going to not be so predictable with going inside left and using pushes, etc. instead? Pathetic. 

At this point I believe its all in his head, because he has the tools but isn't using them..

[Midoriyama]

13 minutes ago, SumpaX said:

At this point I believe its all in his head, because he has the tools but isn't using them..

I agree with that, he looked really defeated after that loss I mean he looks like he just wants out of it all. The end is inevitable and very near for him 

[ALAKTORN]

Watching Kisenosato is more and more painful. Wish he had retired 2 years ago.

Kakuryū did a really nice job handling that henka.

Hakuhō looked really powerful. I think it’s gonna be between them…

[Old Shatterhand is dead]

2 hours ago, Midoriyama said:

well Takakeisho looked much better today than I expected after all that not so good news from training prior to the basho. Happy for him, looks like he may do well enough to get 11 wins. 

I am not a Hakuho´s fan but I must admit he looked very impressive today and this may be his yusho to loose with all the ozekis opening with a loss. 

Onosho, Aoiyama and Kaisei looked the best from maegashiras in my opinion. 

 

 

 

And Aoiyama.

[since_94]

I thought Chiyonokuni looked awesome in his win and seems to be brimming with confidence. Great start for Ichinojo too, who looked a lot more mobile (dare I say faster?) than what we’re used to seeing from him of late. Nishikigi also had an impressive win. I thought it was a great day of sumo. Lots of surprises with 3 Ozeki going down . As for Kisenosato, well I hope he hangs around until at least day 6 and 7 so I can finally see him fight as a Yokozuna 

[Atenzan]

2 hours ago, SumpaX said:

At this point I believe its all in his head, because he has the tools but isn't using them..

No man, some of it's in his pec and his ligaments. 

He has a long history of choking, true, but traditionally that happened from day 12 on. 

[Amamaniac]

3 hours ago, since_94 said:

Can’t believe I forgot this was day 1 and went out for a leisurely dinner and drive instead of being glued to the action. Oh well, highlights it is.

You can still watch all the day 1 action on mbovosumo:

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/363205966

 

[RabidJohn]

Takakeisho looks like he's still intent on blowing everyone away!

I reckon Ichinojo ought to switch to a predominantly oshi style, too. He's brought it out a few times in the last few basho and it's very effective.

I am also very pleased to see Nishikigi exceeding expectations. I know it was only Goeido, but I thought it was a classy belt win. Can he manage a second joi KK on the trot?

Hakuho and Kakuryu looking like yokozuna, Kisenosato unfortunately not... I hope he doesn't wait for the YDC to push him.

[Dwale]

While it's true that Mitakeumi is tougher than the average day one appetizer, Kisenosato didn't really look like he was in it. Not a good sign. I'll keep cheering him all the way to the end but I expect it's not long in coming now.

The ozeki corps not looking too hot, either. Well, it's only day one, we've got the whole basho ahead of us...

[SumpaX]

1 hour ago, Atenzan said:

No man, some of it's in his pec and his ligaments. 

He has a long history of choking, true, but traditionally that happened from day 12 on. 

Sure, but he tries to ignore this and power through like he did in the past and that I don't understand because some of his most exciting bouts when he became a yokozune where more evasive in nature. Now that he isn't 100% he resorts to plain power?

[Amamaniac]

Kise may not have been the toughest of elite opponents (especially given his day 1 loss record as a Yokozuna: 2-5), but keep in mind Mitakeumi's impressive victory over Takayasu on the final day of the last tournament, and anyone can see that this Komusubi boy has talent.  If he were to really apply himself in preparation keiko, he would be more consistent.

I sometimes wonder what his philosophy is regarding not going all out during keiko.  Is it a matter of him not being ready to put in the hard work needed to be a Yokozuna (Hakuho is exemplary in this regard), or is it a matter of him fearing injury and wanting to stay loose so as to allow his sumo to flow naturally?

Mitakeumi should definitely be on the list of future Ozeki...

[Tochinofuji]

I have to say, while just a visitor to makuuchi Terutsuyoshi's sumo looked excellent today. Great turn with the hand on the back of Daishomaru's neck to a clean yorikiri. Looking forward to following the rest of his matches this basho! Hopefully he gets the kachikoshi he needs to make it to the big show in March. 

[Asashosakari]

4 hours ago, Morty said:

As soon as that match was finished the first words out of my mouth were "he's done". He can't match it with the top rankers anymore. The young up and comers are too strong for him and the older guys know how to exploit his weakness. And the fact he was always so one dimensional and relied on his strength, size and techniques that supported those attributes mean he can't change his style. A shame, but I think we only have two active Yokozunae at the end of this basho. A real shame that he was brought low by an injury that almost perfectly diminished all his strengths as a rikishi.

Sadly, all the way through his blood-and-guts performance in Aki basho I had that nagging thought, "Is this going to end up like Takanohana's last hurrah 16 years ago"? Looks like it well might, on the exact same timetable.

[mikawa]

Here's a very good and detailed analysis of today's bout between Kisenosato and Mitakeumi:

 

[Eikokurai]

I took the family to Disneyland today instead of watching the sumo. Just caught up with everything now. Needless to say if the writing wasn’t on the wall for Kise before, it certainly is now. I’ve no doubt he’s got enough to compete at a decent level, but not as a Yokozuna. I’m reminded of a conversation several months ago about how sometimes being a Yokozuna is a curse. An Ozeki can prolong their career by managing their decline, like Kotoshogiku, whereas a Yokozuna must quit. I wonder if that’s gone through Kise’s mind at all over the past few months.

[sumojoann]

3 hours ago, since_94 said:

 As for Kisenosato, well I hope he hangs around until at least day 6 and 7 so I can finally see him fight as a Yokozuna 

Regarding Kisenosato hanging around until at least Day 6 or 7 so you will be able to see him fight, my friend bought a ticket for Day 1 specifically to increase his chances of seeing him before the inevitable happens.

[Tigerboy1966]

Every time over the last two years that I've said that Kisenosato is definitely finished and needs to retire he limps and stumbles on to appear on the next banzuke so I'll try another approach. Ahem. Kisenosato will win his next 14 matches, take the yusho, and dominate sumo in 2019. That should do it. Honestly though, I just want to give him a hug and nice cup of tea and say "mate, you don't need to do this anymore".

[Fukurou]

7 hours ago, Morty said:

As soon as that match was finished the first words out of my mouth were "he's done". He can't match it with the top rankers anymore. The young up and comers are too strong for him and the older guys know how to exploit his weakness.

I've realized the end was near for a while now, but I had similar thoughts after that match. One match is only 1 match and it's always possible he could get his KK, but lacking that I'm with those who would be surprised if he finishes the basho or doesn't retire immediately after.

Complicating factor - people were so hot to get him to Yokozuna, how long would it take to overcome their reluctance to give him that push if things continue badly, assuming he doesn't take that step himself.

Edited January 13, 2019 by Fukurou

[Jakusotsu]

3 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

An Ozeki can prolong their career by managing their decline, like Kotoshogiku, whereas a Yokozuna must quit.

That ill-fated injury would have dropped Kisenosato out of Makuuchi already if he wasn't promoted to Yokozuna.

[Amamaniac]

Interesting stat over on Abema TV: from what I could make of the Japanese text, Ikioi had the most monoii bouts in the Top Division in 2018, and three of those monoii ended up reversing the referee's decision in Ikioi's favour.

What does that say about Ikioi's fighting style?  Whatever it is, he tends to have close finishes, which apparently make it difficult for the referees to distinguish who the winner is.

[Rocks]

10 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

Interesting stat over on Abema TV: from what I could make of the Japanese text, Ikioi had the most monoii bouts in the Top Division in 2018, and three of those monoii ended up reversing the referee's decision in Ikioi's favour.

What does that say about Ikioi's fighting style?  Whatever it is, he tends to have close finishes, which apparently make it difficult for the referees to distinguish who the winner is.

Ikioi pushes hard and straight to get them out, often extending his whole body to do it making touch downs close and bringing the dead body rule in a lot. For all his singing and sweetness he's very scary to face on the dohyo I would think,  when his legs and feet are good.

[yorikiried by fate]

Wow, I'm really not going to make friends here, but Kisenosato should have packed it ages ago. I for one do hope that this sad chapter gets closed as quickly as possible, so that we can move on from this silliness. Hopefully, the NSK's writer room staff realizes that the young guns offer enough potential so that we can finally leave behind the Kisegeekoeido nonsense we have been treated to throughout the last couple of years.

[Asojima]

4 minutes ago, yorikiried by fate said:

... the young guns offer enough potential so that we can finally leave behind the Kisegeekoeido nonsense we have been treated to throughout the last couple of years.

The problem is the word "potential".  None of the young guns have yet developed the ability to dominate the upper ranks.   Until some of them do, we are stuck with the nonsense.