Times We've got close to 5+ Yokozunae

[PawnSums]

I don't know if this is the appropriate place to put this, but i'm pretty sure.

i'll start

we got close to 6 yokozuna, just a liitle unlikely tweaking:

Tamanoumi doesn't die

and

Sadanoyama retires a few years later

Judging by this, we would have 6 yokozuna (But only for one basho) by Nagoya 1974 if and it's a big, captial IF, Sadanoyama Dosen't Retire:

Kitanoumi

Wajima

Tamanoumi

Sadanoyama

Kitanofuji

Kotozakura

[Bumpkin]

Nagoya 1974, was my first sumo basho. I was 12 years old. Yokozuna Kotozakura retired before the basho began. He was 33 years old. Yokozuna Kitanofuji retired on day 3 after losing his first two matches. He was 32 years old. Ozeki Kitanoumi was promoted after the basho was over. Most likely because of the two retirements. Sadanoyama would of been 36 years old in July 1974. A bit long in the tooth. Tamanoumi, on the other hand, would have been only 30 years old.                                              

Edited April 3, 2017 by Bumpkin

[ryafuji]

Sadanoyama retired at the age of 30 at the first sign of weakness (apparently losing to Takamiyama-a foreigner!- convinced him he was washed up) despite having won the previous two tournaments. No way he would have struggled on until 36.

 But why stop at 6? Taiho, Kashiwado and Tochinoumi could have carried on until '74 and then we could have had 9 

Edited April 3, 2017 by ryafuji

[PawnSums]

8 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

Sadanoyama retired at the age of 30 at the first sign of weakness (apparently losing to Takamiyama- a foreigner!- convinced him he was washed up) despite having won the previous two tournaments. No way he would have struggled on until 36. 

still 5 yokozuna.

[ryafuji]

We got much closer in January 1953 when Terukuni retired before the tournament and Kagamisato was promoted after it, joining Chiyonoyama, Haguroyama and Azumafuji. Five yokozuna in the same month! Just not quite at the same time, sadly. 

Edited April 3, 2017 by ryafuji

[PawnSums]

also, we are close know, we have:

Hakuho

Kakuryu

Harumafuji

and

Needapictureofhimasayokozunaonsumoreferncenosato.

if ama or kakuryu stay around long enough, Takayasu, Terunofuji, Shodai, Mitakeumi or maybe even Chiyoshoma or Goeido could join them in the yokozuna ranks.

Edited April 4, 2017 by PawnSums

[chishafuwaku]

1 hour ago, PawnSums said:

if ama or kakuryu stay around long enough, Takayasu, Terunofuji, Shodai, Mitakeumi or maybe even Chiyoshoma or Goeido could join them in the yokozuna ranks.

                 

[Stelios]

And since we are fantasizing, why not Ura? I'm a fan!

[Churaumi]

Terunofuji is going to have to do some pretty severe career rehab to make the cut, hopefully Ama and Kakuryu can rehab their bodies to hold out that long.

Edited April 4, 2017 by Churaumi
My phone substituted "isn't" for "is."

[RabidJohn]

16 hours ago, ryafuji said:

We got much closer in January 1953 when Terukuni retired before the tournament and Kagamisato was promoted after it, joining Chiyonoyama, Haguroyama and Azumafuji. Five yokozuna in the same month! Just not quite at the same time, sadly. 

Not very long ago, someone posted a pic of those 5 together in their yokozuna regalia, so even if it was only very briefly and they never appeared on the banzuke nor competed together as yoks, there were 5 at once.

Let's be clear: Terukuni announced his intai 3 days into the tournament that saw Kagamisato promoted, but if he was still permitted to wear the rope for the photo, I go along with the notion that he was still technically a yokozuna. After all, what does yokozuna mean?

Edited April 4, 2017 by RabidJohn

[Bumpkin]

37 minutes ago, RabidJohn said:

Not very long ago, someone posted a pic of those 5 together in their yokozuna regalia, so even if it was only very briefly and they never appeared on the banzuke nor competed together as yoks, there were 5 at once.

Let's be clear: Terukuni announced his intai 3 days into the tournament that saw Kagamisato promoted, but if he was still permitted to wear the rope for the photo, I go along with the notion that he was still technically a yokozuna. After all, what does yokozuna mean?

You could make the case, "Once a Yokozuna, always a Yokozuna."  As for the pic, it's 4 active and one recently retired Yokozunae. Terukuni hadn't had his danpatsu-shiki yet.

[Benihana]

I'd say being an "official" yokozuna ends when the last hair is cut. It's like giving two weeks notice and the leaving the office, because you still have some paid leave. You are out, but you're still under contract until the last day of the month.

[ryafuji]

I think I read somewhere Terukuni may have gone out on jungyo after the tournament and done dohyo-iri even though he'd announced his retirement.  

[Benevolance]

I read that last post too quickly and saw "Terunofuji" and my thought was "He's retiring? Surely the henka wasn't THAT bad for his career."

[ryafuji]

1 hour ago, Benevolance said:

I read that last post too quickly and saw "Terunofuji" and my thought was "He's retiring? Surely the henka wasn't THAT bad for his career."

The similarity in their names is not a coincidence - Terunofuji's shikona was a combination of Terukuni and Asahifuji. 

[PawnSums]

38 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

The similarity in their names is not a coincidence - Terunofuji's shikona was a combination of Terukuni and Asahifuji. 

terukuni is one of my all time favorites. good to see he wasn't forgotten.

[yorikiried by fate]

On 4.4.2017 at 15:52, Churaumi said:

Terunofuji is going to have to do some pretty severe career rehab to make the cut [...]

Because of what? A legal move that put an artificially (and politically) stretched one-trick pony back to its right place?

[K. Sear]

3 hours ago, yorikiried by fate said:

Because of what? A legal move that put an artificially (and politically) stretched one-trick pony back to its right place?

No, for not living up to his rank and ability.

[Kishinoyama]

3 minutes ago, K. Sear said:

No, for not living up to his rank and ability.

But it was reported that he suffered a knee injury and it got worse. Kisenosato did a henka in the day 15 match and several people here thought it was okay because of his injury. Using that logic, Terunofuji's henka was justified because he was injured.   

I would like to point out, I did not like either one of those henkas. 

[just_some_guy]

I think Terunofuji's multiple instances of "losing record followed by an 8-7 to barely save his rank" are far more damaging to any future Yokozuna aspirations than henka-ing Kotoshogiku.

Edited April 7, 2017 by just_some_guy

[Churaumi]

9 minutes ago, just_some_guy said:

I think Terunofuji's multiple instances of "losing record followed by an 8-7 to barely save his rank" are far more damaging to any future Yokozuna aspirations than henka-ing Kotoshogiku.

That's what I was referring to. The YDC said it wouldn't promote him anytime soon because of his past record. I don't personally have a problem with the henka myself, Giku should have known a guy he's had a beef with would try to exploit his weakness in that situation. Not appropriate for a yokozuna, but he isn't one and this will be forgotten by the time he cleans up his record enough to be one as long as he doesn't make a habit of it.

[RabidJohn]

2 hours ago, Churaumi said:

That's what I was referring to. The YDC said it wouldn't promote him anytime soon because of his past record. I don't personally have a problem with the henka myself, Giku should have known a guy he's had a beef with would try to exploit his weakness in that situation. Not appropriate for a yokozuna, but he isn't one and this will be forgotten by the time he cleans up his record enough to be one as long as he doesn't make a habit of it.

I find it telling that Goeido, who had a not dissimilar record to Terunofuji leading up to his kadoban zensho-yusho, was immediately announced as tsunatori and given a target for promotion at the following basho. Amazing what having an actual Japanese-born yokozuna does to YDC attitudes!

[Asashosakari]

1 hour ago, RabidJohn said:

I find it telling that Goeido, who had a not dissimilar record to Terunofuji leading up to his kadoban zensho-yusho, was immediately announced as tsunatori and given a target for promotion at the following basho. Amazing what having an actual Japanese-born yokozuna does to YDC attitudes!

There's a wee bit of a difference between a 15-0 yusho and a 13-2 playoff loss... And calling their pre-top performance records "not dissimilar" is pretty hyperbolic, too. Goeido had another 12-win score just six months earlier, while Terunofuji went the entirety of 2016 not posting more than 12 wins across any two basho combined, literally setting new all-time records in terribleness for an ozeki.

Edited April 7, 2017 by Asashosakari

[RabidJohn]

14 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

There's a wee bit of a difference between a 15-0 yusho and a 13-2 playoff loss... And calling their pre-top performance records "not dissimilar" is pretty hyperbolic, too. Goeido had another 12-win score just six months earlier, while Terunofuji went the entirety of 2016 not posting more than 12 wins across any two basho combined, literally setting new all-time records in terribleness for an ozeki.

Sorry, I wasn't referring to the actual outcome (and I don't regard 13-2D as a yusho equivalent), just the talk when Teru had 1 loss and looked like taking the yusho with Kise injured.

And, I didn't actually refer to Teru and Goeido's records, just my flaky memory that both are frequently kadoban, which is as far as any similarity goes. My bad...

[Tsubame]

On 7.4.2017 at 19:48, Asashosakari said:

There's a wee bit of a difference between a 15-0 yusho and a 13-2 playoff loss... And calling their pre-top performance records "not dissimilar" is pretty hyperbolic, too. Goeido had another 12-win score just six months earlier, while Terunofuji went the entirety of 2016 not posting more than 12 wins across any two basho combined, literally setting new all-time records in terribleness for an ozeki.

Was Terunofuji healthy the whole year? Does he not suffering from any injury?

That the same logic. The same hyperbolic style. Does Takanohana II dishonour the rank of a yokozuna in 1999? He barely achieved four KK (two 8 wins, and 9 wins, and eleven wins) and had 36 wins in total that year. But no one would really argue that he dishonours anything. No.

The same aplies (at least for me) to Terunofuji. His performances were overshadowed by injuries. So 2016 is no real indicator for his capabilities.