Basho Talk - Hatsu Basho 2016 +++ Spoiler Alert! +++

[dingo]

(Anyone have predictions for Tochinoshin's record this basho?)

Before the basho, either 7 or 8 wins, leaning towards 7. Now, most likely 8 and maybe 9. Of course, that's just an average figure, and reality may diverge from averages quite often.

I would even say 9 or 10, honestly with the form he seems to be in I don't see anyone else besides the yokozunas and maybe Kotoshogiku beating him. If he gets lucky or if one of the yokozunae has a bad day he might even pick up a kinboshi.

[Dwale]

(Anyone have predictions for Tochinoshin's record this basho?)

Before the basho, either 7 or 8 wins, leaning towards 7. Now, most likely 8 and maybe 9. Of course, that's just an average figure, and reality may diverge from averages quite often.

I would even say 9 or 10, honestly with the form he seems to be in I don't see anyone else besides the yokozunas and maybe Kotoshogiku beating him. If he gets lucky or if one of the yokozunae has a bad day he might even pick up a kinboshi.

Shoot, he's got the power for it, though my gut is trying to tell me "Not this time." Or maybe that's those greasy chips I just ate...

As a komusubi, he isn't eligible for kinboshi.

[Gurowake]

Ura had a very exciting match today on his way to 2-0. Looking to try and break into the sekitori ranks this basho if he scores high enough.

Would a juryo promotion from his current rank pretty much require a 7-0?

Most likely but not necessarily.

According to

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&form1_rank=Ms8&form1_wins=6

since 1974, 3 out of 27 were promoted to juryo from Ms8 with a 6-1 record

If he gets quite a lot of banzuke luck, he would be possible

Oshinoyama benefited from 3 Makuuchi retirements, and I think still wouldn't have gotten promoted over a 4-3 Ms5 now, although that's debatable since I don't think we'll ever see that decision get made any time soon. Mitsuruyama (6-9 J10e, although bottom was J13 then) wouldn't have gotten demoted for Daisharin now. And Narimatsu wouldn't have gotten promoted over a 4-3 Ms3 today (probably not over a 5-2 Ms6 either). That's not to say it's impossible, but it most likely would require a lot of retirements and/or a whole lot of luck. We've got Tokitenku as a kyujo demotion, but it probably will require a lot more than that.

[Kotomikey]

(Anyone have predictions for Tochinoshin's record this basho?)

I figured before the basho, he would win 8.

[Benevolance]

My prediction was that he would go a perfect 15-0, end up jun-yusho to Kisenosato at 14-1, and be demoted to Maegashira 2 W.

[dingo]

(Anyone have predictions for Tochinoshin's record this basho?)

Before the basho, either 7 or 8 wins, leaning towards 7. Now, most likely 8 and maybe 9. Of course, that's just an average figure, and reality may diverge from averages quite often.

I would even say 9 or 10, honestly with the form he seems to be in I don't see anyone else besides the yokozunas and maybe Kotoshogiku beating him. If he gets lucky or if one of the yokozunae has a bad day he might even pick up a kinboshi.

Shoot, he's got the power for it, though my gut is trying to tell me "Not this time." Or maybe that's those greasy chips I just ate...

As a komusubi, he isn't eligible for kinboshi.

Yeah I forgot that he's not eligible for kinboshi -- seems like I haven't still quite gotten used to the fact that the kyokai actually promoted him into sanyaku... Well, since he's a relatively new sanyaku I guess we could call it a spiritual kinboshi :)

[Jakusotsu]

Nasty landing by Jokoryu - looks like kyujo is imminent.

Too bad for the lad, now he had somewhat recovered from his former injuries.

[rhyen]

Looks like Okinoumi was robbed.

[Pandaazuma]

Scandalous decision against zensho Okinoumi today! Were they all asleep?? Not even a mono-ii! Okinoumi will be gutted with that...a clear win and yusho lead stolen from him.

[Morty]

So in the past 18 months or so we have had Endo, Jokoroyu, Chiyonokuni, Osunaarashi, Kotoyuki and now Teronofuji all suffer significant knee injuries, and have watched all of them try to gambarize through it rather than take time off. The only person that seems to have worked for is Kotoyuki. Meanwhile Tochinoshin does his knee, takes three or so bashos off, starts again in low makushita and is currently a Komusubi. Go figure.

This could be viewed as a lesson on how to destroy the next generation of talent before they even really get going.

And Okinoumi got completely hosed today. I don't normally get on the "he was robbed" bandwagon, but that one was blatant.

[Akinomaki]

Scandalous decision against zensho Okinoumi today! Were they all asleep?? Not even a mono-ii! Okinoumi will be gutted with that...a clear win and yusho lead stolen from him.

Lazy "The Robber" Izutsu again.

From my pics posts

Day 2 M13e Takekaze (1-1) oshitaoshi M12w Shodai (1-1)

Izutsu was too lazy after a mono-ii just before this one and called it a sashi-chigae in no time, win for the just slightly more attacking rikishi who's hand touched down first - that must have resulted in tori-naoshi.

(I posted the video with replay in the video thread, download and super slow in VLC shows it)

Day 4 O2e Kotoshogiku (4-0) oshidashi M1e Aminishiki (2-2)

Hakuho got that famous tori-naoshi for a wrong foot like this - lazy Izutsu didn't want a mono-ii

Another one robbed by Izutsu

Edited January 14, 2016 by Akinomaki

[hamcornheinz]

anyone notice that Kakuryu doesn't fight well with smaller rikishi, and very well against larger opponents?

[Pitinosato]

First I thought Okinoumi was blatantly robbed.

But after having a close look in Kinta's Video, I am not sure !!!

Look there, at 4:17

I think his foot/toe was out.

I can't see it clearly, but it well could be.

IF that was this was this way, I will have to respect the Gyoji for his unbelievable good eyes !!

Pitinosato

[CT3*]

Looking at Terunofuji's current physical condition, its hard not to be reminded of Baruto.

Has Ikioi added some weight? He looks a bit heavier to me.

[Mihasan]

Looking at Terunofuji's current physical condition, its hard not to be reminded of Baruto.

Has Ikioi added some weight? He looks a bit heavier to me.

He did, he is allready close to 170 kilos and he looks stronger as well...

Edited January 14, 2016 by Mihasan

[Dapeng]

So in the past 18 months or so we have had Endo, Jokoroyu, Chiyonokuni, Osunaarashi, Kotoyuki and now Teronofuji all suffer significant knee injuries, and have watched all of them try to gambarize through it rather than take time off. The only person that seems to have worked for is Kotoyuki. Meanwhile Tochinoshin does his knee, takes three or so bashos off, starts again in low makushita and is currently a Komusubi. Go figure.

This could be viewed as a lesson on how to destroy the next generation of talent before they even really get going.

And Okinoumi got completely hosed today. I don't normally get on the "he was robbed" bandwagon, but that one was blatant.

Maybe the old rule about injury suffered during basho should be reintroduced but modified, for example the rikishi is allowed to rest for up to 2 basho but being demoted as if he had gotten a 7-8 or based on his average winning rate, whichever is worse. If he rests for more than 2 basho he will be demoted as 0-15.

[Dwale]

Ah, man. Homarefuji working on the opposite of a zensho yusho. Is there a term for that?

Toyohibiki owned the **** out of that bout. Wow.

Shoudai wins over Mitakeumi and makes it look easy. Good on him.

I like Takayasu, but wow! Just on the verge of going out, I knew it would take something like that to win and my heart sank. I figured Gagamaru was too heavy, but apparently not.

For Okinoumi...that really did -look- like his win from that camera angle. That's all I'll say.

Kotoyuki seems to be ascending while Ichinojo appears to be a beanbag with his face drawn on it. Where is he?

Takarafuji showing some good defense on the bales. I hope he really enjoys that win after all the effort he put into getting it.

Tochiouzan played it smart, though it looked for a moment that Aminishiki might've had him.

Kotoshogiku gets a win despite that he looks like an amorous potato every time he gets someone against the bales.

Yeah, if Terunofuji wasn't in terrible pain after that match then he should have gone into acting.

Shohozan lost the match, but he -did- win the game of "The dohyo is lava" he had going.

I've noticed Harumafuji sometimes starts by uselessly trying to push much larger opponents back by the neck. When this fails to work, he quickly switches to something else, but I wonder if someone will exploit that... Nice-looking finish for him today, though.

Yay, Ikioi! Two and three on day five for a komusubi? Yeah, he didn't come here to mess around, and he doesn't seem dispirited at all, either.

One of the longer ones I've done, but that's just because of all the entertaining sumo. Kanpai!

[Akinomaki]

Izutsu defends his decision as "The bout was going the way of Toyonoshima. Being there as judge and TV is different." The gyoji also as a rule simply point in the direction of the one going forward, Konosuke didn't see anything more. The papers of course can't accuse the shimpan as bluntly as I can, but it was obvious that Okinoumi remained on the bales the whole time.
Lazy "The Robber" Izutsu strikes again - I presume he tells his shift "Don't bother me with a mono-ii other than one also a child could tell". This one even a child could tell though.

http://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/1592204.html

For his 3rd misjudgment already this basho I want to see a 3 day suspension for Izutsu.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Akinomaki

[Katooshu]

First I thought Okinoumi was blatantly robbed.

But after having a close look in Kinta's Video, I am not sure !!!

Look there, at 4:17

I think his foot/toe was out.

I can't see it clearly, but it well could be.

IF that was this was this way, I will have to respect the Gyoji for his unbelievable good eyes !!

Pitinosato

Eh...maybe Okinoumi was out (I don't think he was) but that's far from clear in the picture and of course the gyoji and shimpan initially see it in real time, which can make it difficult for someone to make accurate judgments even if they have great eyes. In situations like this there should be a mono-ii so that the result is fair....if the gyoji turns out being correct then fine, decision upheld.

As for other matches:

--Great bout between Takarafuji and Sokokurai. Takarafuji is only 1-4 this basho but he's fought hard each time and today it payed off.

--I thought Aminishiki was in a good position against Tochiozan and I question whether he should have backed up and gone for a hatakikomi

--What goes around comes around, as Takekaze was blown away by Toyohibiki much like the way the former steamrolled Chiyotairyu the day before

--It was hard to watch Terunofuji perform like that. If he doesn't give the knee more time to recover I fear that he's going to hobble around basho to basho and fail to achieve his potential.

--Mitakeumi can't seem to figure out Shodai

--I see that makushita prospect Sato stopped his six bout losing streak.

Edited January 14, 2016 by Kotooshu's Revenge

[dingo]

Ah, man. Homarefuji working on the opposite of a zensho yusho. Is there a term for that?

Not particularly, but if someone were to invent one, I guess you could call it a zenpai "yusho"... or something like that.

I'm happy for Ikioi, so far he hasn't done particularly well in sanyaku in his career so I hope this time will be different!

[inhashi]

East shimpan should have been particularly vigilant during Toyonoshima/Okinoumi. Izutsu should be responsible. Even the crowd gave out a questionable yet very audible murmur, and Toyonoshima knowingly expressing who the victor was after he fell. How can the shimpan not even see what really happened? Very controversial decision.

[WAKATAKE]

The way to make things happen is if the media keeps pressing the NSK about it. There is nothing to reverse the decision as the day is done, but Hakkaku as chairman has a responsibility of going back and seeing that video, and admitting that Izutsu got the call wrong.

[inhashi]

And that indeed is happening. Izutsu still defends his decision and NSK's telephone lines are being flooded by fans to vehemently protest it (Bomb about to be blown...) Social media in an uproar even after almost a day after the match. It looks really ugly.

[WAKATAKE]

And that indeed is happening. Izutsu still defends his decision and NSK's telephone lines are being flooded by fans to vehemently protest it (Bomb about to be blown...) Social media in an uproar even after almost a day after the match. It looks really ugly.

Good. Just tweeted myself about the whole thing. Use #nhk_oozumo because NHK monitors that hashtag for it's sumo fans. I'm sure that NHK will be wondering the same thing. Hakkaku especially has a responsibility as chairman to address it.

[Asashosakari]

I can't quite imagine that Hakkaku will say anything about it - shouldn't shimpan director Isegahama be the first port of call, if any?