Asa in hot water again?

[Kintamayama]

......

The NSK being omnipotent is an axiom.....

I appreciate the long description that you gave and I cannot but agree that if one accepts all that it is his own business. The only sentence that I left above actually summarizes everything within few words. Let me only add for the last time that I was not referring to what is freely accepted (all those heavy conditions that you described), but to the way in which the decision of the punishment was taken.

It's all the same "way", the same package, the same "deal" called Sumo.

[Jonosuke]

Takasago oyakata met with Asashoryu again at his home today and he failed again to convince Asashoryu to go to a hospital and have a press conference.

Apparently today's meeting did not go well as yesterday. Takasago oyakata explained Asashoryu's mental state appeared to have a "wave" and this day was on the low side.

He admitted that Asashoryu was far from meeting with reporters to answer any questions and in his current state he feels he can only continue his treatment for physical injuries (elbow and low back) and mental condition at his home. The oyakata reiterated that there is no plan to allow him to return to Mongolia at this time.

[Jonosuke]

Well. Asa wants to go out to Mongolia, does not he?

Shame on Kyokai, they should allow Asa go home (Sign of approval...)

There are three dozens or so of his brethren sweating daily under 80% humidity 35 degree C sun out in Jyungyo stops, interacting and entertaining sumo fans. I am sure some of them would love to go back to see their parents or rest up to heal their injuries.

But do they even get a chance to participate in a charity game in their home? It's their day job and before they do anything else, they do their job first. It's the same with all of us. We don't leave our job without notifying our superiors nor come up with a medical report to opt out of doing our job and then go out and play.

While Asashoryu cools his head in his air conditioned home, all of them are out working and doing their best for Ozumo. So before you cry shame on the Kyokai, ask who should be ashamed of his conduct and need to show himself in public and to apologize to sumo fans and fellow rikishi for his indiscretion.

[Hananotaka]

Jonosuke - ;-) (Sign of approval...)

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj]

From what I gather, lots of people here on this forum are thinking and implying that Mongolians have been going gaga over this here. In fact, this is far from the truth. From what I see on the newspapers and interviews on TV over here, although most are surprised with the recent decisions, prevailing opinions here are geared towards pro-Kyokai and generally most are quite understanding of those decisions. Asa

Edited August 10, 2007 by Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj

[Kintamayama]

Takasago Oyakata went twice to Asashouryuu's house yesterday to try and convince him to do an interview. The day before, he was totally convinced he could persuade him to do it and he even went as far as publicly half-promising it would happen.. Yesterday, reality hit home hard. The yokozuna reverted to his numb state. The first visit was around 3 pm. Asa would not listen to Takasago's pleas.

T: "Do you feel like doing an interview?'

A: "No, I don't feel like it yet".

T: "Retreating into your shell will get us nowhere.."

A: "No, I don't feel like it yet".

The stable tokoyama was on standby, but remained without a job.

After about 50 minutes, Asashouryuu's friend, a horse breeder Mr. Kondou(?),近藤利一 who is nicknamed "Asashouryuu's father in Japan", came to visit, and joined the conversation, which was attended by Asashouryuu's personal manager. (Side note-since when does a rikishi have a personal manager? In what capacity?who is he? Who made him manager and what are his duties? Is he from within the stable or the Kakkai?? I've read of his existence before, but what does this mean?? This is mind boggling to me..)

"Under these circumstances, if he does an interview, won't it be pathetic?", asked the friend.

"How about if we prefer medical treatment over the interview?", intervened the Personal Manager.

Takasago left after an hour and 13 minutes, very agitated. "At present I can see his point. Poor guy", he said. As soon as he arrived at the Kyokai offices, he decided to give it another try and returned immediately to Asa's house. It took him another 12 minutes at the house to give up and leave.

He gave another interview, looking very bitter. "He says he is no shape to give any interview. His mental state has shifted between yesterday and today.. I was too optimistic. I now think it may be better that he get some treatment, and then do the interview", he said.

Takasago Oyakata after pressing:

And now, the horse breeder friend's version:

"He's been taking a large number of sleeping pills.He is mage-less, not shaving and his hair is unwashed. He has lost weight. He is delusional. He speaks incoherently. １週間前には若い衆に乱暴し、窓から物を投げようとした姿を目撃した (one week ago he was rude to the young people and wanted to throw things out the window?? Doesn't sound right..somebody??) This is my 4th visit to him, and his situation is deteriorating. He is no shape for an interview. While himself negating a return to Mongolia, he keeps saying he wants to go home.. Every time he sees the soccer clip on TV, he holds his head. He is a changed human. He is totally miserable. I am worried he might never return to Sumo!!", said the friend. As for his family coming to support him- "I'm afraid they would be easy prey for the media", so nothing definite is set.

Adopted father leaving Asa's house:

Edited August 11, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Otokonoyama]

man up

1. to fulfill your responsibilites as a man, despite your insecurities and constant ability to place yourself in embarrasing and un-manly scenarios.

eg. Paul forcefully imposed the bet on everyone, yet he was the first to fail miserably on the very challenge he had conjured up.

Paul must now man up and meet his own challenge.

2. Be strong

Take control, take control of a (the) situation, be strong, rise to the moment

3. To work through impediments and obstacles without whining

In the National Basketball Association Championship finals, coach Avery Johnson of the Dallas Mavericks complained that their rivals, the Miami Heat, were playng "playground basketball" because of the Heat's physical play.

Heat player James Posey responded:"If Johnson wants to call it playground basketball, so be it. Well, sometimes in playground ball you go out there and man up and say 'I can play through a turnover and play through a foul.' You just continue to play. That's playground ball and you just have to man up about the situation."

i.e. resolute determined persevering undiscouraged steadfast

4. Be more brave. Step up.

When a grown man is crying and moaning about something out of his control and someone tells him to knock it off or "man up"

Worker 1: Man, i hate diging ditches. Why do we have to do this all the time? This sucks. I need a break. My feet hurt. The boss hates me.

Worker 2: Quit acting like a little girl and "Man up"!

Hope Asashoryu has a moment to surf on over to the urban dictionary.

[Kintamayama]

Some papers are now openly saying that the fact that Asa is receiving visitors at home other than doctors, tsukebito and his Oyakata is blatantly in violation of the "house arrest" conditions he is under. Some even go as far as suggesting his "horse owner" friend may be responsible for the change of heart Asa had regarding the interview. ("He spoke to me in a childish voice and asked to see his mother and family", is one of the latest quotes attributed to the friend..)

"This 'third party' and his intervening is making Takasago lose whatever face he has left", they say. Takasago is depicted as someone who doesn't know what he's doing-leaving Asa's house only to return later for 10 minutes, leaving again, looking totally dazed from the quick turn of events.

Hints of intai have been increasingly raised these last few hours for Asa, and questions regarding Takasago's leadership abilities are being mentioned as well

Edited August 11, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj]

("He spoke to me in a childish voice and asked to see his mother and family", is one of the latest quotes attributed to the friend..)

It gives impression that Asa's not allowed to see even his family.

Media his brother is coming to Japan. What a heck they (family) are waiting for? Maybe his family need permission from Kyokai to see him ?

Edited August 11, 2007 by Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj

[Kintamayama]

Media his brother is coming to Japan. What a heck they (family) are waiting for? Maybe his family need permission from Kyokai to see him ?

No, it was reported that Asa, consulting with the doctors and friends, has asked they don't come at the moment, because he is afraid the media will overwhelm them. When Asa mentioned his mother and family, it was in the context of returning to Mongolia, and not their visiting him.

[paolo]

Some papers are now openly saying that the fact that Asa is receiving visitors at home other than doctors, tsukebito and his Oyakata is blatantly in violation of the "house arrest" conditions he is under.

The papers are obviously right. It is not enough for him not to go out and see people outside for 4 months (!?!); even when he is at home he must only see very few people. Just to be positive, I would have some practical proposals:

1. an official list (the shorter, the better) of the few persons he is allowed to see must be defined by the Kyokai as soon as possible.

2. all visits must be announced in advance.

3. a policeman must remain in front of the main door, one in front of the back door, one in front of each window, and probably one near the chimney to check that nobody enters without permission. Any person who wants to see Asashoryu must be on the list (see point 1) and show his identity document before being allowed in.

4. in order to avoid that Asashoryu buys the policemen as he bought the bashos, a TV must continously monitor the policemen themselves to see they do not accept money from Asashoryu or anybody else.

5. an iron mask like the one used at the times of the Kings of France might be used around Asashoryu's head to prevent him to see anybody who in spite of all controls succeeded to enter his house. The mask's key should be kept by the Kyokai, given to the preannounced visitor before the visit and given back to the Kyokai immediately after the visit. Any visitor that happened to omit this step would be immediately cancelled from the list.

NO MERCY FOR THE CRIMINAL !!!

...... Takasago is depicted as someone who doesn't know what he's doing.....

...... and questions regarding Takasago's leadership abilities are being mentioned as well ......

This is quite probable, but very few of us would like to be in his position and very few of us would know what to do.

He is probably trying to do the following two things at the same time:

a. save Asashoryu's few chances to go on in Sumo. That is why he explains so long that Asashoryu's psychical conditions do not allow him to give a conference press right now (which is probably true), even if this is a double edged weapon.

b. save his own ass. That is why he gives details about how much he is trying to convince Asashoryu to the press conference. This is a double edged weapon too, because in this way he admits he failed up to now.

I have the impression that sometimes he speaks too much, but in his very very difficult situation not to say anything would probably be worse.

Hints of intai have been increasingly raised these last few hours for Asa

This would be very strange. In my opinion, if the Kyokai thought that he had to intai, they would have had to tell him. Or Asashoryu could have left immediately, in anger, saying that he could not accept the punishment. Now, as far as we are told, he is not in such a condition as to take such a decision in control of himself. Unless we think, of course, that the Kyokai are so coward that they did not dare to dismiss him, but just put him in a situation where HE had to retire. Are they ?

Edited August 11, 2007 by paolo

[Jonosuke]

After about 50 minutes, Asashouryuu's friend, a horse breeder Mr. Kondou(?),近藤利一 who is nicknamed "Asashouryuu's father in Japan", came to visit, and joined the conversation, which was attended by Asashouryuu's personal manager. (Side note-since when does a rikishi have a personal manager? In what capacity?who is he? Who made him manager and what are his duties? Is he from within the stable or the Kakkai?? I've read of his existence before, but what does this mean?? This is mind boggling to me..)

Riichi Kondo is a chairman of his supporter club. I believe he owns a construction company and owns a number of throughred horses. And 「若い衆」(Wakaishu) he is talking about is not simply "young people" but the heya's junior rikishi, likely Asashoryu's tsukebito.

As for Asahoryu's personal manager, my understanding is that he is a son of the former Takasago oyakata (he had at least a couple of sons - one was a professional wrestler and the other was a chanko restaurant owner). Obviously with a son of his former shisho, hanging around Asahoryu, Takasago oyakata really cannot boss Asashoryu around.

As Moti implied that having these "outsiders" present in the same room must have made the oyakata's job much tougher and more frustrating than anything else. While it's good to have his personal friends keeping contact with Asashoryu, all these people advising Asashoryu one way or another must be making the oyakata's life much harder. From a career point of view, the oyakata is battling for his as much as Asashoryu. Asashoryu must understand if this oyakata goes, he goes out as well. Both their career are on the line.

Edited August 11, 2007 by Jonosuke

[Kaikitsune Makoto]

paolo is fervent!

This new guy, the "father" and horse breeder man makes also such comments in public that it is simply stunning. Makes Shoryu look more and more like the ultimate weakling. These kind of comments can't appeal to anyone. Instead of pity they arouse suspicion of whether the Asashoryu prior to the incident has died and some new replica has been brought in instead. It is really odd that Shoryu isn't all fired up and willing to kill everyone and annihilate all his enemies by eating his foes alive in Hatsu and developing an anger of megalomanic proportions. It is really strange that he seems so beaten. Is he really that weak? The punishment won't change anyway. He has as good grounds to do keiko as much as he likes and polish his sumo and nobody messes with his sumo so basically all he needs is to do what he has done so far and set his goals on Hatsu.

He hasn't been this way even for 2 weeks yet. It is NOT a depression of any sort. Why is this term brought up even now? Has Shoryu ever faced any real difficulties in life? Is this the first time he has difficult times? If he was a powerful bully in his youth as he must have been and then went to Japan and had the talent and desire to advance fast to high level in sumo and he hasn't had any major kyujo causing injuries, only the usual package of wear and tear, he has money. Is this the first time he is tested?

Why is it that almost all comments about Shoryu by people who meet him seem totally dumb and degrading? Or am I the only one who thinks that they should all shut up and not put up this bizarre show that only makes Shoryu look so incredibly degenerated.

[Hananotaka]

It is really odd that Shoryu isn't all fired up and willing to kill everyone and annihilate all his enemies by eating his foes alive in Hatsu and developing an anger of megalomanic proportions.

Don't ever change, Kaikitsune. (Laughing...)

Edited August 11, 2007 by Hananotaka

[Kintamayama]

Ex-Yokozuna Kitanofuji has sent some words of advice to Asashouryuu. "Do the interview and start refreshed!!", he advised, from the jungyo in Hokkaido, which was dedicated to him and celebrated 50 years since he joined Sumo. Back in 1972, while at the rank of Yokozuna, he went kyujo in the middle of Natsu basho, citing insomnia. He then went to Hawaii and was caught surfing, receiving a "stern warning" from the Kyokai.. "At that time, I was ordered by my shisho to return home immediately and in no uncertain terms. I did that , promptly apologized, and quickly joined the jungyo. If he would have done the same it would have been better. His Oyakata who didn't make this happen is to blame!! " he added. "A two basho suspension can be a bummer, but I'd like him to think of it as a good rest", he summed up.

Edited August 12, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama]

And the saga continues. The NSK appointed doctor is now on holidays overseas, so they will be sending a "pinch hitter" instead. This will be the fourth doctor Asa will see, 3 of them shrinks, in the last two weeks. "It looks like we'll have a new psychiatrist seeing him on Monday. I would like as many doctors as possible to see him", said Takasago Oyakata. Asa's people disagree. "We think that at least from the mental point of view, the same doctor should be seeing Asa. Why another new doctor??", they wondered. 2 of the 4 docs are considered Asa's friends, Honda and Hiroishi. Imasaka (??) is the NSK guy, and now we get to meet a new NSK guy.. The diagnosis so far ranged from pre-depressional consternation to "acute stress", and the new guy will probably have another opinion.

"If Asa will be able to move, he will start going for treatment at a hospital at the beginning of next week", said Takasago Oyakata, "He is in no way close to being able to be seen in public", retorted his camp. Said camp has also expressed its wishes that Honda the friendly physician be allowed to "sit in" with the new guy, which probably won't go down too well with the NSK.

And the saga indeed continues.

Edited August 12, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Kintamayama]

Kitanofuji's words have suddenly become a hot topic. He squarely put the blame on Takasago Oyakata's shoulders. Although he isn't a part of the NSK anymore, his word (ex-Takasago Ichimon and all) still has a lot of clout in NSK circles. Takasago oyakata is becoming increasingly isolated, and his standing as a riji seems to be in jeopardy. "It's deplorable. What I don't get is why he didn't order Asashouryuu back the minute he saw the soccer images. If he would have forced him back and made him apologize all this would not have happened. It's all Takasago's fault for not taking things into his hands from the start!!", he said.

Although he isn't with the Kyokai, he still carries influence, as the former shisho of Takasago Ichimon leaders Kokonoe and Hakkaku. Although Takasago Oyakata is also a riji, it's looking exceedingly difficult for him to be re-elected come January.

"No comment about everything", said Hakkaku Oyakata at the jungyo.

Kitanofuji at the jungyo, looking good:

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj]

I've never seen Asa wearing glasses

[Kintamayama]

Takasago seems to have lost his will to help, together with what's left of his dignity... "My next visit to Asashouryuu will come only after a medical diagnosis that he is better. If he is still ill, I will not be visiting him!", he declared. He has canceled his summer holiday and will be awaiting today's medical treatment results. The NSK is not sending an alternative doctor at this stage, although Takasago requested it. "Our specialist is on holiday overseas. we haven't decided anything yet, but we feel we can wait till his return. If he doesn't return soon, we will consider a replacement", said Yoshida-san, head of the NSK medical facility.

Edited August 13, 2007 by Kintamayama

[Otokonoyama]

IIRC, it was The Buddha who said "...even a god would exhaust the good kamma which had divinized him..."

[Kintamayama]

Isenoumi Oyakata went to the Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports,Science and Technology today to explain the Asashouryuu situation. The visit lasted some 40 minutes. "House arrest? What house arrest? No one said he is totally prohibited from leaving his house. After all, he will be going to the hospital for treatment etc.. From the Kyokai's point of view after he serves the 'punishment' we expect the return of a genki Yokozuna!!", he explained. On August 3rd, Ibuki Bunmei, the cabinet minister made it clear that he wanted to see a "normal show of leadership" in this matter, candidly saying what he thought on this matter.

[Kintamayama]

Asashouryuu will restart his medical treatments on August 16th. Takasago did another 180 degree flip-first he wanted as many physicians to see Asa as possible, but now he has agreed to wait for the Kyokai's doctor (the first one to examine him) to return from his overseas trip, and they will commence on the 16th. "It's best that the same man continues seeing him, rather than many different doctors. Quietly being left alone is a treatment in itself... He won't be hospitalized any time soon", he said. As for the physical injuries in his left elbow and back, the Oyakata explained that Asa's personal trainer will be taking care of those.

[Kintamayama]

From the Kyokai's point of view after he serves the 'punishment' we expect the return of a genki Yokozuna!!",

In other words he will be allowed mope from now till January?

In other words they hope he doesn't do anything rash that might turn the tables of sympathy on them.

[Ikh Mongol Dagvadorj]

Isenoumi Oyakata went to the Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports,Science and Technology today to explain the Asashouryuu situation. The visit lasted some 40 minutes. "House arrest? What house arrest?

Maybe Crown Prince should send his symphaty for Asashoryu.

Word "HOUSE ARREST is not nice, it is humilating. No one accept that punishment for crime of playing soccer with kids.

[Kintamayama]

[No one accept that punishment for crime of playing soccer with kids.

After 4000 posts, you still think that's the issue, huh?