Milk and diary products

[Manekineko 200]

Well, why should Kaikitsune be the only one to start rambling topics? :-P

Recently I visited two countries: France and Italy, and sampled their milk and yoghurt. But before I continue, let me fill the background... I am a true milk-lover: as a child I'd drink a big cup of milk every morning, and the habit stuck. When I became aware that drinking that much sugar in milk form might be a big factor in my increasing weight, I wisely substitued much of daily milk intake with plain yoghurt, although at the time I was unaware of existance of un-plain yoghurt, living in a poor ex-communist country still unfamiliar with wonders of milk-derived drinks. But although fruity and creamy versions were unknown, in our stores you could (and still can) find sour milk, kefir, and other fermented/soured milk products differing in strains of microorganisms and other conditions used for the purpose. Most of the milk is cow-milk, but sheep and goat milk is also available, although not with such a variety of forms and products.

Then consumerism burst onto the scene, bringing with it firstly low-fat products (which I dislike, but that is a subject for another rambling topic) and then the wealth of fruit-modified milk-drinks, yoghurts and other forms of milk. Addition of fruit is not that bad thing per se (although I prefer to make my own mixes), but the addition of extra sugar into milk and especially yoghurt is a sin that wails unto the heavens! (Protesting...) There should be a legislation forcing the producers of milk and yoghurt based drinks (as well as cold-tea drinks etc) to print huge WARNING! CONTAINS ADDITIONAL SUGAR! signs on the packages. [Another detour - Nestea's label, at least in Croatian, says that it contains among others sugar and dextrose. As dextrose is simply another name for sacharose or common table sugar, that has got me thoroughly confused and amused. (In a state of confusion...) (Laughing...) ]

So, back to France and Italy, France first. I was there only for a week, in a fine city of Lyon (more precisely, Villeurbanne, which is *not* Lyon as proud Villeurbannites would probably tell me if I asked :-) ), and I had problems locating fresh milk for breakfast/supper... In fact, I could only ever find the "long-life" milk - which was OK, but milk loses some of its fine taste in the process it endures to ensure long shelf-life. In the same store there were oodles of milk-derived products of all forms, but no fresh milk. I only checked three different stores in the same neighbourhood, but never did I find fresh milk... Strange. :-|

Then Italy: there I was happy to locate fresh milk, "Fine Italian Milk" it said (in Italian) proudly on the bottle. So I bought it, and when I tasted it - phaugh! (Sign of disapproval) It wasn't bad, it was perfectly fresh, but it had a strangest taste... What's more, all other Italian milks I tried had very similar basic taste, and that one didn't agree with me at all! Luckily for my milk-drinking habit, I discovered milk produced in France and Germany, but of course these are all long-life milks... (Sigh...) And funny thing is, French-produced milk in Italy is quite similar to the one I drank in Lyon. Are milk-tastes a country-wide phenomenon? :-O

At least I hoped to find some comfort in yoghurt, but here again I had trouble locating plain yoghurt: all sorts of fruity tastes, even coffee :-S flavoured yoghurt, and tricky things called "Creme" yoghurts which on inspection turned out to be yoghurt with added sugar :-/ . Plain unmodified yoghurt could only be found in big 500 mL packages in this town (Terni, Umbria), with a single exception of a discount store which I hapily raided for some 12 150 mL cups of plain yoghurt.

So, these are my experiences with milk and its derivatives... What about you? Do you like it, drink it every day? Or is it only an occasional gulp? Which is your favorite form of milk? Do you suffer from lactose (milk sugar) intolerance? What are your thoughts on fruity tastes and added sugar?

Is this a totaly silly topic? (Clapping wildly...)

[Kaikitsune Makoto 203]

So, these are my experiences with milk and its derivatives... What about you? Do you like it, drink it every day? Or is it only an occasional gulp? Which is your favorite form of milk? Do you suffer from lactose (milk sugar) intolerance? What are your thoughts on fruity tastes and added sugar?

Is this a totaly silly topic?

There are no totally silly topics! (Clapping wildly...)

Milk is the main beverage in my life. My yearly consumption of milk was probably about 600-700 litres some 10 years ago. Nowadays it is about 400-450 litres. Finland is the world leader in many areas and in this food/drink aspect we are the world leading nation in milk consumption. Iceland is close by but then there is a big gap to following countries. In Finland many people drink milk with meals. I usually drink 0.4-0.5litres of milk with dinner. Milk must be consumed COLD. The colder, the better. Warm milk is for babies and tastes awful, semi-cold milk is a big sin. Cold milk with salmiakki is a nice combination. In Finland 1.0% and 1.5% fat milks are most popular. Thick fatty milk is not consumed much anymore. Fat free milk is consumed more and more but its taste is not as good as 1.0% milk's taste.

I love milk, I drink it every day. I can easily drink litre of milk when I eat a big dinner. No occasional gulping. I need my milk fix. It has a lot of high quality protein. No lactose intolerance for me. Added sugar???? Lactose is all the sugar milk needs. Fruity tastes are unnecessary! Honest cow milk!!!! Milk RULES.

2 yogurts daily too. Very little cheese. My cheese consumption is probably Japanese.

Statistics of milk consumption per capita according to The World Dairy Situation 2003, Bulletin of the International Dairy Federation 384/2003.

Liquid milk products consumption in the world:

1. Finland 177.9kg

2. Iceland 175.3kg

3. Sweden 142.4kg

4. Ireland 141.7kg

5. Denmark 135.7kg

6. Spain 123.0kg

7. Norway 121.3kg

8. Great-Britain 112.5kg

9. Portugal 111.0kg

10. Australia 106.8kg

11. Cyprus 99.6kg

12. Austria 99.4kg

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16. France 91.9kg

16. Germany 91.9kg

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19. Italy 87.2kg

20. USA 85.5kg

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Greek 68.9kg

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Japan 35.9kg

In cheese consumption

1.Greece 27.5kg

2. France 25.8kg

3. Iceland 22.3kg

4. Germany 21.8kg

5. Italy 21.4kg

6. Switzerland 19.7kg

7. Austria 17.8kg

8. Finland 17.7kg

9. Sweden 17.4kg

10. Belgium 16.1kg

11. USA 15.0kg

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Japan 1.9kg!!!! Not much cheese there eh??

Butter consumption is overwhelming in France. 8.1kg! In Japan 0.7kg.

Finland 5.9kg.

Sour milk products including yogurt:

Holland 42.8kg leads with Denmakr and Finland close by with over 40kg. Sweden and Iceland only 30+ countries and then Israel 28kg (probably Kintamayama's fault). Then other European countries. Canada has only 5.6kg, USA is not in this statistics.

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

Some friends in Canada have remarked that they can tell when the dairy cows go to pasture in the summer, and when they go back to hay in the winter by the taste of the milk...apparently grass alters the flavour enough to notice. The feed used affects meat taste & quality, so why not milk...

This may at least partially explain why Italian milk tastes different from French milk tastes different from...the feed used from country to country (as well as the relative proportions) may well differ.

[Jonosuke 28]

I make my own yogurt (is this spelling correct or is it supposed to be yoghurt?) so depending on what milk I use, it comes with a different taste and texture. Basically I use "organic" 2% milk (2% being most common around here).

I got the seed from Japan - actually in Japan it's called "Caspian Yogurt" (there is a NPO who will send a couple of packages for around 2,000 Yen). It's pretty easy to make as you save a little of what you made before and add a new milk and 8 hours later, Voila. If I understand correctly, this one originally came from around Caucasus region in Russia or was it Georgia...

Sometimes I make Kefir as well - the seed I got from Georgia (but this one is in U.S.) It's more liquidy and a bit of sour taste but very refreshing. I also sometimes buy a carton from a Russian grocery store as well and it pretty much tastes the same - it's like a yogurt drink.

The only thing I don't like is I cannot get non-pasteurized milk around here so I pretty much settle with so-called "organic" milk whatever that is.

My mother-in-law in Japan makes yogurt as well but she uses 4.5% so it comes out much more solidish. I haven't tasted her Kefir yet but my wife tells me it does not taste like our Kefir at all. I guess I have to taste it the next time I am there.

As for those store yogurt, I avoid those fruits bottom or fruits mixed yogurt like a plague as they are so full of sugar. I stick with plain and mix fresh fruits like wild bluberries and if I want a bit of sweetness, I add Maple Syrup - a god's gift to man.

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

...if I want a bit of sweetness,  I add Maple Syrup - a god's gift to man.

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Spoken like a true Canadian (Heart)

[Onnagumo 4]

I like milk too, we drink it everyday here. Most of the time we drink normal unsweetened milk in our home, the 1,5 % fat variety, and sometimes I buy one of those sweetened varieties (the kids love it (In a state of confusion...) ).

The Netherlands produce a lot of milk and dairy products, so even in a supermarket I can easily get all kinds of milk (what a luxury, I know (Laughing...) ). Longlife, fresh, fat, low fat, fruity tastes, yoghurt drinks, you name it. Not far from our home is a farm where they sell their own fresh milk, cheese and yoghurt (Licking lips...) Such fresh milk tastes wonderful when it is cooooold!

And I think my household contributes a lot to that Dutch cheese consumption too (Protesting...) Me and my hubby like almost all kinds of cheese, my kids usually go for ordinary Dutch Gouda cheese.

In cheese consumption

Japan 1.9kg!!!! Not much cheese there eh??

Ehhh, I think a lot of that goes to Sadogatake beya.....(Clapping wildly...)

Kotonowaka Terumasa

-------------------

"Beer, Japanese sake, Shochu, I can go for anything.

If it's wine, I remember I drank seven or eight

bottles one time. I especially like

wine and cheese. For a bottle of wine, I can go for

two plate full of blue cheese easily.  I also put a

lot of parmesan cheese on pasta. I often empty out the

whole parmesan cheese box and there is nothing left

for anyone else!"

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[Exil 301]

(Got milk?...)

I usually avoid dairy products, except cheese and the occasional yogurt. Which reminds me, I just acquired some promising Parmigiano-Reggiano, similar to this one. (In a state of confusion...) Can't wait to sample it. (Clapping wildly...)

[sekihiryu 51]

Hmm milk, used to drink it by the gallon, became Lactose intolerant 2 years ago and stopped. I was initially disappointed but after research discovered that milk is not all that its cracked up to be.

I feel much better about the fact I cant drink it, in fact I would rarery drink it anymore even if I could.

Sure milk has protein and tastes good but that not all it has.

Be wary of milk. You dont need milk.

Some children can drink milk with no real side effects, fine, but I really feel sorry for the children who cant drink milk but are forced to by their misguided parents who think they are doing the right thing, that is a real shame.

Maybe the biggest shame is the Milk Industry propagating the myth that milk is awesome, they are like tobacco campanies pawning off their products. Why would they want to educate the public? too many people have too much to lose.

Ignorance is bliss - maybe the milk myth epitomizes that proverb more than any example I can think of.

If you are educated about milk and still want to drink it, then go ahead, its like alcohol in this regard, you know the risks.

But think twice before pouring it down your childs throat.

http://www.notmilk.com/

http://home.comcast.net/~j2jensen/research/milk/milk.htm

http://www.gentlebirth.org/nwnm.org/Child_...ilk_Too_Bad.htm

http://www.gentlebirth.org/nwnm.org/Got_Milk_Too_Bad.htm

http://www.panix.com/~nomilk/intro.htm

http://nomilk.com/

and also be wary of substituting milk with soy, its not all its cracked up to be either

http://www.wholehealthmd.com/print/view/1,...AR_1004,00.html

Got milk? nope

[sumofan 6]

Hmm milk, used to drink it by the gallon, became Lactose intolerant 2 years ago and stopped. I was initially disappointed but after research discovered that milk is not all that its cracked up to be.

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been there done that...

i used to drink a liter a day, but i gto the same problems: spending much time hurrying to the nearest toilet. I only discovered the cause when i also started eating cereals in the morning instead of plain bread. each week would start the same. monday i'd be fine. tuesday the problems began, and wednesday, thursday, fridayand saturday i would have 'bowel problems' :'-(

sunday and monday would be okay because i didn't drink much milk in the weekend.

another problem that is related to milk intake is irritation and swelling of the mucus membranes in the nose and throat cavity. my entire childhood at least one of my nostrils was blocked without any apparent reason. suddenly, the problem went away when i stopped drinking milk.

these days, i only use milk to make sauce now and again.

[aderechelsea 124]

i am eating yogurt as i type and i am the main consumer of sour milk in Greece ...

i don't drink much fresh milk but yogurt and sour milk are a "must"

i also do my best to help Greece in holding the first place in cheese consumption ...

[Chanko Thief 67]

A fine topic indeed. I absolutely love milk and used to drink a gallon a day. Unfortunately due to some (more than likely related) health problems, my wife does not allow me to drink milk anymore. But oh how I miss it, and crave it!

[orandashoho 720]

60 years ago, it was considered healthy to drink several glasses of milk a day. I never liked it much and drank it cold when it was more tasteless. Until a vacation in Switzerland, when we got our daily dosage 'straight from the cow'. The memory still makes me gag. After that, milk or runny foods made with milk made me sick. Butter too, but butter was harder to avoid when you have to eat what is cooked with butter and can only scrape off so much from a sandwich. One of the joys of leaving home to live on my own was being in charge of my own cooking and never having to consume milk or butter again. Today, sixty years after the summer of the horror milk, some kinds of yoghurt are tolerable, and I really like sharp, mature cheeses, but anything runny or buttery or curdly... yeeeeccchhh.

[sumojoann 1,256]

1 hour ago, Chanko Thief said:

A fine topic indeed. I absolutely love milk and used to drink a gallon a day. Unfortunately due to some (more than likely related) health problems, my wife does not allow me to drink milk anymore. But oh how I miss it, and crave it!

Could you drink soy milk instead?  When I was 4 years old, I developed an allergy to regular milk so my mother gave me soy milk & I loved the flavor of it.  If you are lactose intolerant, as you probably know, there's milk for that problem, too.

[Churaumi 728]

I'm an almond milk fan, but I have made my own soy milk and it was quite tasty. Not enough that I think it's worth doing as a regular source of soy milk, unless you have issues with the added sugar and preservatives. You still have to sweeten it, or else it's pretty unappealing. 

Edited May 22, 2020 by Churaumi

[Chanko Thief 67]

6 hours ago, sumojoann said:

Could you drink soy milk instead?  When I was 4 years old, I developed an allergy to regular milk so my mother gave me soy milk & I loved the flavor of it.  If you are lactose intolerant, as you probably know, there's milk for that problem, too.

I’ve tried some soy milk, but the flavor isn’t quite the same to me unfortunately. And when I have had it, it has been sugar free (unless all soy milk is sugar free and I just don’t know?), which didn’t suit my palate. I’m not lactose intolerant but I have recently been diagnosed with diabetes and my wife said no to milk due to the high sugar. I’ve tried many substitutes but none have come even close to tasting like the real thing. The only one I have found that is tolerable is oat milk actually. It is still very different but if you drink it fast enough, it’s not bad haha.

[Benihana 1,901]

When i was young i walked to a farmer just down the street every evening to buy a liter of milk for next day's breakfast. Sweet memories. A life without milk, cheese and yoghurt is possible, but pointless. I like to drink my cold milk from the Maßkrug, plain or with cocoa-powder. And when the weather is cold, hot milk with honey (and/or Licor 43) is the best of all drinks.

Edited May 22, 2020 by Benihana

[Naganoyama 5,841]

Oat milk is good in porridge. Better than cow's milk to my taste.

 

[Churaumi 728]

I've never even heard of oat milk. The only uses I've had for oats is oatmeal and brewing stouts. But...tell me more.

[Asojima 2,870]

11 minutes ago, Churaumi said:

I've never even heard of oat milk. The only uses I've had for oats is oatmeal and brewing stouts. But...tell me more.

Google is your friend.

[Churaumi 728]

6 minutes ago, Asojima said:

Google is your friend.

Google is nobody's friend, but point taken. 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Churaumi
I don't want my s*** taken over with oatmilk ads.

[Chanko Thief 67]

17 minutes ago, Churaumi said:

I've never even heard of oat milk. The only uses I've had for oats is oatmeal and brewing stouts. But...tell me more.

I’m new to oat milk as well. Only had it a couple of times since my wife made me give up real milk. But I can say that the consistency seemed very close to real milk and the flavor was not half bad, at least for the brand I have had. Worth a try.

[Akinomaki 39,755]

I use oat drink, as is the term here, every day for my fruits and vegetable chanko muesli, together with goat milk and from ordinary milk, yogurt and skyr. Goat milk also in the tea, and oat drink also against hypoglycemia.