Natsu 2024 discussion (results)

[Kaminariyuki 497]

20 hours ago, Benihana said:

Yeah, no need to. Kintamayama already did that in today's video.

First time on the forum in ages... (it's a long and uninteresting story), and I knew I'd see something useful. I'm messaging you, Benihana-san.

[dingo 1,159]

Hokutofuji has vastly improved in the last few days. Today he totally got it his way against Oshouma with a sharp low tachiai and strong pushing follow-up.

In the battle of the fallen ozeki, Shodai surprisingly came up on top, managing to outmuscle Mitakeumi. But this is the time in the basho Mitakeumi usually starts fading so I guess it was a question who's weaker, not necessarily who's stronger.

Daieisho maintained excellent balance despite Hiradoumi going for a pulldown. I felt that usually Hiradoumi would've been successful but this time Daieisho was more nimble than usual. Good win for him and crucial for staying in the yusho running.

That was some seriously Houdini-like sumo from Onosato. Atamifuji had him locked down and on a certain course to a dohyo exit, but somehow Onosato managed to slip out with a desperate yet slick move. Quite unexpected to see Onosato move like that.

Crucial win for Kotozakura to raise his own yusho chances, notching a win and reducing Ura's advantage. Patience really paid off for him today, getting Ura into a mawashi hold and waiting for him to make a move first to get an opening, then utilizing it very well. Great ozeki sumo yet again.

Oho did his best sumo of the basho so far to defeat Hoshoryu. It's flashes of brilliance like this that make me believe Oho can reach higher ranks once he figures out how to be more consistent.

[dingo 1,159]

8 hours ago, ArsionTrueHeart said:

If Onosato gets 10+ wins this time (which is very likely), would he be on an ozeki run in July considering that he faced and beat sanyaku-level opponents in March?

Good question, especially if he gets up to Sekiwake for the next basho. If (and that's a big if) he gets the yusho this or the next basho, I'm inclined to think he would get the nod. Unless the kyokai thinks he's too young and inexperienced, which I can totally see happening as well. I mean, having a guy who's barely been a year in ozumo at the next-highest rank is bound to raise some questions.

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

1 minute ago, dingo said:

Good question, especially if he gets up to Sekiwake for the next basho. If (and that's a big if) he gets the yusho this or the next basho, I'm inclined to think he would get the nod. Unless the kyokai thinks he's too young and inexperienced, which I can totally see happening as well. I mean, having a guy who's barely been a year in ozumo at the next-highest rank is bound to raise some questions.

I agree that he would need his run to include a yusho, a simple 11-11-11 would not suffice in this situation. But if manages another 11 wins right after, he will get it. 

[Taliesin 68]

I mean Onosato isn't even that young. 

[dingo 1,159]

24 is still fairly young for an ozeki. There was also his connection with the recent scandal that may make the Kyokai think twice before promoting him. 

Edited May 18 by dingo
Onosato turns 24 in June

[Reonito 1,335]

1 hour ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

I agree that he would need his run to include a yusho, a simple 11-11-11 would not suffice in this situation. But if manages another 11 wins right after, he will get it. 

Not sure even a yusho would do it, unless the scores are really off the charts. M5w would be a lower start than any of the 6 modern-era promotions that started at maegashira.

[Gurowake 3,915]

If Onosato is promoted to Ozeki after the July tournament, it will be because his last two basho would have been reasonable to give a promotion to Yokozuna had he already been Ozeki.  I don't think the M5 basho will count for anything as part of an Ozeki run other than getting him to Komusubi. 

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

2 hours ago, Reonito said:

Not sure even a yusho would do it, unless the scores are really off the charts. M5w would be a lower start than any of the 6 modern-era promotions that started at maegashira.

This would have been an Ozeki run if Takayasu managed to complete it:

2022.09	M4w		11-4 J	Jun-Yusho (6th) Kanto-sho (6th) Kinboshi
2022.11	M1e		12-3 D	Jun-Yusho (7th) Shukun-sho (4th)
2023.01	S2e		1-5-9

[Reonito 1,335]

28 minutes ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

This would have been an Ozeki run if Takayasu managed to complete it:

Did they say so at the time? Also, he was a former Ozeki who dropped due to injury, and there's (a single, 1960s) precedent for M4 but not for M5.

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

1 hour ago, Reonito said:

Did they say so at the time? Also, he was a former Ozeki who dropped due to injury, and there's (a single, 1960s) precedent for M4 but not for M5.

There was no reason for them to create an extra S slot for him unless they wanted him to be in a position to complete his O run.

M4 - M1 - S is not more impressive than M5 - K - S, if you ask me.

Edited May 19 by Bunbukuchagama

[Gurowake 3,915]

8 minutes ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

There was no reason for them to create an extra S slot for him unless they wanted him to be in a position to complete his O run.

This is not exactly true.  3 Sekiwake and 5 Komusubi is ugly.  4 of each is much prettier.

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

Just now, Gurowake said:

This is not exactly true.  3 Sekiwake and 5 Komusubi is ugly.  4 of each is much prettier.

I don't think NSK cares about symmetry this much. 

[WAKATAKE 2,631]

Takayasu would have been the first to accomplish the M-M-S-O in the six basho era if he had gotten through.

https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&columns=3&n_basho=4&form1_rank=M&form2_rank=M&form3_rank=S&form4_rank=O

There have been cases of the M-S-S-O, most notably Terunofuji and Tochinoshin in recent times. Yutakayama, Kaiketsu, Asashio, and Kitao are among the other examples in the 6BPY era. 

https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&columns=3&n_basho=4&form1_rank=M&form2_rank=S&form3_rank=S&form4_rank=O

[808morgan 805]

16 hours ago, Jakusotsu said:

Space Invader or Pokemon?

Ura likes that twisty side position, I don't see anyone else doing that. He can't flip around like a monkey anymore, he got too big. He would have back flipped or something at the end of this match back in the day. 

[Kujo 116]

On 18/05/2024 at 02:48, junsan said:

Bashful Onosato is going to bulldoze his way to Ozeki. Now, imagine a confident Onosato.

In this basho, Onosato in the dohyo-iri or sitting ringside waiting for his bout reminds me of flounder from animal house. I hope they don't start talking ozeki after this basho, an ozeki run should only be counted while sanyaku (unless you're gagamaru)  ;-}

 

[Jakusotsu 5,806]

M10e Shonannoumi (6-1) against M15w Roga (3-4) - they need a new sake vendor.

[Gospodin 187]

Is it too early to speak about an "Ozeki curse" ? Injuries, suspension, loss off form...not exactly best crop since 2017, Takakeisho excluded. Or am I biased ?

Edited May 19 by Gospodin

[Jakusotsu 5,806]

What was the explanation for the sashi-chigae with Ryuden-Takarafuji?

[Akinomaki 39,756]

9 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

What was the explanation for the sashi-chigae with Ryuden-Takarafuji?

The gunbai went to Ryuden, mono-ii for possible doutai, but Ryuden had a toe out before (with the foot on the tawara while throwing)

Edited May 19 by Akinomaki

[lackmaker 431]

9 hours ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

This would have been an Ozeki run if Takayasu managed to complete it:

He really should be called "If Takayasu"

[dingo 1,159]

1 hour ago, Gospodin said:

Is it too early to speak about an "Ozeki curse" ? Injuries, suspension, loss off form...not exactly best crop since 2017, Takakeisho excluded. Or am I biased ?

I've quietly thought about it myself for a while now. You could definitely make a case for it. Initially I thought the Mongolian duo are an example against "the ozeki curse", but what's happening with Kirishima can make one doubt. You've got to wonder what's gonna happen to Hoshoryu, is he next on the line? Spooky stuff 

[Akinomaki 39,756]

Onosato safely can continue towards the yusho - Waka didn't make the obvious prediction that he'll be the one, which would have been the kiss of death

[dingo 1,159]

Aoiyama seems to be at the end of the road, makushita is beckoning. He'll be lucky to escape demotion this basho. Seems like he will follow Kotoekou soon.

Endo on the other hand somehow seems to have his spark back with a 8-day kachikoshi in Juryo. Don't know if he's extra motivated, his injuries are better or his level is simply a notch over juryo. But it's good to see him doing well.

Would've been perhaps fairer to Ryuden to call a torinaoshi, but Takarafuji will be happy to stay among the leading rikishi with the win. Takarafuji's face after landing was quite funny -- what just happened? Did I win?

Nishikigi did a Shodai on Shodai, looking somewhat better than at the beginning of the basho. A kachikoshi is not out of reach yet for him, but I'd be really surprised if Shodai ends up with a winning record at the end of the basho.

Hiradoumi made it look easy against Atamifuji, which is somewhat surprising seeing how well Atamifuji has done against the higher ranks. But Hiradoumi came with a plan and executed it well, so well done to him.

Onosato read Daieisho really well and let his opponent execute a magnificent belly flop. Haven't seen such a good landing for a while. Considering Onosato is a newbie and they've only met once before, he managed to take very good advantage of Daieisho's lunging. Seems like homework done well.

Kotozakura seemed to run out of stamina a bit as Oho offered more resistance than he perhaps expected. Evenly fought bout, until Kotozakura managed to outpush Oho in the end. Despite the loss, Oho managing to wrestle almost at the same level as the ozeki is a sign of his recent development.

[RabidJohn 1,663]

4 hours ago, Gospodin said:

Is it too early to speak about an "Ozeki curse" ? 

Not at all. I mentioned the 'curse' had moved on to Kirishima a couple of days ago.

---

I really hope Mitakeumi only dead-legged* himself against the dohyo edge.

Maybe this is one for the trivia thread, but how often have the grandsons of two different yokozuna met in the musubi-no-ichiban?

47 minutes ago, dingo said:

Kotozakura seemed to run out of stamina a bit as Oho offered more resistance than he perhaps expected. 

Maybe the match didn't go as expected for Kotozakura, but I saw the outcome as Oho running out of stamina. 
The latter does seem to shine more when it's the last bout of the day, though. That may be his 'giant-killer' dad's DNA coming out.

*A term I'm sure I've not used since my schooldays!