Aki 2023 discussion (results)

[Akinomaki 39,755]

Ura is flying better than the flying monkey (Tobizaru)

Day 6 he won this way against Daieisho

o o o

today he was on the wrong side and lost to Kirishima

o

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

7 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

Ura is flying better than the flying monkey

[junsan 170]

Hoshoryu not getting torinaoshi was a good thing. Hope it fires him up.

[Yamanashi 3,723]

10 hours ago, dingo said:

Shishi has to practice suriashi a lot more, those were some big bear steps in the ring. 

It reminded me of a Three Stooges routine; all that was missing was Shishi yelling "WOO woo woo woo."

https://giphy.com/gifs/punch-stooges-eAEIWokxUHYRO

 

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

Internet is having fun with Hoshoryu - Kotonowaka decision:

[Benihana 1,901]

Some people on twitter think that Shishi's sumo is dangerous. His fall from the dohyo today was a result of bad ring sense, not complete exhaustion. I wonder what they call Takakeisho's flying headbutts...

[bettega 427]

7 hours ago, Iwayama said:

After seeing the replay the decision made sense to me. The top of Hoshoryu's foot dragged across the clay before Kotonowaka touched out. 

 

To me a Torinaoshi without doubt

[bettega 427]

3 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

Ura is flying better than the flying monkey (Tobizaru)

Day 6 he won this way against Daieisho

o o o

today he was on the wrong side and lost to Kirishima

o

 

Two of my favorites: Ura and Tobizaru  I really like the guys

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

9 minutes ago, bettega said:

To me a Torinaoshi without doubt

[bettega 427]

1 minute ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

... and they need to wash feets before bed

[Godango 956]

I was pretty upset with the Kotonowaka/Hoshoryu decision until my wife pointed out Hoshoryu's feet (as per above posts).

As usual, you just wish there'd be greater consistency. But hey, it keeps us coming back for more!

[Kaninoyama 1,694]

My initial instinct at the end of the Kotonowaka/Hoshoryu bout was that the gyoji got it wrong and was relieved to see the mono-ii. Slow-mo and still photos confirmed that Hoshoryu's foot was turned over while Kotonowaka's was still on the bales. Mainoumi, doing NHK duties, further asserted that Hoshoryu was shinitai. 

Surprised that there's much controversy about this one. 

[Yamanashi 3,723]

7 hours ago, Kaito said:

If you watch Kotonowaka's feet, he too drags the top of his foot over the clay before stepping out. But I thought this call was pretty surprising even without that. The position in the above image is very common, and the tops of the attacker's feet dragging is routinely ignored.

Well, doesn't the head shimpan make some little explanatory speech before the decision?  Did he explain?  Was it:

1) "Hoshoryu dragged the top of his foot before Kotonowaka maybe dragged just the top of his toe ... we can't tell."

2) "How are we going to pull this kid up to Ozeki unless we put our thumb on the scale just a little, amirite?"

3) "People are complaining that we aren't being consistent in our decisions.  Look, we've screwed up a handful of this type of call already, so we should screw up this one, too, to make it fair."

[Katooshu 3,132]

Are the bales a safe space? Can you put your hand on them and not be considered down? If they are considered out of play for any part of the body aside the bottom of the feet, then Hosh wasn't down any earlier than Koto was. I think they should've rematched.

Edited September 19, 2023 by Katooshu

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

This blew up way too much. A day earlier Kotoeko clearly got robbed against Shonannoumi (not even a monoii!), but it was barely noticed. On the other hand, there is a clear explanation of gyoji/shimpan decision to award the victory to Kotonowaka, yet we are still arguing about it. 

[Katooshu 3,132]

To me it's an interesting situation, because if the bales actually are considered a safe space a rikishi can touch with any part of their body and not be considered down, then I've learned something new. If they aren't, then I think it should've been a rematch, as the top of Koto's foot dragged on the tawara no later than Hosh's did on the clay. It's hardly the worst call ever but it's worth discussing....and what better place to do it than here. 

Edited September 19, 2023 by Katooshu

[Yarimotsu 522]

3 hours ago, Benihana said:

Some people on twitter think that Shishi's sumo is dangerous. His fall from the dohyo today was a result of bad ring sense, not complete exhaustion. I wonder what they call Takakeisho's flying headbutts...

I would agree with those commentators that Shishi's sumo is abnormally dangerous - to himself. So many oblique and twisting steps to recover while under full strain. If he makes it through the next couple years with an intact lower back and knees you could call it a miracle. Not to say that Onosho and Takakeisho's sumo is any less dangerous.

[Yamanashi 3,723]

59 minutes ago, Yarimotsu said:

Not to say that Onosho and Takakeisho's sumo is any less dangerous

Onosho has picked up some new techniques over the last couple of basho.  He is already somewhat fragile and has a very large amplitude swing in rank over six or eight tournaments.  He was one of those "Komosubi wonders"  who move through Maegashira quickly until everybody figures out their trick.

[Seiyashi 4,071]

Been quiet here because of work but things unexpectedly cleared up, so I'm back. Will put up the customary PDY thread after today's bouts. 

[Jakusotsu 5,806]

6 hours ago, Benihana said:

Some people on twitter think that Shishi's sumo is dangerous. His fall from the dohyo today was a result of bad ring sense, not complete exhaustion.

I always thought his dives to be just as awkward as Kotooshu's.

[dingo 1,159]

3 hours ago, Katooshu said:

To me it's an interesting situation, because if the bales actually are considered a safe space a rikishi can touch with any part of their body and not be considered down, then I've learned something new. If they aren't, then I think it should've been a rematch, as the top of Koto's foot dragged on the tawara no later than Hosh's did on the clay. It's hardly the worst call ever but it's worth discussing....and what better place to do it than here. 

I think it's pretty common knowledge and one of the basic rules of sumo that you can't touch anything with any part of the body except the footsoles. And footsoles are allowed only inside the ring. Bales are counted as part of the ring until the footsole touches the ground outside the bales. Now whether that was interpreted correctly for this bout is another question. But there's been plenty of other questionable judgements and the result won't change anyway so it is what it is. 

Edited September 19, 2023 by dingo

[hakutorizakura 590]

5 hours ago, Godango said:

As usual, you just wish there'd be greater consistency. But hey, it keeps us coming back for more!

Fully agree to this. The lack of consistency (or predominance of subjectivity) and the absence of shinpan's declaration of conflict of interest are factors that make sumo interesting. And will never make it an olympic sport 

[rhyen 1,808]

I guess Chiyomaru just learned how to lean into an opponent today.

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

Kiho is falling apart.

[Bunbukuchagama 688]

Shishi escapes again and crushes Tenshoho!