Akinomaki

Kyushu 2023 discussion (results)

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Kirishima now has the most wins of the year award guaranteed, with 61 so far, a rare high number these days. He might have to share it with Daieisho if he loses the last bout and Daieisho wins his. o

The award ceremony is after the usual trophy parade for the yusho winner

Edited by Akinomaki
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The reason why Shimanoumi suddenly performs well - the 3rd kachikoshi in 2 years this time: his first child, a daughter was born on the 2nd: "Another responsibility that powered me up." o

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All days the man-in onrei banners down, 6 days sold out (6980 spectators). Sanspo publishes the numbers again, but one has to search for them: hidden in one of the about 10 articles published around 21h JST of the respective day. In the past it was in all articles published just after 5h JST the next day.

d1 6564
d2 5592
d3 5590
d4 5593
d5 5594
d6 6068
d7 6980
d8 6980
d9 6216
d10 6248
d11 6659
d12 6980
d13 6980
d14 6980
d15 6980
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4 hours ago, Gurowake said:

This is where your opinion differs from the Kyokai's.  While this idea works when you *know* you'll have to break up intrasanyaku matches for non-joi maegashira yusho contenders, it fails in terms of putting the important matches last when top ranked rikishi are the ones in the Yusho race instead.  It also requires that exact opinion, which is not one that makes a ton of sense.  Why should those matches be more important?  In reality, those matches tend to be the least important unless they're between 2 people in the Yusho race, as they tend to have the least implications for banzuke movement, and banzuke movement is the main reason the tournament exists in the first place from a historical perspective. 

In the second case where you say this idea fails, I'd say that depends on the expectations. If the top ranked rikishi are in the yusho race, then having faced each other earlier in the basho might take some excitement from the last days but at least makes sure they've met in a bout. 

Why should intra-ozeki matches be more important? Because generally ozeki are high level rikishi whose skills should be tested against each other. Intra-ozeki matches are exciting and usually figure into a successful yusho. In my opinion that's especially true these days when we only have 3 ozeki and a yokozuna who's kyujo more often than not. 

I mean, would anyone be happy if a yusho winning sanyaku gets to skip a yokozuna bout? Since we are missing the yokozuna, ozeki matchups are even more important. 

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Onosato will be joint 3rd fastest to makuuchi since the start of Showa with 4 basho, Endo and Hakuoho are top with 3. o

16 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

All days the man-in onrei banners down

The first time all 6 basho of the year (6 since 1958) had all days the full house banners down was 1990, with the Waka-Taka boom o

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9 hours ago, Octofuji said:

I'm very happy to see Takarafuji secure another basho in Makuuchi. With very neat sumo too, starting by getting his favourite grip and blocking Endo's mae-mitsu for a while - then when Endo did get his grip Takarafuji immediately countered with an uwatedashinage his opponent would have been proud of.

I had to rerun that match again.  How far has Endo fallen: getting collapsed by Takarafuji?

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6 minutes ago, dingo said:

I mean, would anyone be happy if a yusho winning sanyaku gets to skip a yokozuna bout?

Would only happen if the yokozuna isn't genki, and then there's no reason to complain.

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10 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

"No regrets" - same Raou comment as Kisenosato, who had a Rao kesho mawashi

b_17065145.jpgo b_17065146.jpgo b_17065147.jpgo

Is it me or there have been a lot of retirements at Tatsunami recently?
First the two stick brothers, then Rao...

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In the end, it all comes down to that Hoshoryu-Atamifuji match. If Hoshoryu had won, he would have stayed in the yusho race and almost certainly been given the opportunity to put a third loss on Kirishima during the final two days. Didn't happen, so Atamifuji essentially took his spot in everything. Yeah, unfortunate that it means we've missed out on Kirishima-Hoshoryu this basho, but this is a rare case of: Don't hate the game, hate the player.


Edit: To go for a slightly forced analogy in sports with a different format: You're looking forward to the #1 and #2 seeds meeting in the tournament final, but one of them gets upset by a lower-ranked player on the way. Are you going to complain that the seeding procedure made it impossible for them to meet in an earlier round, where they wouldn't have needed to win so many other matches first?

Edited by Asashosakari
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10 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:
9 hours ago, Octofuji said:

I'm very happy to see Takarafuji secure another basho in Makuuchi. With very neat sumo too, starting by getting his favourite grip and blocking Endo's mae-mitsu for a while - then when Endo did get his grip Takarafuji immediately countered with an uwatedashinage his opponent would have been proud of.

I had to rerun that match again.  How far has Endo fallen: getting collapsed by Takarafuji?

They have both slipped quite a bit, but they have always been pretty evenly matched. And Takarafuji is the one who made sekiwake.

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1 hour ago, Asashosakari said:

True, it's less clear-cut than it would have been with most mid-maegashira who are performing well, but let's not overemphasize the lessons that maybe could have been learned from Aki basho. After going 8-1 against the dregs of the division, Atamifuji went on to: beat Takayasu, beat Tobizaru, lose to Daieisho, lose to Takakeisho, beat Abi, lose to Asanoyama. Considering he lost to Sadanoumi and Hiradoumi this time around - not exactly who you'd tab as major hurdles for a yusho-contending rikishi - which meant a significantly worse position going into the late tournament than he had back in September (one more loss, combined with much better-performing high rankers), I think it was perfectly valid to assume that he's unlikely to figure into the yusho decision a second time and all they'd need to do is put a couple of stoppers in his way. Works out the vast majority of the time, didn't work out here.

I agree.   It takes some real clairvoyance to look at Atamifuji after day 8 (6-2 with losses to Sadanoumi and Hiradoumi) and think "we'd better get this kid up against an Ozeki right now!"

Hindsight is 20-20.

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3 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

They have both slipped quite a bit, but they have always been pretty evenly matched. And Takarafuji is the one who made sekiwake.

Sorry, I don't mean career high ranks; I mean that Endo has always been described as "the technician" who often gets inside and collapses his opponent to their knees. He's looked a step slow (maybe injured) for awhile now.

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10 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

Edit: Oh, and they've flipped the order of the Wakamotoharu and Kotonowaka matches from what it would normally be, moving the more interesting bout to third-last.

Nice, I wasn't sure that was within their discretion.

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1 hour ago, Akinomaki said:

The reason why Shimanoumi suddenly performs well - the 3rd kachikoshi in 2 years this time: his first child, a daughter was born on the 2nd: "Another responsibility that powered me up." o

Credit where it's due, Shimanoumi is indeed producing the best sumo he's done in years. Now THIS guy being a sekitori, I have no issues with.

‐---------

Tsk tsk, that dameoshi.

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15 minutes ago, Reonito said:

Nice, I wasn't sure that was within their discretion.

It has happened a few times relatively recently, Haru basho this year and Hatsu 2019 are what comes to mind. Although those cases involved shuffling an important match into the musubi no ichiban, so tomorrow's schedule where it's done for slot #3 is still something different in a way.

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1 hour ago, Koorifuu said:

Credit where it's due, Shimanoumi is indeed producing the best sumo he's done in years. Now THIS guy being a sekitori, I have no issues with.

This is the guy I'm missing the most.

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3 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Never thought I would say this but I think Tsurugisho deserves a prize this basho. 

I'd give him the silly bugger prize for that tsuri attempt today. Just what his knackered knee needed.

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4 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Never thought I would say this but I think Tsurugisho deserves a prize this basho. He looked completely shot after five days but he has turned it around with some technically superb sumo. I have always tended to view him as a second-rater most notable for his "agony of defeat" facial expressions but he has produced career best efforts over the last week.

I thought he deserved a prize back in May as well. He won six in a row to go from 3-3 to 9-3 and was looking very good, although he only finished 9-6 in the end. 

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2 hours ago, RabidJohn said:

I'd give him the silly bugger prize for that tsuri attempt today. Just what his knackered knee needed.

In fairness, he did the same thing to Hokuseiho (I think) and it went fine. For someone in his position, with the knee as battered as it seemed to be early and the power he's able to produce, it's not illogical to think that the stress of a big lift will be less of an issue than grinding out a fight.

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2 hours ago, ryafuji said:

I thought he deserved a prize back in May as well. He won six in a row to go from 3-3 to 9-3 and was looking very good, although he only finished 9-6 in the end. 

Poor Tsurugisho was robbed of a sansho back in May when they put him against the Sanyaku much longer than necessary.

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35 minutes ago, Yokozuna Hattorizakura said:

Poor Tsurugisho was robbed of a sansho back in May when they put him against the Sanyaku much longer than necessary.

By contrast, look at IYM - he is clearly getting handled with velvet gloves. A single sanyaku opponent for someone with a possible 11-4 record?! (Laughing...)

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Sansho announced.

  • Shukun-shō (殊勲賞): Atamifuji (if he yushos today)
  • Kantō-shō (敢闘賞): Atamifuji; Kotonowaka, Ichiyamamoto (if the latter two win today)
  • Ginō-shō (技能賞): none

 

Edited by Kaninoyama
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44 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Sansho announced.

  • Shukun-shō (殊勲賞): Atamifuji (if he wins today)
  • Kantō-shō (敢闘賞): Atamifuji; Kotonowaka, Ichiyamamoto (if the latter two win today)
  • Ginō-shō (技能賞): none

https://x.com/NhkSumo/status/1728628633533596117?s=20

(How do I get this Tweet to embed?)

Slight correction - shukunsho for Atamifuji if he gets the yusho. 

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49 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Sansho announced.

  • Shukun-shō (殊勲賞): Atamifuji (if he wins today)
  • Kantō-shō (敢闘賞): Atamifuji; Kotonowaka, Ichiyamamoto (if the latter two win today)
  • Ginō-shō (技能賞): none

https://x.com/NhkSumo/status/1728628633533596117?s=20

(How do I get this Tweet to embed?)

Think the embed only recognises the old twitter.com.

E.g. 

 

Edited by Seiyashi

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