Teppo

[Kaikitsune Makoto 206]

Teppo is a quite common male name in Finland but it is also the wooden pole that rikishi keep pummeling with their palms, rhytmically sliding their legs in the process. Teppo is the traditional way to train pushing power mainly affecting the pecs (maybe..), frontal shoulders and triceps.

Now is the wooden pole very rigid or does it give away when one hits it hard? Must be inflexible to some degree as nobody hits a concrete wall to get some benefit!? I tried some teppo with a special adjustment; 35kg boxing bag which is quite hard, started hitting it quite low (like rikishi hit teppo) so that the bag moved reasonably lot (the rope is quite limited so when hitting or pushing the bag, it raises higher almost immediately in its tight circular tangent), then when the bag reached its peak and started falling towards me again with the help of gravity, I did the 2nd teppo hit. Now the hit here is a part hit and part push. trying to mimmick the natural way rikishi use the teppo pole (they hit it but not with full power and probably continue the move with a strong push?). The impact is the hit but the biggest horse power comes right after the hit when the bag is repelled back again with a strong push-follow-up to the hit! I did this for some 20-30minutes with little breaks (to rest wrists mostly...tough for wrists) and it does have quite a decent affect on triceps and shoulders especially when the intensity has an upward curve. The last 2-3 minutes I punch-pushed it with all I got and even added the leg move fully. I have no idea if teppo pole has at all similar feel as it doesn't move and you don't have to stop it at impact (like one has to stop a falling 35kg bag). The possible hard "push" is also static if the teppo pole doesn't give in at all. Still teppo is another bread and butter move so it must have some good results too!

Any opinions from the guys who have actually trained with real teppo pole and not invented own mimmicking "teppos" for personal research?? How does teppo feel? What is the main target area? Or is it just a warm-up move or palm roughening move in reality?

What is the secret of teppo?

[Sasanishiki 57]

Well, I know one of the advantages with the boxing bag is thatt you can actually practice your tachiai and have your hands and head hit at the same time (sort of like an attaching triangular weapon of head and hands). You can then use the arms as it swings back like you said. The use of the head against the teppo is not recommended (Applauding...)

As the teppo at most heya and other facilities (universities, public gymnasiums, etc) is a big tree trunk, there is a reasonable solidity about it. That said, it is only anchored in the ground at the bottom and so has some give in it I am sure. I vaguely remember hearing (perhaps someone's post?) about Musashimaru (?) giving the teppo a pummeling and it could be heard from miles around and was shaking the whole thing.

[Mark Buckton 1]

No give in the one I've used. - ouch (Applauding...)

[Kagamifuji Iumu 1]

I used to do teppo A LOT wheni was with Kagamiyama beya. The pole is very hard and very rigid. Very little give, if any at all. And you ARE supposed to hit your head, just as Shiroikuma said it helps to get rid of the mental block of beating your head. I was scared to go in with my head at first so used a shoulder and chest tachi-ai. I would advise not to used a punching bag, unless your are doing it for fun. because it is soft and gives a lot. Yes it hurts your wrists, but tough it out. It does work your pecs, shoulder and triceps very well. You cant just slap the pole, you, as you guys have said, must folow through and push off.

[Datchayama 0]

I was going to add that wasn't it also that in Miyabiyama's case (as well as some others but Miya's more noticable) that he did a whole lot more teppo using his shoulder area? That's what generated his (so nicknamed) "Mini-mi"... the more noticable bulge or butsukari-dako on his shoulder. This caused him a bit of a problem in 2001 and had surgery for it. It caused pressures and shoulder blade deformation and they had to deal with some loose cartilage problems.

Enough teppo work though and you'll build up tougher skin, and thicker bone mass in impact spots,etc to become very durable normally.

I believe comments elsewhere in the mailing list in the past (wish the searcher worked...) mentioned that a lot of rikishi get something like this (those "Mini-me's") just usually not to the extreme Miyabiyama got...

Edited October 28, 2004 by Datchayama

[Fujisan 532]

I hear Musoyama is 8-3 against the Teppo in his pre-basho keiko! :-)

[Kaikitsune Makoto 206]

Thanks for the interesting teppo-comments! Too bad younger rikishi are most often the ones who don't have any thick hair to act as shock absorber the impact and yet they have to do that head butting to teppo-pole...

but with the competition on sunday i am following kaio's lead and training like a madman. also i kaio i wil probably go down in flames

No flames! Seize the victory. Use Irish rugby speed and finish them with okurinage! Ganbatte ne

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

Actually, thick hair as a shock absorber is a myth. There's nothing real to it.

When you do buchikamasu, you're supposed to hit with your forehead, you don't have any hair there, no matter how thick.

Lotta times rikishi do lose hair because it gets rubbed out since they hit the top of their head on the teppou pole a lot, but that's only from incorrect technique, not that it's supposed to absorb any shocks or so... (Clapping wildly...)

A lot of the guest commentators on NHK's English Ozumo broadcast claim that one purpose of the chonmage is to help prevent injury (they are rarely more specific than that :-/ ). It seems a bit suspect...merely a traditional hairstyle that has been preserved (In a state of confusion...)

I understand from Japanese friends that the hairstyle of both samurai and sumotori changed over the centuries...anyone know?

[Asashosakari 18,968]

A lot of the guest commentators on NHK's English Ozumo broadcast claim that one purpose of the chonmage is to help prevent injury (they are rarely more specific than that (In a state of confusion...) ).

The protective function they're talking about seems to be more in regards to the ordinary drops and falls experienced at the end of a sumo bout (when you may not be hitting your head hard, but in a very uncontrolled fashion), not the hard, direct impact you have on a teppo pole. Now, whether or not that's true is a different matter.

Edited October 29, 2004 by Asashosakari

[Fujisan 532]

When I was at school I used to headbutt walls(You would never guss from my photo and no they aren't bumps on my head) to prove how hard my head was so I guess Teppo wouldn't be much trouble for me.

Edited October 29, 2004 by Fujisan

[Jakusotsu 5,874]

...to prove how hard my head was...

I don't think toughness of bones is an issue here, it's those soft things inside that turn to jelly.

I faintly remember a medical study about football (soccer) players. Those who didn't do much headers in their career did significantly better at IQ checks than their bump-happy comrades.

I only suffered two minor concussions in my life, but judging by that experience, this severe head-knocking stuff can't be healthy at all.

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

The ooichomage evolved from a samurai hairstyle and it's tradition. Why should it be suspect?

Thanks a lot for the clarification!

I don't think the hairstyle is suspect, I rather quite like it...just the statement that a mage is a shock-absorber is suspect to me! You, Nishinoshima, and perhaps a host of others agree (Clapping wildly...)

Whaddaya know! Sumo "experts" DO agree (In a state of confusion...)

[Fujisan 532]

All the knocks I have taken over the years you would think I'd be a nutcase by now-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------"What do you mean,YOU DO THINK I'M A NUTCASE?" (Clapping wildly...) (In a state of confusion...)

[Manekineko 200]

Re: Brains and head-butting

I heard somewhere that every time you gently whack your forehead with your hand, you kill 7 brain cells... I imagine the slaughter is greater when you whack it full strength into teppo/wall/another head. As, unlike other cells, nerves don't regenerate, your brain has less and less "working" matter the more you whack your head...

That wouldn't make you a nucase, BTW, simply a bit dull/slow... and more prone to forgetting things, having trouble finding a right word, that sort of thing.

Mind you, I cannot name a source, and my grasp of medicine and biology is verry superficial (although I notice that women in general seem to have a better understanding of how human bodies work than men in general).

[Jakusotsu 5,874]

All the understanding I have shown of human bodies you would think I'd be a woman by now-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------"What do you mean,YOU DO THINK I'M A WOMAN?" (Clapping wildly...) (In a state of confusion...)

[Yoavoshimaru 0]

Has anyone ever broken a teppo pole in training? Maybe Musahismaru or Chiyonofuji?

[Mark Buckton 1]

Has anyone ever broken a teppo pole in training? Maybe Musahismaru or Chiyonofuji?

To give a hint as to how long they can last - the one in Tokitsukaze (is it?) - was formerly used by Futabayama IIRC.

Go out, start whacking a tree about 45cm across and see if it snaps. (In a state of confusion...)

[Mark Buckton 1]

(although I notice that women in general seem to have a better understanding of how human bodies work than men in general).

Based on?

Seems strange to when you consider that more medical professionals at the level of doctor are men are they not? Of course I have seen women but the numbers pale in comparison to men.

A feminist streak in our cat woman coming out neko-chan? (Clapping wildly...) (In a state of confusion...)

[Kaikitsune Makoto 206]

Well professional hard contact sports rarely promotes good brain health. I wonder what is the rate of concussions in sumo and whether there are many "Eric Lindroses" whose brains have suffered many bad concussions. Chiyotaikai had vision blurring and headaches at some point due to his hard head first bumping sumo. I remember one bout in particular where Taikai hit Kotoryu's iron skull with his own skull and looked disoriented and lost the bout easily.

It is funny that many sumo books mention that when Meiji-restauration occurred in Japan and westernization took place banning many traditional Japanese things, mage was also banned but rikishi were given special permission because of that shock absorber aspect! (Applauding...) Maybe sumopeople were cleverly inventing this myth then needing a practical excuse to maintain their traditional mage style and the story of shock absorbing role of the mage lived ever since!

Seems strange to when you consider that more medical professionals at the level of doctor are men are they not? Of course I have seen women but the numbers pale in comparison to men.

This is changing in many countries. In Finland the gender distribution of new med school students is about 65-35 in favour of the women. I don't know whether in average women have more interest and knowledge over the bodily functions but in both gender groups there are many who have zero interest and who are extremely squeamish about anything related to inner organs or blood (Blinking...)

Women have an advantage because they manufacture featuses and during the pregnancies often learn about bodily functions in order to promote health and happiness.

[Sasanishiki 57]

It's a well-known fact that rikishi were the only class allowed to keep the mage.

... but I imagined it was since it was a professional thing. In a sense it was a warriors' hair style and rikishi "needed" it for their profession, because it was traditionally a part of what they do.

Anyone know anything serious on this, why was really the ban not laid on rikishi?

OK from what I know...

The hirstyle for samurai denoted their class n society, as their was a legal distinction in society between the classes and actions they could and could not do etc...

Rikishi were allowed to wear the mage, as were kabuki actors (I think). These also denoted profession, but they had other markers I suspect so that you didn't get them confused with samurai. Some rikishi were given samurai status as they were employed by feudal lords as their own troupe of wrestlers to pit against others.

When the feudal system was abolished and samurai had no status anymore they were required to cut their hair. Sumo and kabuki were allowed to retain their hairstyles because it wa seen as part of the whole performance/costume. That said, these two pursuits were both seen as being feudal, archaic and lost some popularity at this time (1860s, 70s, 80s or thereabouts). I'm not sure why, but the kabuki actors decided to stop wearing their hair in the mage style. Rikishi retained it.

Sumo started gaining popularity after japan began to handle this idea of their tradition being able to sit with modernisation. That is, once they zeal of tossing out everything Japanese in favour of everything modern subsided after the 1850s-1870s. Gradually also sumo began to be incorporated in a positive way into the shaping of the body into an athletic tool of the nation. Sumo was a way to train the body, and strong bodies were positive for a militarised Japan, so sumo gained some support and favour once again because it fitted into nationalistic goals to be a strong country, rather than being seen as a feudal throwback at the time Japan was trying to move forward.

[Manekineko 200]

(although I notice that women in general seem to have a better understanding of how human bodies work than men in general).

Based on?

Sorry iz took me so long to answer, but monday was a holiday here, and I have no access to Internet outside of work these days...

Based on my personal experience with men, mostly in my family... They are *afraid* of going to doctors, they would rather suffer in silence and ignore the problem, hoping it will go away "by itself". Which, of course, never happens. Yes, I do believe women are more aware of their inner workings because of all that baby-making equipment, and the leaks it develops once a month if you aren't using it to produce babies... Damn nuisance, that one. (Blinking...)

Men that actively train in sports are also probably more avare of their bodies than women in general. But that's why I said "women in general" vs "men in general".

And in Croatia at least, while men are dominating in surgery, women are more often seen in general practice and similar medical fields that do not require much scalpel use.

And, of course I'm moderately feminist. Just as I am moderately nationalist, moderately liberal and moderately catholic. :-D

[Sasanishiki 57]

thats me 100%. my economy class syndrome hasn't disappeared yet so i will (read 10% chance) go to a doctor tomorrow.

WIll any in fact be open? It is a public holiday, or is that your excuse for not being seen by anyone? "Well I went all that way, and they weren't even open..."

Anyway, for those not in the know, Nishi (especially his bladder) has the constituion of an ox.

[Xris 2]

men...............are *afraid* of going to doctors, they would rather suffer in silence and ignore the problem, hoping it will go away "by itself". Which, of course, never happens.

(Laughing...)

thats me 100%. my economy class syndrome hasn't disappeared yet so i will (read 10% chance) go to a doctor tomorrow.

that's me 100% too, but ... usually it works. You know, there are in-built natural defenses in the organism that deal perfectly well with viruses, sprains, etc. It's not a myth! :-D ... Of course, up to a certain level! but when you are able to complain, you are not in too bad shape :-D