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Asashosakari

Banzuke for Nagoya 2022

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The Makushita-joi is stuffed with college grads, old veterans and foreigners.  What an exciting mix.

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Jakusotsu said:

Do you really think that was relevant in any way? My GTB draft had exactly the same order of lowest Maegashira without wasting any thought about supension shenanigans.

I checked as much as I could in the database to see if Ryuden's promotion case / future placement was mathematically comparable to Daiamami and Nishikifuji, also checking the same scenario multiple ranks higher or lower to see if the rank differential was consistent. It became apparent that Ryuden's promotion case was slightly weaker than Daiamami's and slightly stronger than Nishikifuji's. Still, I wasn't too surprised when we heard Nishikifuji would go up because that kept him as a pair with Daiamami, something they seem to care about in certain circumstances.

Edited by Yarimotsu

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6 hours ago, Yarimotsu said:

I checked as much as I could in the database to see if Ryuden's promotion case / future placement was mathematically comparable to Daiamami and Nishikifuji, also checking the same scenario multiple ranks higher or lower to see if the rank differential was consistent. It became apparent that Ryuden's promotion case was slightly weaker than Daiamami's and slightly stronger than Nishikifuji's. Still, I wasn't too surprised when we heard Nishikifuji would go up because that kept him as a pair with Daiamami, something they seem to care about in certain circumstances.

Using this modified query (by courtesy of @Asashosakari) yields exactly one precendence of the Ryuden/Nishikifuji case in 1974.05, and with the same outcome.

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1 hour ago, Jakusotsu said:

Using this modified query (by courtesy of @Asashosakari) yields exactly one precendence of the Ryuden/Nishikifuji case in 1974.05, and with the same outcome.

Yeah, I expanded to other notably similar cases due to that lack of relevant precedence and concluded it was basically a coinflip that would probably land in the J3w's favour in a vacuum, but could go either way in reality. My notes are garbage though: "daiamami and nishikifuji over ryuden has old precedent only. same scenario shoved +1 rung shows mixed results for W and clean sheet for E - potential split? +2 rungs: nearly clean E, 2:3 lost W. -2 rungs: 2:1 for W, clean E."

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Posted (edited)
On 27/06/2022 at 10:35, fwuzzle23 said:

Asanoyama Hiroki is his full shikona as of this banzuke. Only the given name changed, his surname is still Asanoyama.

No idea whether he changes back to Hideki, because Hideki was chosen to honor his deceased high school coach, and it could be he feels like he dishonored the name by getting involved in the scandal.

Hochi hints that he changed back to his real first name to show his feelings for his family. During the suspension, his grandfather died last year in June and his father in August. https://hochi.news/articles/20220627-OHT1T51173.html

Edited by Akinomaki
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57 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

Hochi hints that he changed back to his real first name to show his feelings for his family. During the suspension, his grandfather died last year in June and his father in August. https://hochi.news/articles/20220627-OHT1T51173.html

Ouch. That is one hell of a trauma conga line. That said, if he's truly resolved to show it in his sumo, I wouldn't want to be anyone between him and makuuchi, and that might actually add the vicious edge to his sumo that he needs to become yokozuna.

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9 hours ago, Yarimotsu said:

Yeah, I expanded to other notably similar cases due to that lack of relevant precedence and concluded it was basically a coinflip that would probably land in the J3w's favour in a vacuum, but could go either way in reality. My notes are garbage though: "daiamami and nishikifuji over ryuden has old precedent only. same scenario shoved +1 rung shows mixed results for W and clean sheet for E - potential split? +2 rungs: nearly clean E, 2:3 lost W. -2 rungs: 2:1 for W, clean E."

I can actually read that, having gone through a similar exercise (Laughing...)

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On 26/06/2022 at 19:45, Reonito said:

OMG! A J1e 8-7 getting demoted is not something I expected to see.

There was promotion after a makekoshi though. 

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Another note ragarding Asahikuni is that he sat out the following tournament with an injury.

No doubt that influenced them

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On 26/06/2022 at 14:39, Asashosakari said:

Hands up, who saw Hidenoumi getting stuck at J1w coming?

I still feel worse for Shiden though.

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Posted (edited)

At least he can always say now that he was a sekitori....hopefully he's just not asked how that went for him.

Edited by Katooshu

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On 02/07/2022 at 01:29, Katooshu said:

At least he can always say now that he was a sekitori....hopefully he's just not asked how that went for him.

I feel like a 0-0-15 is easier to explain then Asashiyu's 2-13 or Oki's 0-15. 

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6 minutes ago, Chartorenji said:

I feel like a 0-0-15 is easier to explain then Asashiyu's 2-13 or Oki's 0-15. 

"So ... what injury caused you to go 0-0-15?"

"Umm..."

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I am looking at some banzukes in the sumo database and sometimes the ranking has an "HD" after it e.g. "O2eHD". What does the HD mean? 

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30 minutes ago, nelimw said:

I am looking at some banzukes in the sumo database and sometimes the ranking has an "HD" after it e.g. "O2eHD". What does the HD mean? 

Haridashi (張り出し)
'Overhang'. If there are more than two wrestlers at any san'yaku rank, the additional wrestlers are termed haridashi. Prior to 1995, such wrestlers were listed on the banzuke in extensions or "overhangs" to the row for makuuchi wrestlers. This is now an informal designation, since presently all wrestlers are listed within the normal bounds of the row.
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Haridashi has appeared in a number of ways historically.

Apart from Haridashi-Yokozuna, Haridashi-Ozeki, Haridashi-Sekiwake, Haridashi-Komusubi

it has also appeared at various levels of -Maegashira including just being tacked on the bottom of the listsuch as Haru 1853.

Its surprising how many different levels you can find

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While HD is technically an obsolete term, it still pops up a lot when talking about S/K2s, since those are rare on normal banzukes. Also technically applicable to Y/O2+, although much less frequently used in that context.

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4 hours ago, SDM said:

Haridashi has appeared in a number of ways historically.

Apart from Haridashi-Yokozuna, Haridashi-Ozeki, Haridashi-Sekiwake, Haridashi-Komusubi

it has also appeared at various levels of -Maegashira including just being tacked on the bottom of the listsuch as Haru 1853.

Its surprising how many different levels you can find

Well yeah, because it has nothing to do with any ranks as such and just describes the style of placement. Even divisions below juryo had haridashi-listed rikishi in the 1970s/80s when that was how kosho cases were handled.

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yes its not a rank in itself its just like an extra and called that way because of placement on the Banzuke

Interesting is the 40s reference to the same idea as Outside-M

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On 06/07/2022 at 12:08, code_number3 said:
Haridashi (張り出し)
'Overhang'. If there are more than two wrestlers at any san'yaku rank, the additional wrestlers are termed haridashi. Prior to 1995, such wrestlers were listed on the banzuke in extensions or "overhangs" to the row for makuuchi wrestlers. This is now an informal designation, since presently all wrestlers are listed within the normal bounds of the row.

A wonderful example of those terms that seem so mysterious until you find that they are actually a simple description: "overhang".

Tourists in Rome will tell their tour guides they want to see the church San Paolo fuori le Mura. Q: "What's the meaning of that phrase?" A: "Uh, it's outside the city walls."

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On 27/06/2022 at 00:08, Yubinhaad said:

Tamanoi-beya debutant Imazeki is now Toshunryu, the middle kanji there is taken from his real given name, Shunsuke.

Jk17e Imazeki > Toshunryu (東俊隆, とうしゅんりゅう)

The -ryu is from the first name of Toshunryu's grandfather, 隆一, he proposed the shikona himself - including something not verified for the first name:

Sponichi reported his full shikona as 東俊隆 勝介, real first name changed to Shosuke 勝介, with the Sho from the first name of his father 勝彦, the article was empty for while and is back now - the DB gives Shunsuke as the the first name. 

The NSK for him as for many lower ranked rikishi doesn't list the first name of the shikona, presumably those who use their real first name - many have that same first name listed in the shikona as well though.

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