Nagoya 2022

[rhyen 1,833]

@Akinomaki

better keep an eye out for the cartoon on yaku mitsuru (nikkansports page) tomorrow, 

https://www.nikkansports.com/yaku-mitsuru/

[Yamanashi 3,820]

5 hours ago, Oshirokita said:

And Oshoumi...

? 5-3-7?

[Sumo Spiffy 550]

Just finished watching a recording, and before I go back and read other people's comments: I would like Shodai a lot more if that was how he fought all the time. That was a very impressive show of resolve.

[Akinomaki 40,271]

3 hours ago, Johnofuji said:

Article 27 :
When a mawashi becomes loose during a bout, the gyoji shall call out "Matta!" (Wait!) to halt the bout temporarily. Both competitors must freeze in their positions (kumite) until the bout is restarted.
The gyoji shall not order the temporary halt of a bout during offensive moves of competitors.

The NSK regulations under the section "Gyoji" state in article 15: During the contest, if the shimekomi of a rikishi is stretched till the breast, in a situation where it is easy to stop (the bout), the gyoji can halt the movements and re-tighten it.

競技中に、力士の締め込みが胸まで伸びて、止めやすい状態の場合は、行司が動きを止めて、締め直させることができる

The point is: easy to stop - and it is not obligatory for the gyoji to do it, it is a precautionary action. It didn't look like the mawashi (shimekomi) of Wakamotoharu was about to come undone.

[Jakusotsu 5,905]

43 minutes ago, Sumo Spiffy said:

I would like Shodai a lot more if that was how he fought all the time. That was a very impressive show of resolve.

Looked more like a veeeery careful Tamawashi to me...

[Akinomaki 40,271]

5 hours ago, Chartorenji said:

That sword probably seems like a better option than the talking down to he is getting right now. 

Especially since he came running with sword in hand (as the Japanese saying is, おっとり刀で sanspo - actually he still only had the gunbai in his hand) to make the mawashi matta call.

o

It took 7:40min. to restart the bout after the yokozuna stepped out and then it was over in 9s.

[Leo C 52]

I felt a little sorry for Wakamotoharu, even if we ignore the false finish, he was doing great against the Yokozuna and having to restart (from the same position or not) may have cost him the victory. Very exciting nonetheless.

Another loss for Ichinojo and now we're back to half the guys in the lead together... I don't mind this as I enjoy the chaos but it would be nice to have a different narrative from last time.

[junsan 175]

3 hours ago, RabidJohn said:

Unusually I feel for Inosuke here. 

Every time I've seen a bout stopped for this reason, the gyoji usually slapped both rikishi on the shoulder as well as shouting 'Matta'. Inosuke raised his hands, looking like he was about to do this, and I believe Terunofuji anticipated the call - after all, he'd have felt the mawashi come undone. Wakamotoharu, however, had his back to the gyoji and was on a mission, instantly taking advantage before Inosuke could stop him.

That's when it all went wrong. Inosuke should have just retied the mawashi, repositioned them and restarted the bout. Instead he looked kind of helplessly at Sadogatake...

Best take thus far.

[Gurowake 4,034]

I have a pretty strong feeling after looking at the Japan covid data that the tournament is going to be cancelled in the next couple days, no Yusho or sansho will be awarded, and the next banzuke will be made based on results so far.  I can't imagine that it's not going to spread further than it has.

[Seiyashi 4,074]

8 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

and the next banzuke will be made based on results so far. 

Is mulliganing the basho not an option at all? 

[Gurowake 4,034]

Just now, Seiyashi said:

Is mulliganing the basho not an option at all? 

It's an option, sure.  I don't think it's fair to people that had winning records though. 

[Bakayokozuna 52]

That would be a crazy hard banzuke to make! Freezing the banzuke is the easier option but yeah, what about a guy like Kinbozan for instance? who almost officialy got his promotion as we speak. Tough decision here

We will see if we get there but yeah, more heya could be out soon sadly

Edited July 17, 2022 by Bakayokozuna

[Reonito 1,408]

12 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

I believe hint, thy name is Terunofuji.

Oh, I doubt very much it'll ever come to that.

[Hankegami 491]

13 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

I have a pretty strong feeling after looking at the Japan covid data that the tournament is going to be cancelled in the next couple days, no Yusho or sansho will be awarded, and the next banzuke will be made based on results so far.  I can't imagine that it's not going to spread further than it has.

5 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Is mulliganing the basho not an option at all? 

2 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

It's an option, sure.  I don't think it's fair to people that had winning records though. 

By "mulliganing", do you mean pretend that Nagoya 2022 never occurred and pass directly to Aki? Was this the case, I agree with Gurowake it would be excessive. We are already on Day 8 and the tournament will likely go at least to Day 9. They could even treat it like a 10-day basho and give the usual awards anyway. Even the yusho in the unlikely event we will get a sole front runner on the last day (highly unlikely). Whelp, if they decide to end the basho beforehand (that is, while the last day is still going), they could even prepare a yusho playoff before closing for good.

I know it may sound a somewhat "absurd prediction" guess, but it could solve many things. Promotions and demotions, as already put up. Ozeki runs (Wakatakakage) and if they want to be nasty even demotions (Mitakeumi). Both fans and rikishi would have had the impression they spent their time for something.

[Rocks 1,808]

It wasn't wrong to stop it and Wakamataharu  didn't make that big move until Terunofuji stood up in reaction to the stop. The only dumb thing was the sheepishness of the gyoji afterwards. 

28 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

I have a pretty strong feeling after looking at the Japan covid data that the tournament is going to be cancelled in the next couple days, no Yusho or sansho will be awarded, and the next banzuke will be made based on results so far.  I can't imagine that it's not going to spread further than it has.

If they stop it I think they would not make a new banzuke for Aki. Unfair to guys with winning records but demotions based on  partial records is more unfair I would think. 

[Akinomaki 40,271]

The work of Inosuke to retie the mawashi of Wakamotoharu was done by Shodai

o

[Bakayokozuna 52]

4 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

The work of Inosuke to retie the mawashi of Wakamotoharu was done by Shodai

o

I loved the scene. Shodai looked like a boxing coach taking care of his champion between rounds

[Reonito 1,408]

6 hours ago, Johnofuji said:

"The gyoji shall not order the temporary halt of a bout during offensive moves of competitors."

I guess the problem with this is that it does not acknowledge the possibility that the gyoji may screw up, and makes no provision for what to do in that case.

[Jakusotsu 5,905]

23 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

The work of Inosuke to retie the mawashi of Wakamotoharu was done by Shodai

I won't even begin trying to imagine what would have happened if Inosuke actually did it instead.

[Rocks 1,808]

"Gyoji thinks belt needs to be retied and Terunofuji concurs, but the guojis hesitates. (let me stop video twice to suggest more than a few seconds has passed). Gyoji fnally stops match"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KyL6pd6Zbms

Apparently Chris sumo is a mind reader now. I've never seen so much read into a what is at worst a simple mistake. All of sumo is wrong because of Inosoke.  The entire commentary in this video is ridiculous. The only redeeming factor in this video is the different angle then TV broadcast. 

[Reonito 1,408]

This video does make it clear, though, that the rear belt knot was clearly coming loose earlier, when the wrestlers were at an impasse, and had it been tightened there, we would have avoided the farce that followed.

[Benihana 1,921]

7 hours ago, rhyen said:

What is the forum record for longest honbasho thread?

I searched only this sub-forum for titles with "spoilers" and 2020/07 with 1292 (52 pages) is the largest among them. You'd have to do a manual search fot more precise results.

[Rocks 1,808]

11 minutes ago, Reonito said:

This video does make it clear, though, that the rear belt knot was clearly coming loose earlier, when the wrestlers were at an impasse, and had it been tightened there, we would have avoided the farce that followed.

Going by Jason's video. The earliest I would say you could suggest there could be a stoppage is 6:23. The point Chris indicates is 6:24. 6:25 Insouke indicates a stop, moves towards rikishi and by 6:26 has reached them and is waving frantically for stoppage. 2 seconds is hardly sufficient to warrant the wholesale overhaul of sumo procedures. 

Edited July 17, 2022 by Rocks

[WAKATAKE 2,650]

17 minutes ago, Rocks said:

"Gyoji thinks belt needs to be retied and Terunofuji concurs, but the guojis hesitates. (let me stop video twice to suggest more than a few seconds has passed). Gyoji fnally stops match"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KyL6pd6Zbms

Apparently Chris sumo is a mind reader now. I've never seen so much read into a what is at worst a simple mistake. All of sumo is wrong because of Inosoke.  The entire commentary in this video is ridiculous. The only redeeming factor in this video is the different angle then TV broadcast. 

Ironically with Chris’ angle of the match, they actually WERE momentarily stopped when Inosuke moved in to stop them. His timing was actually decent in my opinion. But hey leave it to Chris to find every minuscule reason to criticize everything wrong with sumo these days. Surprised some of fans are disagreeing with him in the comments

[Bakayokozuna 52]

43 minutes ago, Rocks said:

"Gyoji thinks belt needs to be retied and Terunofuji concurs, but the guojis hesitates. (let me stop video twice to suggest more than a few seconds has passed). Gyoji fnally stops match"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KyL6pd6Zbms

Apparently Chris sumo is a mind reader now. I've never seen so much read into a what is at worst a simple mistake. All of sumo is wrong because of Inosoke.  The entire commentary in this video is ridiculous. The only redeeming factor in this video is the different angle then TV broadcast. 

 At some point in the video it is written :  Ask not "What is the rule" but "How the athletes feel about what we decide".

I wonder what is the point of rules if you don't try to apply them ? That situation went to comedy material, true enough, but if you ignore rules thats just openning the door to way more drama in the future