Benevolance

Haru 2022 Discussion Thread (SPOILERS!)

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7 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Feel-good story for an otherwise gloomy day... Tochimaru clinches his promotion to juryo with his win over Takakento. DB down at the moment but I know he's been knocking on the sekitori door for ages, so fair play to the lad.


And the first Day 6 kachi-koshi since Toyonoshima in 2018 Aki, too. A rare possibility for those in the top few Makushita ranks, since they have a chance to be called up to fight a Juryo bout.

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7 hours ago, since_94 said:

Really impressed with the way Akiseyama is moving this tournament. He's remarkably agile and reads his opponents exceedingly well.

I read this sentence three times and it still doesn't make any sense to me. 

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8 hours ago, Gospodin said:

God bless his stubbornness seems to have mellowed. The memory of his 2-13 basho as ozeki, when he was badly in jured, still makes me cringe.

It helps that there is no kadoban status for Yokozuna.  A big, big perk.

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14 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:

It helps that there is no kadoban status for Yokozuna.  A big, big perk.

Teru failed to take advantage of kadoban during his previous stint as an Ozeki.  Instead of taking an early kyujo or sitting out a basho to recover, he insisted on fighting through for a full 15 days which further aggravated his injuries.  He did this for over one year before the idiocy of it finally set in.

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11 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Feel-good story for an otherwise gloomy day... Tochimaru clinches his promotion to juryo with his win over Takakento. DB down at the moment but I know he's been knocking on the sekitori door for ages, so fair play to the lad.

I sincerely hope so, but he's not out of the woods yet depending on how the whole exchange picture plays out. He's missed out 5 times with a KK in the promotion zone, which I think at least ties him for the worst luck in making a sekitori debut.

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Posted (edited)

There are 2 other unbeaten rikishi in the makushita top 15.....I struggle to see Shonnanoumi going 7-0 and hence doubt he factors into promotion decisions, but Chiyonoumi is a juryo level competitor with only 1 MK outside the sekitori ranks, and a realistic threat to go unbeaten at Ms6 for a guaranteed promotion. Chiyorashi also has good KK prospects at the highest makushita rank, and there are potential 6-1s at Ms4 who might surpass a 4-3 at Ms1w. No one from juryo is locked to go down yet either.

That said, overall it looks very good for Tochimaru and it's his first time with a KK at Ms1.

Edited by Katooshu
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14 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

There are 2 unbeaten rikishi in the makushita top 15.....I struggle to see Shonnanoumi going 7-0 and hence doubt he factors into promotion decisions, but Chiyonoumi is a juryo level competitor with only 1 MK outside the sekitori ranks, and a realistic threat to go unbeaten at Ms6 for a guaranteed promotion. Chiyorashi has good KK prospects at the highest makushita rank, and there are potential 6-1s at Ms4 who might surpass a 4-3 at Ms1w. No one from juryo is locked to go down yet either.

That said, overall it looks very good for Tochimaru and it's his first time with a KK at Ms1.

Obviously looking at it, the two from Juryo to watch for are Kotoyusho and Shimazuumi, who are 1-5. Churanoumi at J10 is also 1-5, so if they continue down this way they'll most likely go down

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Ya, and I'm fairly confident they will end up going down too, but you never know.

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1 hour ago, Katooshu said:

Chiyonoumi is a juryo level competitor with only 1 MK outside the sekitori ranks, and a realistic threat to go unbeaten at Ms6 for a guaranteed promotion. 

I don't think anyone in the Ms top 15 is going to go 7-0. Chiyonoumi would probably have to get past Shonannoumi, Tochimaru, Shishi and Kinbozan... can't see that happening.

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Posted (edited)

Probably not, but it wouldn't shock me. He is better than the first 3, and Kinbozan is still green. 

Edited by Katooshu

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26 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Probably not, but it wouldn't shock me. He is better than the first 3, and Kinbozan is still green. 

Shishi looked really on fire from what I've seen. Would be a close match

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Posted (edited)

Shishi is on form for sure, but he is also facing lower level competition. He only scored 1 win when he was at ms8.

Many of these unbeaten guys could realistically beat the other though. There's certainly no one dominant in the race who can be counted on to win like Abi, Tochinoshin, and Ryuden were in their returns (and even then Ryuden took a loss in his 2nd return basho).

Edited by Katooshu
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Posted (edited)

The call on Tobizaru touching out first really caught me off guard.   Belt and braces in tact.

Abema TV did not capture the touching of the ring, although the announcement by Takadagawa-oyakata did state clearly that the touch occurred "mid-way" (tochuu).  Given that Tobizaru's hand touching down inside the ring was clearly the case, and the gyoji seemed quite certain about it, I couldn't figure out why the monoii took so long and Takadagawa remained up on the ring looking rather confused when the other judges had all sat down.  I really should watch NHK, but Abema has its good points...

Edited by Amamaniac
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31 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Kinbozan is still green.

So was the Green Knight, Hulk, Swamp Thing, Green Lantern etc.

Shishi is on fire for obvious reasons and a yusho would make an inspiring story.

So I'm going for a Shishi vs Kinbozan match for all the marbles.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

Is is worth discussing or reviewing monoii decisions, or to put it another way, does it matter if anyone (i.e., me) feels that a poor decision was made?  At the end of the day, it all goes down in history as one white star and one black star, and once the judges make their call, there is no recourse for change.

With that preamble, I humbly submit my view that the judges (headed by Takadagawa) claiming that Tobizaru "touched out before Sadanoumi" was incorrect.  Admittedly, it was quite close, and calling a torinaoshi would not have been out of line.  But to say Tobizaru touched out first is flat out untrue.

The fact that Tobizaru's feet had left the surface of the ring, and he was on his way out earlier seems to be a more acceptable basis for upholding the gyoji's call.  But that is not what was announced.

For me, the "belt and braces" system (as Tigerboy1966 nicely characterises it) is only as good as the weakest link in the judges team (often that ends up being the chief judge) and how he communicates with the video reviewers.  I know sumo desperately wants to maintain the image of relying on traditional methods, but frankly, more accurate results would occur if the highest official had direct access to video replays, similar to VAR in soccer.

OK, sumo is entertainment and there are extenuating circumstances.  All I'm saying is that there is room for improvement (quite a bit of room).  Don't get me started on muddled announcements by chief judges, especially down in the lower divisions.  I understand the nerves and inexperience issues.  But some form of professional training away from the ring might ... improve things.  (Shucks, that's never going to happen.) 

In the middle of the bout, Tobizaru put a hand on the ground and continued fighting. You could even see Sadanoumi stop for a moment, thinking it was over.

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55 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

I don't think anyone in the Ms top 15 is going to go 7-0. Chiyonoumi would probably have to get past Shonannoumi, Tochimaru, Shishi and Kinbozan... can't see that happening.

Someone has to go 7-0 (okay, occasionally we end up with a whole bunch of 6-1's battling it out).

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3 minutes ago, Reonito said:
59 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

I don't think anyone in the Ms top 15 is going to go 7-0. Chiyonoumi would probably have to get past Shonannoumi, Tochimaru, Shishi and Kinbozan... can't see that happening.

Someone has to go 7-0 (okay, occasionally we end up with a whole bunch of 6-1's battling it out).

Someone has to go 7-0 indeed, but not necessarily someone in the top 15. Nishikawa won from Ms35 last time.

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18 minutes ago, Kaito said:

In the middle of the bout, Tobizaru put a hand on the ground and continued fighting. You could even see Sadanoumi stop for a moment, thinking it was over.

Yes, Kintamayama's video shows the replay .

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23 minutes ago, Kaito said:

In the middle of the bout, Tobizaru put a hand on the ground and continued fighting. You could even see Sadanoumi stop for a moment, thinking it was over.

It was pretty blatant in hindsight. Tobizaru sure had quite the cheek to continue brawling like nothing happened.

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34 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Someone has to go 7-0 indeed, but not necessarily someone in the top 15. Nishikawa won from Ms35 last time.

If we're throwing darts, Choyonoumi's current odds are 1/14; he's clearly better than most of the 14, so I'd say he has a decent chance, though I'd peg it at maybe 1 in 4 at best.

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4 hours ago, Yamanashi said:

It helps that there is no kadoban status for Yokozuna.  A big, big perk.

Any kachikoshi Ozeki has the option of sitting out the next two basho, returning as an Ozekiwake, getting 10 wins and starting the whole cycle again.  He only needs 20 wins per year.  That's almost as good as being a yokozuna.  B-)

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12 minutes ago, Reonito said:

If we're throwing darts, Choyonoumi's current odds are 1/14

So that means he has a 93% chance of winning out? Odds? "I do not think it means what you think it means".

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3 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

So that means he has a 93% chance of winning out? Odds? "I do not think it means what you think it means".

One in fourteen I mean, 14:1 against (which I'd revise down to maybe 4:1 against).

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2 hours ago, Koorifuu said:

It was pretty blatant in hindsight. Tobizaru sure had quite the cheek to continue brawling like nothing happened.

When interviewed by an NHK reporter after the bout, Tobizaru said he was aware his hand had touched down, but since the gyoji didn't stop the bout he decided to just gambarize to the end.

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FROM NIKKAN SPORTS (Japanes): CHIYONOKUNI WITHDRAWS FROM BASHO (DEEPL.COM TRANSLATE)

 

Chiyonokuni out of action, left deltoid muscle (Shoulder) injury Third person to be out of action at juryo or above, following Terunofuji and Ishiura.
[March 19, 2022, 10:58 AM].

On the seventh day of the spring tournament, Chiyonokuni (31=Kuju), the 13th rank in the west maegashira division, submitted a medical report to the Japan Sumo Association stating that he was expected to require two weeks of rest and treatment due to an injury to his left deltoid muscle. 

Chiyonokuni was 4-2 after six days, losing to newly-entered wrestler Kotokuzan on the sixth day.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

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