Hakuho retires

[Gurowake 3,915]

I don't know anything about the real estate market in Japan, but I suspect that a property in the middle of Tokyo will only appreciate in value.  Even if he needs to get a loan to help finance it, and needs to spend every cent of his income from all of his various ventures to manage the debt, real estate in big cities is usually a very good investment that would outweigh the upfront cost and debt service.  Of course, most of the time we're talking about real estate that produces income through rents, and it's not clear if this building will be able to generate enough in rent based on who the tenants will be in order to make it a reasonable investment.  Most real estate investors only put up 25% of the purchase price and finance the rest, knowing that the rental income will support the repayment of the debt, but I'm not sure if that's realistic to consider in this case.  No doubt though that he has a lot of supporters that might financially contribute to making the new Miyagino-beya a world-class establishment.   

Edited September 28, 2021 by Gurowake

[rhyen 1,809]

Maybe it might not be in Nihonbashi as outlined by google maps. 
 

there is Nihonbashihoncho & nihonbashikobunacho just to the north. Further northeast near the river is Higashinihonbashi (which is 2 bridges away from the kokugikan) with Arashio beya to the south near the hamacho station?

there is also Oridomecho, kodenmacho, odenmacho, yokoyamacho as well between them.

Edited September 28, 2021 by rhyen

[Amamaniac 2,078]

14 hours ago, WAKATAKE said:

Hakuho's got plans. A new heya worth about 200,000,000 yen is being mentioned for building in Nihombashi. Worthy this means that he is going to move Miyagino or if he's opening another heya is up in the air.

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202109280000097.html

Thanks for the link, WAKATAKE, but I think you left a zero out, i.e., 2,000,000,000 yen.  

I can buy a pretty nice condo or house for 200,000,000 yen where I'm from, but in Tokyo I suspect that's the going rate for a one bedroom closet. 

[Kintamayama 44,350]

1 hour ago, rhyen said:

Maybe it might not be in Nihonbashi as outlined by google maps. 
 

there is Nihonbashihoncho & nihonbashikobunacho just to the north. Further northeast near the river is Higashinihonbashi (which is 2 bridges away from the kokugikan) with Arashio beya to the south near the hamacho station?

there is also Oridomecho, kodenmacho, odenmacho, yokoyamacho as well between them.

Be that as it may, the price is probably correct and quite extravagant.

[Tsuchinoninjin 1,244]

Usually you'd build a new building too but probably the stuff in nihonbashi is nice, so maybe not in this case.

I never liked going there - big streets and big building means long walking distance, and suit is basically required. And everything closes too early!

[rzombie1988 157]

$20 million on a stable is just dumb. You don't even technically need a ring to train sumo.

Edited September 28, 2021 by rzombie1988

[Yaochozuna 137]

I think I understand the prolonged story of Hakuho's retirement now.

Hakuho: "I'm done. Retiring."
YDC: [ some blah blah in background]
Kyokai: "Impossible man. Cannot pay you. You've earned so much you'll have to die on dohyo."
YDC: [some more blah blah in background]
Hakuho: "I don't like it."
YDC: [some major blah blah in background]
Kyokai: "Neither do we."
YDC: [angry blah blah in background]
Hakuho: "So?"
YDC: [even more angry blah blah in background]
Kyokai: "So nothing. Unless..."
YDC: [pissed off blah blah in background]
Hakuho: "Unless?"
YDC: [pissed off blah blah in background for good measure]
Kyokai: "Unless we 'pay' you and you 'reinvest' the money back. You know, building heyas and such."
YDC: [continuous lunatic blah blah in background]
Hakuho: "No other options?"
YDC: [frenzied blah blah in background]
Kyokai: "No other options, pal."
YDC: [blah blah blah in background]
Hakuho: "So be it."
YDC: [blah blah blah blah in background]
Hakuho + Kyokai: "Will you shut up?"
YDC: [won't shut up]

[Yamanashi 3,724]

9 minutes ago, rzombie1988 said:

$20 million on a stable is just dumb. You don't even technically need a ring to train sumo.

Well, I don't think a big % of that 20 million is going to the dohyo.  I don't even know if these stories are true.  I do know that if it is true, Hakuho has a plausible business plan behind it. 

It's too early to tell, but it appears that some of the recent new heya construction takes into account the needs of the rikishi who will be living there.  Carrot instead of stick?

[Seiyashi 4,071]

29 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:

44 minutes ago, rzombie1988 said:

$20 million on a stable is just dumb. You don't even technically need a ring to train sumo.

Well, I don't think a big % of that 20 million is going to the dohyo.  I don't even know if these stories are true.  I do know that if it is true, Hakuho has a plausible business plan behind it. 

It's too early to tell, but it appears that some of the recent new heya construction takes into account the needs of the rikishi who will be living there.  Carrot instead of stick?

And we know Hakuho is anything but dumb, so whatever the 20 mil is going on, it's not on a run-of-a-mill heya.

Whether it works out is a different matter altogether, but it'll at least be an experiment instead of sticking to "tried-and-true" means. Combined with Araiso's attempts, it's at least some innovation in training.

Also probably a good time to ask: how significant are a rikishi's/heya's supporters in funding ventures like a heya building? 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Seiyashi

[Benevolance 2,478]

Given that a lot of the cost is probably land in Tokyo, wouldn't heya build multi-unit structures and rent out the unused portions of the buildings? 

[Kaminariyuki 497]

2 hours ago, Amamaniac said:

Thanks for the link, WAKATAKE, but I think you left a zero out, i.e., 2,000,000,000 yen.  

I can buy a pretty nice condo or house for 200,000,000 yen where I'm from, but in Tokyo I suspect that's the going rate for a one bedroom closet. 

LOL, yes, when Joann told me that Hakuho was building a heya in Nihonbashi for $3 million, I thought there was an error somewhere. That's a very pricy area of Tokyo, walking distance to Tokyo station or Ginza. My guess would be that 100,000,000 yen in that neighborhood might get you a parking spot. Even the adjoining areas to the east and north would be a little extravagant for a heya, but Hakuho could be trying to make a statement with his new address. He certainly has some backing, so I wouldn't rule out an address between Ginza and Ueno. There's little doubt that most of the heyas are where they are because it's a lower rent area of the capital but still close to the Kokugikan.

[Kaminariyuki 497]

19 hours ago, sumojoann said:

Memories of Hakuho ---------------

I was hoping to be able to get back to Japan again and to be able to watch Hakuho once more in person but it is not to be.  I'll have to be content with my memories of the only basho I was able to attend -- Aki 2014 from Days 8 to 15.  The most memorable bout was on Day 14 between Hakuho and Ichinojo, who was making his Makuuchi debut.  Just before the bout started, I could feel the excitement in the air at the Kokugikan.  I don't think any other bout generated as much tension.  Because Ichinojo was making his debut, no one, including Hakuho, could foretell who would be the victor.  Ichinojo was huge and looked menacing with his hair hanging down (it wasn't long enough for a topknot).  As the bout started, the noise of the crowd rose to a fever pitch.  It was so loud, I couldn't hear my husband or  my friend trying to say something to me.  The bout ended quickly with a magnificent throw by Hakuho.  Incredibly, the noise in the Kokugikan increased.  People were clapping, cheering, yelling, shouting and screaming.  It was pandemonium and the atmosphere was electric!  It was like nothing I've ever witnessed before.  You never hear this on the live TV broadcast because it would be impossible to hear the announcers.  It took about 5 minutes before the incredible roar died down.  I'll never forget it.......

 

Great story, and an excellent choice of bouts to show. Thanks!

[Amamaniac 2,078]

One thing that hasn't been discussed yet, and perhaps it is far too early, but I am trying to imagine how Hakuho's danpatsu topknot cutting ceremony will go.

The pandemic has certainly put a damper on large gatherings (approx 5000 people allowed in the Kokugikan during official tournaments).  I'd like to think that Hakuho could sell out Tokyo Dome, but his reputation and popularity has taken a hit in recent years.  IMHO it is sad that there seems to be a campaign (press spreading YDC complaints) to discredit Hakuho and his illustrious career in order to justify the decision to deny Hakuho ichidai toshiyori lifetime elder status.  If local fans buy into it, it will seriously impact ticket sales for his retirement ceremony.

Excuse me for bringing up Harumafuji, but from what I recall, he enjoyed a packed house of adoring fans for his danpatsu shiki despite the scandal that led him to retire.  Let's say everyone in Japan is properly vaccinated and the Kokugikan is once again enjoying manin onrei full houses a year from now (or whenever Hakuho's ceremony gets scheduled).  Will fans show the same adoration for Hakuho as they did for Harumafuji and pack the Kokugikan venue?  I'd like to think so (since Hakuho's achievements do deserve a lot of respect), but I'm confused about the mixed reactions and press releases that have surfaced after the retirement news broke...

[Benevolance 2,478]

11 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

Will fans show the same adoration for Hakuho as they did for Harumafuji and pack the Kokugikan venue?

Yes. 

[Kaminariyuki 497]

51 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

 Will fans show the same adoration for Hakuho as they did for Harumafuji and pack the Kokugikan venue?  I'd like to think so (since Hakuho's achievements do deserve a lot of respect), but I'm confused about the mixed reactions and press releases that have surfaced after the retirement news broke...

Like Benevolance, I think so, as well. Harumafuji was a lovable guy, as long as you weren't the one getting bashed with a beer bottle or remote control over the head. I think folks will soften on the parts of Hakuho they did not appreciate, over time. We witnessed one of the great periods in sumo history with an unparalleled champion. I think that will be respected and appreciated by most folks, even a fair number of the detractors.

Good point about the danpatrsu shiki, though. I'd like a ticket to that myself, and I might just have to have one.

[Mattjila 0]

This even made the Washington Post:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/28/hakuho-sumo-wrestler-retire-japan-sports/

[Benevolance 2,478]

Quote

as long as you weren't the one getting bashed with a beer bottle or remote control over the head

 

I'd would willingly suffer a modest amount of blunt force head trauma to hang out drinking and doing karaoke with Harumafuji and Hakuho. 

To be clear: it's probably considerably less blunt force head trauma than if I hung out and did sumo with them, so I think all parties involved would call this a win.

Edited September 28, 2021 by Benevolance

[rhyen 1,809]

1 hour ago, Amamaniac said:

One thing that hasn't been discussed yet, and perhaps it is far too early, but I am trying to imagine how Hakuho's danpatsu topknot cutting ceremony will go.

The pandemic has certainly put a damper on large gatherings (approx 5000 people allowed in the Kokugikan during official tournaments).  I'd like to think that Hakuho could sell out Tokyo Dome, but his reputation and popularity has taken a hit in recent years.  IMHO it is sad that there seems to be a campaign (press spreading YDC complaints) to discredit Hakuho and his illustrious career in order to justify the decision to deny Hakuho ichidai toshiyori lifetime elder status.  If local fans buy into it, it will seriously impact ticket sales for his retirement ceremony.

Excuse me for bringing up Harumafuji, but from what I recall, he enjoyed a packed house of adoring fans for his danpatsu shiki despite the scandal that led him to retire.  Let's say everyone in Japan is properly vaccinated and the Kokugikan is once again enjoying manin onrei full houses a year from now (or whenever Hakuho's ceremony gets scheduled).  Will fans show the same adoration for Hakuho as they did for Harumafuji and pack the Kokugikan venue?  I'd like to think so (since Hakuho's achievements do deserve a lot of respect), but I'm confused about the mixed reactions and press releases that have surfaced after the retirement news broke...

About half of the Harumafuji’s ceremony attendees were Mongolians flown/bussed in.

[Amamaniac 2,078]

3 minutes ago, rhyen said:

About half of the Harumafuji’s ceremony attendees were Mongolians flown/bussed in.

That could easily be the case for Hakuho as well.  "Half of Mongolia" could be flown/bussed in, and Hakuho would pick up the tab ... if that would keep up appearances. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Amamaniac

[Mightyduck 67]

When I first started getting in to sumo, one of the things that surprised me was how small and basic most of the heya are. At that time I did not know how frequently they moved /were rebuilt and had assumed they would have been the original buildings. 

Now however, we are going to have Miyagino Towers to add to Araiso Castle / Ibaraki Hilton 

[Kintamayama 44,350]

14 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

From what I'm reading, he will be Magaki and work as an assistant coach at Miyagino.

Magaki, coming from sources inside the Kyokai now. Steak.

[Washuyama 635]

1 hour ago, Mattjila said:

This even made the Washington Post:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/28/hakuho-sumo-wrestler-retire-japan-sports/

I impressed...  A well written article about sumo in western press.  It doesn't happen often.

[Yamanashi 3,724]

26 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

Magaki, coming from sources inside the Kyokai now. Steak.

Isn't there a rule that precludes a new man from doing a branchout for a set amount of time (a year?)

Of course, ex-Chikubayama could swap kabus and let Hakuho start early on Miyagino, but that would be a skosh too accommodating [note Japanese-derived slang word].

[Yamanashi 3,724]

All, in all, a well-written piece.

From the article: "I have always found it hard to justify holding such strong feelings about sports figures. "  Written in a sports article.  If anything sums up the Washington Post, this is it.

[Kintamayama 44,350]

8 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:

Isn't there a rule that precludes a new man from doing a branchout for a set amount of time (a year?)

Of course, ex-Chikubayama could swap kabus and let Hakuho start early on Miyagino, but that would be a skosh too accommodating [note Japanese-derived slang word].

Just assuming the name for now and remaining as a coach at Miyagino. There were a few members not sure if he has that kabu at all.