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Aki Basho 2021 - Discussion Thread (Spoilers!)

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(Whateverabove,itisfunny...) possessed by the spirit of Hattorizakura for a split second?

Interesting day. Ura was awesome! And Shodai is now promoted to TNY after TNO?

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1 hour ago, nelimw said:

Shodai makes no sense to me. Over the past 2 years only Terunofuji has more wins than him (119 from Aki 2019 through Nagoya 2021). Shodai and Takakeisho both had 97 wins over the same period. His tachi-ai is just him standing up, I can't see anything special/spectacular about his sumo, and yet he's the 2nd best man in sumo. How?!

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&show_total=on&sum_wins=60&sum_range=7&show_sum=on&form1_year=2019&form1_month=9&columns=11

Perspective.

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&show_total=on&sum_wins=60&sum_range=7&show_sum=on&form1_year=2012&form1_month=9&columns=11

If you compare a similar 11-basho period starting from Aki 2012 (Harumafuji's second zensho, sealing his own promotion to yokozuna), Shodai's performance in terms of pure wins is about on par with Tochiozan's, who was putting up pretty good numbers in the joi. Terunofuji's performance was about on par with Kisenosato's and Harumafuji's back then, and Hakuho was kicking ass and taking names in his prime. 

I have a feeling when we think of what a "dominant" sanyaku looks like, we have in mind what the sumo looked like in that period, which is why Shodai is such an enigma to us since he puts up decent relative positioning with what looks like weird sumo. But in the grand scheme of things, beyond the jun-yusho, yusho, and ozeki run, his numbers haven't been great.

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Hate to nitpick, but in today's bout against Kiribayama, one of Terunofuji's sagari sticks (made up of a bundle of silk threads glued together) appeared to be largely unravelled.  Whichever tsukebito is responsible for the Shin-Yokozuna's wardrobe needs a stern talking to! :-P

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1 hour ago, Seiyashi said:

Amanoshima- Dainichidou:

It appears that he was sliding the right foot as he dragged Dainichido along; he caught his instep on the clay and the knee buckled.

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27 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

Hate to nitpick, but in today's bout against Kiribayama, one of Terunofuji's sagari sticks (made up of a bundle of silk threads glued together) appeared to be largely unravelled.  Whichever tsukebito is responsible for the Shin-Yokozuna's wardrobe needs a stern talking to! :-P

Was it just the top part of the sagari dislodging from the mawashi? It looked too thick to be unraveled sagari to me. 

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2 makuuchi bouts in a row fusensho happened last 22 years ago, it was the 6th time https://www.sanspo.com/article/20210916-7YV5PVLI2FICJHWGXQPF3W6QFM/

Okuritsuridashi was last done by Asashoryu 16 years ago in Kyushu, to Ama (HF) https://www.sanspo.com/article/20210916-5X6JCXWQLNOYLJAZMDGG7OK2BE/

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2 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

The funny part is, he didn't seem to have that much difficulty walking off the dohyo afterwards.

Concussion? The person doesn’t have to faint, only needs the peripheral nerves to cut off at some point and then resume normal connection?

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2 hours ago, nelimw said:

Shodai makes no sense to me. Over the past 2 years only Terunofuji has more wins than him (119 from Aki 2019 through Nagoya 2021). Shodai and Takakeisho both had 97 wins over the same period. His tachi-ai is just him standing up, I can't see anything special/spectacular about his sumo, and yet he's the 2nd best man in sumo. How?!

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query.aspx?show_form=0&show_total=on&sum_wins=60&sum_range=7&show_sum=on&form1_year=2019&form1_month=9&columns=11

It's funny, and sometimes it's easy to overlook, especially if you remember the hype and expectations that fans bestowed upon him early in his career. But Shodai is VERY fundamentally sound. Despite his awkwardness or various flaws, he has great strength, balance and mobility. He has also remained healthy and relatively injury-free for a long time.

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After the loss to Takakeisho on day 4, Hoshoryu didn't properly face his opponent for the courtesy bow (rei) and left. Inosuke stopped him and made him bow properly. Sumo starts and ends with rei, like any Japanese martial art, and that phrase is always cited when esp. a foreigner misbehaves.

This then met with harsh words on the Japanese social media, like: the bad attitude of Asashoryu facing already also in the nephew. 

https://npn.co.jp/article/detail/200016154

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50 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:
1 hour ago, Amamaniac said:

Hate to nitpick, but in today's bout against Kiribayama, one of Terunofuji's sagari sticks (made up of a bundle of silk threads glued together) appeared to be largely unravelled.  Whichever tsukebito is responsible for the Shin-Yokozuna's wardrobe needs a stern talking to! :-P

Was it just the top part of the sagari dislodging from the mawashi? It looked too thick to be unraveled sagari to me. 

Check the 11:55 mark in Kintamayama's digest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKqxBGmZrEQ

 

To my eye the top half of one of the "sticks" has come apart. The very top section of the sagari sticks are usually left unglued for flexibility.  But in this case, the evidence suggests a bigger problem...

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13 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

After the loss to Takakeisho on day 4, Hoshoryu didn't properly face his opponent for the courtesy bow (rei) and left. Inosuke stopped him and made him bow properly. Sumo starts and ends with rei, like any Japanese martial art, and that phrase is always cited when esp. a foreigner misbehaves.

This then met with harsh words on the Japanese social media, like: the bad attitude of Asashoryu facing already also in the nephew. 

https://npn.co.jp/article/detail/200016154

Which caused the "tonsillitis" of course. I wonder what Takatouriki has to say about this. In any case, it seems to me too much of a coincidence that he was diagnosed  at the venue- I don't remember anyone getting diagnosed at the venue of anything ever. Maybe late because of traffic jams, but this? I hate tin foils, but I smell a small punishment, say two days in absentia. You have to kill these things when they are small, so to speak. 

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On 12/09/2021 at 06:58, nelimw said:

Nice to see ol' Tochinoshin start with a win.

Well, it was good while it lasted....

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In the race for the unofficial "most wins in the calendar year" title, I have Terunofuji 15 clear of the field with 25 matches to go:

54 Terunofuji

39 Mitakeumi, Shodai

37 Ichinojo, Takayasu, Kotonowaka

36 Meisei

35 Daieisho, Hoshoryu

34 Kiribayama

I think Teru will have this one wrapped up by the end of the basho.

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21 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

In the race for the unofficial "most wins in the calendar year" title, I have Terunofuji 15 clear of the field with 25 matches to go:

 

Relevant database query

EDIT: Only Terunofuji, Mitakeumi and Meisei have achieved a top-division KK in each basho so far this year.

Edited by Sakura

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32 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

In the race for the unofficial "most wins in the calendar year" title, I have Terunofuji 15 clear of the field with 25 matches to go:

54 Terunofuji

39 Mitakeumi, Shodai

37 Ichinojo, Takayasu, Kotonowaka

36 Meisei

35 Daieisho, Hoshoryu

34 Kiribayama

I think Teru will have this one wrapped up by the end of the basho.

I automatically thought wait where's Hakuho... and then realised he's only completed one basho this year. Which he won with a zensho yusho.

And is Ura slowly turning into the next Aminishiki? Both knees blown out yet pulling off wily wins every so often. 

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Some really great techniques today. Loved Terunofuji vs Kiribayama. This has to be Terunofuji's Yusho. Everything else does not feel right. 

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On 15/09/2021 at 19:09, Benevolance said:
On 15/09/2021 at 09:58, Tigerboy1966 said:

Since returning to makunouchi Terunofuji has now gone 7-0 against Hokutofuji, and has used 7 different kimarite.

Fortunately, Terunofuji has got another 75 more kimarite to choose from before he is forced to start losing to Hokutofuji. 

I should point out that those 7 kimarite do not include yorikiri, so Terunofuji has a decent chance to extend his run to 8 in November. My non-sumo-fan workmate however, insists on saying "awwh, Mr Fuji just beats them 'cos he's too strong". Not entirely untrue but...

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7 hours ago, hakutorizakura said:

(Whateverabove,itisfunny...) possessed by the spirit of Hattorizakura for a split second?

Interesting day. Ura was awesome! And Shodai is now promoted to TNY after TNO?

Indeed.

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My observations:

Ura, until today, continues his conservative and mostly boring sumo (since returning to Makuuchi) in attempts to avoid injury. Starts very far from the shikirisen, causing an illusion that all his bouts are matta. Today just happened, as he himself said. See him going the conservative way again tomorrow.

Kiribayama- having a great basho, but I don't see him ever reaching higher than Sekiwake. His recent success is a result of Kakuryuu's coaching. Looking very good this basho, but we have yet to see if it's a fluke or the beginning of something bigger. Too early to call him the new Harumafuji, for sure.

Terunofuji - sure.

Houshouryuu - letting success rise to his short-fused head. Makekoshi and hopefully humble pie. The potential screams, but so does the self destruction mode. Tonsillitis, huh?

Meisei - joi elevator

Ichinojou will have good and bad days till he retires, Sekiwake and some M8 there as well. Forget about using his shikona and breakthrough basho in the same breath. World Champion in synchronized walking backwards.

Shoudai- nothing a good shrink can't fix. You can all laugh and degrade him as much as you like. Eventual Yokozuna. The only problem he has is mental, and it's a serious one. His self confidence is non-existent. In every interview, a question is answered with a question. "How are you doing?" "I'm moving well, I think, right? Aren't I?" I do not exaggerate. He needs a good coacher or a better shrink to help him overcome that and turn him into a mean machine at 30. He has the power, he has the magic technique- he lacks the belief in himself.

Takakeishou- first few days he was simply scared. That happens a lot after an injury. After seeing that he can cope, he's showing his stuff. One-dimensional as usual, but so what? The first time he gets a shot of pain in a bout ("I felt electricity shoot through my body.."), he'll return to being too careful. Hopefully without those spasms which nobody mentions these days.

Takayasu - Kisenosato's departure has done him more damage than he cares to admit. The training against him was gold. He has nobody serious to train with. And a bad back. I think his 1-4 is a combination of both, except his win which was really good. I mean, the graceful way he mounted the dohyo to get that freebie..

Mitakeumi - I have no idea. I dare anyone to have an idea about this enigma. No idea. 

Tochinoshin - The last  year or so all his bashos seem to be his last, yet he somehow perseveres.

Kaisei and Aoiyama - They're the same guy, but Kaisei is ranked lower most of the time. Their fighting style is totally different, but they're the same guy. They get excellent wins out of nowhere, and then lose too easily.

Abi - Can't wait for his return.

Edited by Kintamayama
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49 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

I should point out that those 7 kimarite do not include yorikiri, so Terunofuji has a decent chance to extend his run to 8 in November. My non-sumo-fan workmate however, insists on saying "awwh, Mr Fuji just beats them 'cos he's too strong". Not entirely untrue but...

Don't think they'll be meeting in November :-(

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5 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

After the loss to Takakeisho on day 4, Hoshoryu didn't properly face his opponent for the courtesy bow (rei) and left. Inosuke stopped him and made him bow properly. Sumo starts and ends with rei, like any Japanese martial art, and that phrase is always cited when esp. a foreigner misbehaves.

This then met with harsh words on the Japanese social media, like: the bad attitude of Asashoryu facing already also in the nephew. 

https://npn.co.jp/article/detail/200016154

Rikishi not bowing properly is a particular bugbear of mine. The not-at-all-missed Takagenji was another one. 

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With Delgerbayar turning pro and Oshoumi showing good sumo as he climbs the ranks, Oshoryu might be only the 3rd best sekitori prospect at Naruto now.

Edited by Katooshu
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Hidenoumi is now joint leader for most ever ushiromotare, with 2. can he pull off another?

40 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

With Delgerbayar turning pro and Oshoumi showing good sumo as he climbs the ranks, Oshoryu might be only the 3rd best sekitori prospect at Naruto now.

I'd probably put Hagiwara ahead of him too. very disappointing after his amazing start.

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