Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Godango said: Poor Hoshoryu looks exhausted after lugging around Ichinojo's frame in bout one. This is gonna be tough. He aced it, though. That was a sweet shitatenage at the very end. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ichimawashi 573 Posted July 16, 2021 It looks like the judges tonight have a later than expected restaurant reservation. Anything not completely obvious to all of Japan is a torinaoshi. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Athenayama 941 Posted July 16, 2021 Am I the only to think that Ichinojo was "robbed" after the first one? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hakuryuho 334 Posted July 16, 2021 Hoshoryu once again willed a win into existence. What a lad Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ichimawashi 573 Posted July 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Athenayama said: Am I the only to think that Ichinojo was "robbed" after the first one? Nope. Tobizaru as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godango 956 Posted July 16, 2021 3 minutes ago, Athenayama said: Am I the only to think that Ichinojo was "robbed" after the first one? I expected it to go Ichinojo's way, but I think the torinaoshi call was reasonable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ichimawashi 573 Posted July 16, 2021 3 minutes ago, Godango said: I expected it to go Ichinojo's way, but I think the torinaoshi call was reasonable. I think when your opponent steps out of the dohyo and down to the floor and you see his foot halfway between the floor and the dohyo plane and falling, it really should be safe at that point to put your own foot down outside the dohyo. The judges did not agree with this. Perplexing. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Athenayama 941 Posted July 16, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Godango said: I expected it to go Ichinojo's way, but I think the torinaoshi call was reasonable. Hi sir I don't know which stream you are watching but on NHK's replay when Ichinojo stepped his foot out, Hoshoryu's leg was already half under the dohyo line. Edited July 16, 2021 by Athenayama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, Ichimawashi said: 6 minutes ago, Godango said: I expected it to go Ichinojo's way, but I think the torinaoshi call was reasonable. I think when your opponent steps out of the dohyo and down to the floor and you see his foot halfway between the floor and the dohyo plane and falling, it really should be safe at that point to put your own foot down outside the dohyo. The judges did not agree with this. Perplexing. I think we've previously established a few basho ago that the "plane of the dohyo" is not a thing, at least not to the judges. If anything, this torinaoshi disestablishes that notion even more. Edited July 16, 2021 by Seiyashi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godango 956 Posted July 16, 2021 I've been meaning to ask this a few days now (and it's probably been addressed) -- is that Enho acting as tsukebito to Hakuho? If so, what the? This is unusual for a sekitori to do so, right? If not, who is that who has such a stunning likeness to Enho? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ichimawashi 573 Posted July 16, 2021 10 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: I think we've previously established a few basho ago that the "plane of the dohyo" is not a thing, at least not to the judges. If anything, this torinaoshi disestablishes that notion even more. Perhaps, but does anyone really believe that his other foot was sole-down at that point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godango 956 Posted July 16, 2021 11 minutes ago, Athenayama said: Hi sir I don't know which stream you are watching but on NHK's replay when Ichinojo stepped his foot out, Hoshoryu's leg was already half under the dohyo line. Hi! This is why I expected it to go his way, but it's not an unusual call as @Seiyashi said. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 Isegahama said that both were out at the same time, which is probably a function of not being able to disambiguate who was in control at the end of the bout - was it Ichinojo, or Hoshoryu trying the tsukiotoshi? Regarding the foot, Hoshoryu's right foot may have crossed the plane (and NHK explicitly noted this, but the judges made zero mention of it), and his left foot, while not full sole down, still had his heel in contact. It's not helped that the first contact with any surface was in fact Ichinojo because Hoshoryu had longer to fall. You'd think that if plane of the dohyo was a thing, the bout would definitely have gone against Hoshoryu, which just goes to show that at least for this iteration of judges, plane of the dohyo doesn't matter - only first to touch down is, and even that's not an absolute decider as to the outcome of the bout. 1 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 (edited) Wow. That was more of a fight than I expected Shodai to put up against Terunofuji, damn near upsetting him. Terunofuji landing in style right in front of his shisho too. And Terunofuji shows how to perform a doubtful oshidashi properly: I thought they touched out at the same time, but the slow motion shows Terunofuji (despite busted knees) stayed on one leg until he saw that Shodai touched down and out, then went off the dohyo himself. Edited July 16, 2021 by Seiyashi 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godango 956 Posted July 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: Isegahama said that both were out at the same time, which is probably a function of not being able to disambiguate who was in control at the end of the bout - was it Ichinojo, or Hoshoryu trying the tsukiotoshi? Regarding the foot, Hoshoryu's right foot may have crossed the plane (and NHK explicitly noted this, but the judges made zero mention of it), and his left foot, while not full sole down, still had his heel in contact. It's not helped that the first contact with any surface was in fact Ichinojo because Hoshoryu had longer to fall. You'd think that if plane of the dohyo was a thing, the bout would definitely have gone against Hoshoryu, which just goes to show that at least for this iteration of judges, plane of the dohyo doesn't matter - only first to touch down is, and even that's not an absolute decider as to the outcome of the bout. I agree with all of this, but I will add that I'm a firm believer that plane of the dohyo SHOULD matter. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nagora 88 Posted July 16, 2021 Shodai's going to have sore knees later. But, if he fought that well every day he'd be in the running. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ichimawashi 573 Posted July 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, Seiyashi said: Isegahama said that ... Thanks for this, on behalf of all who don't understand enough Japanese to follow. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 Just now, nagora said: Shodai's going to have sore knees later. But, if he fought that well every day he'd be in the running. Agreed. That was the most ozeki-like he's looked this basho, which is sad considering we're 13 days in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Morning 73 Posted July 16, 2021 27 minutes ago, Godango said: I agree with all of this, but I will add that I'm a firm believer that plane of the dohyo SHOULD matter. Plane of dohyo should be established, that would also be easier on rikishi's knees and co. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amamaniac 2,078 Posted July 16, 2021 29 minutes ago, nagora said: Shodai's going to have sore knees later. But, if he fought that well every day he'd be in the running. I'd say that Terunofuji's knees are going to be the sorer ones. Every time he has to jump off the ring (at the end of his bouts), his knees pay a huge price! But I definitely agree that Shodai put up a good fight and placed Terunofuji in jeopardy twice. Hakuho was watching ringside, and Shodai may well have given him some ideas... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eikokurai 3,433 Posted July 16, 2021 Has Kotonowaka earned himself a prize with his 10th win today? He was denied one when he last got 10-5. They wouldn’t do it twice, would they? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amamaniac 2,078 Posted July 16, 2021 3 hours ago, MrGrumpyGills said: Say, is that Gagamaru as a guest commentator on the Abema live stream? He slimmed down a LOT. Looking good! Indeed. He is back for his second stint this tournament. At least this time he was wearing proper pants and decent shirt. The Georgia/Japan flag pin was a nice touch. I bet his wife dressed him for this one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jakusotsu 5,761 Posted July 16, 2021 If Tamawashi and Kotonowaka didn't have the decency to win today, leading by four wins on day 13 would have been a first. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seiyashi 4,068 Posted July 16, 2021 20 minutes ago, Amamaniac said: 3 hours ago, MrGrumpyGills said: Say, is that Gagamaru as a guest commentator on the Abema live stream? He slimmed down a LOT. Looking good! Indeed. He is back for his second stint this tournament. At least this time he was wearing proper pants and decent shirt. The Georgia/Japan flag pin was a nice touch. I bet his wife dressed him for this one. A snap of him at work (properly social distanced with masks on this time): 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryafuji 806 Posted July 16, 2021 4 hours ago, Kaninoyama said: Blatant dame-oshi by Aoiyama there. Who does he think he is. Hakuho? One of the worst I've ever seen. Kaisei should have a word with him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
