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2021 "Kozumo" Hatsu Basho discussion thread

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We have a couple of brutal matchups early in tomorrow's top division line-up. Akua v Hidenoumi is a straightforward promotion/relegation play-off, and I'll take Hidenoumi to join his little brother in maku'uchi for March. I would have thought that Tokushoryu was just about safe with 3 wins, but the fact that he's been pitted against Daishomaru (J8 and 10-4) suggests otherwise.

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Awesome finish to the Kotonowaka / Yutakayama match. The former casually dodges the latter's attempted slap then casually one arm pushes him off the dohyo. Fabulous match.

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29 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

Incidentally, I posted that on day 8 of Kyushu 2019, after he'd beaten tomorrow's opponent Okinoumi.

Speaking of tomorrow's matchup, I tip my hat to Isegahama Oyakata and the torikumi committee.  Talk about the perfect final test (...available, that is.  What happened to the speculation that Hakuho would return and mix things up a little?).  While Okinoumi leads 10-8 in the previous record department, Daieisho has defeated Hakkaku's pride and joy four straight times now.  Five seems like a given.  But ..., 7-7 Okinoumi is going into that bout with his kachikoshi on the line.  He beat Takayasu on day 12, so he has the potential to crush all our certainty about the result.  I, for one, am not counting Okinoumi out, just yet.

And I tip my my hat to Eikokurai for seeing Daieisho's not-so-sudden bloom! (Applauding...)

Edited by Amamaniac
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7 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

We have a couple of brutal matchups early in tomorrow's top division line-up. Akua v Hidenoumi is a straightforward promotion/relegation play-off, and I'll take Hidenoumi to join his little brother in maku'uchi for March. I would have thought that Tokushoryu was just about safe with 3 wins, but the fact that he's been pitted against Daishomaru (J8 and 10-4) suggests otherwise.

I wonder how much of that is also trying to find an aite for Daishomaru. There are only 19 active rikishi in Juryo this time around and of the four he hasn't yet faced, two are not eligible because they're stablemates (Tsurugisho and Daiamami). The only one above him in Juryo he can fight is Azumaryu. Tohakuryu is the lowest-ranker so maybe too far down to put against a 10-4 J8.

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So they'll have to wait for the third Makuuchi bout to be finished before the plethora of play-off rounds for the lower divisions will commence. Akiseyama will be fast asleep when the award ceremonies are finally over. (Yawning...)

(only if Tsurugisho loses, of course)

Edited by Jakusotsu
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Agree fully with posters opining on how entertaining today’s bouts were. Standouts, from memory: Ura, Terunofuji, Terutsuyoshi, Kotonowaka, Takarafuji. Kiribayama / Midorifuji was great, too. What a fun rainy afternoon of beer and fights that was.

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Best single day of day of sumo in a fair while - lots of long bouts, lots of bouts on the belt, Kotonowaka's pushout of Yutakayama, Akiseyama's pushout of Tochinoshin (!), Takarafuji lifting Ichinojo off the ground (!!)(even momentarily) 90 seconds into their bout, an Utchari(!!!), Endo giving Mitakeumi a Yotsu lesson, then finally that crazy bout between Shodai and Terunofuji. Who says you need the Yokozuna to show up for it to be entertaining?

Edited by Morty
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10 minutes ago, Morty said:

Who says you need the Yokozuna to show up for it to be entertaining?

Another positive on this note: Two Ozeki and a Sekiwake will finish in double-digits and potentially Takayasu could make it four sanyaku finishing with 10+. The other sekiwake and komusubi managed KKs. Perhaps we don't give enough credit to, and underestimate the quality of, the non-Yokozuna too much.

Edited by Eikokurai
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1 hour ago, Eikokurai said:

I wonder how much of that is also trying to find an aite for Daishomaru. There are only 19 active rikishi in Juryo this time around and of the four he hasn't yet faced, two are not eligible because they're stablemates (Tsurugisho and Daiamami). The only one above him in Juryo he can fight is Azumaryu. Tohakuryu is the lowest-ranker so maybe too far down to put against a 10-4 J8.

Out of curiosity, does anyone know what the furthest distance between Makuuchi and Juryo opponents in a honbasho has been? Daishomaru (J8w) and Tokushoryu (M8e) are separated by 34 half-ranks on the banzuke. That must be up there.

Edit: I think Tokushoryu-Daishomaru must be the record, at least for the modern era, if this search is anything to go by. The only greater rank disparity I can count with confidence is from Jan 1928 when a J10e fought an M9w, but in fact that was only a difference of 28 half-ranks because of the smaller division sizes. In Jan 1933, a J11eBS fought an M7w for a difference of 40, but to be honest I'm not really sure what the 'BS' means or how to count the banzuke ranks.

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&rank1=J5-J14&rank2=M10-M1

Edited by Eikokurai
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Tsurugisho looked completely away today. Not sure he just wasn't expecting that furious tsuppari from Ryuko, who was already demoted, os just had his mind on the chanko. But he looked awful today. I hope Ura gets the yusho.

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14 minutes ago, Seregost said:

Tsurugisho looked completely away today. Not sure he just wasn't expecting that furious tsuppari from Ryuko, who was already demoted, os just had his mind on the chanko. But he looked awful today. I hope Ura gets the yusho.

If Tsurugisho loses tomorrow we won't know who's in the play-off until about 20 minutes after the start of the maku'uchi matches, which is when Daishomaru fights. If the play-off is needed, the top division will grind to a halt as two, three or four men battle for the yusho title. I'll be rooting for Hidenoumi btw. When he's on form you just have to scratch your head and wonder why such a big, strong and technically sound wrestler has been more or less stuck in juryo for four years.

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12 minutes ago, Yokozuna Hattorizakura said:

the db says tomorrow jokoryu will be facing 2-5 ms4 nakazono. what possible reason could they have for such a bizarre match up?

Well, he can't fight Ura, Hidenoumi or Churanoumi as they're stable mates and he's fought 14 of the other 15 available Juryo opponents already. That's probably part of it. Why that particular Makushita guy has been chosen for an 8th bout, I'm not sure.

Edited by Eikokurai

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Terutsuyoshi!! Injuured and all and he is still in tjere slugging it out, what a baller! My Working Man's hero Takarafuji was able to roll the boulder Ichinojo!

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Extra sanyaku slots ahoy. Daieisho should be at sekiwake in March but what about Takarafuji if he wins tomorrow? A 10-5 at m2 almost always results in a promotion to komusubi (at least) but is it "forcing" if there are already two men securely in place at the rank?

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7 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

Extra sanyaku slots ahoy. Daieisho should be at sekiwake in March but what about Takarafuji if he wins tomorrow? A 10-5 at m2 almost always results in a promotion to komusubi (at least) but is it "forcing" if there are already two men securely in place at the rank?

That's the same record Daieisho himself managed in November at M2w which was 'rewarded' only with a promotion to M1w. Takarafuji will get M1e in March I reckon, particularly as there aren't many other strong candidates for the joi this time around. Onosho at M3w aside, there isn't another KK until Meisei at M7e. They need someone to stay in the joi.

(Okinoumi at M5w could get KK but he needs to beat Daieisho to do it.)

Edited by Eikokurai
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5 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

That's the same record Daieisho himself managed in November at M2w which was 'rewarded' only with a promotion to M1w. Takarafuji will get M1e in March I reckon. 

Oh, how soon we forget! In my defence, I would like to point out that for some reason the Daieisho case does not show up on the db query

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14 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

He can’t get 33 wins this time. Best he can manage now is 32.

Yes - I think they'll make him get double digits in the next two basho. Something around 43+ wins in 4 basho. Takakeisho made 42 in 4 basho in sanyaku until promotion.

If I had the query-fu I would like to research the promotion criteria used for former repromotion to Ozeki (besides the direct 10 wins from S) (Injonokuchi...)

 

Edited by bettega

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14 minutes ago, bettega said:

Yes - I think they'll make him get double digits in the next two basho. Something around 43+ wins in 4 basho. Takakeisho made 42 in 4 basho in sanyaku until promotion.

I'm more optimistic that one more double-digit basho will be enough. He hasn't had a makekoshi since returning and along the way has taken a yusho in each of the top three divisions, lost only 23 bouts in 11 basho (and two missed) and managed 10+ wins in three of his four Makuuchi appearances, which included a yusho (albeit at M17) and a jun-yusho. He also has a proven ability at the highest level. The only concern the Kyokai may have is his health, but all of the aforementioned suggests it's not much of an issue anymore. Plus, I doubt the Kyokai really factors that in anyway. They're all about performances and results.

Edited by Eikokurai

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3 hours ago, Morty said:

Best single day of day of sumo in a fair while - Takarafuji lifting Ichinojo off the ground (!!)(even momentarily) 90 seconds into their bout

Almost exactly FIVE years ago to the day, inhashi posted that Takarafuji could benchpress 230kg and deadlift 300kg!  Amazing!!

 

Edited by sumojoann
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8 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Well, that was a fun way to start the day. Kotonowaka gets to double-digits with some fine stiff arming of Yutakayama, who fails again to cross the kachikoshi line.

An excellent tussle between Midorifuji and Kiribayama too, with Kiribiyama working hard to cancel out Midorofuji's offence until the gyoji paused it to tie a loose mawashi. I'm not sure either rikishi honoured the 'freeze in place' policy very well though! There was plenty of squirming and jostling for advantage during the break. The bout completely changed on the restart with Kiribayama finally going on the attack.

When I watched the match, I noticed that Midorifuji had a hold on the knot at the back of Kiribiyama's mawashi.  I looked to see if he would improve his grip to a spot on the belt -- he didn't.  Good sportsmanship.

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8 hours ago, robnplunder said:

Hoshryu started with 5 losses and won 9 in a row.  I have not seen such a turnaround before.  He must have found a new wonder drug, religion, motivation, sold his soul to the devil, ... Whatever it was, I want to know.  I can use it in my golf game.  

See if you can get Asashoryu to holler at you for the first five holes.

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1 hour ago, bettega said:

Yes - I think they'll make him get double digits in the next two basho. Something around 43+ wins in 4 basho. Takakeisho made 42 in 4 basho in sanyaku until promotion.

If he wins tomorrow and gets 10+ in March he's a stone cold fin certainty. Let's face it, 80% of Terunofuji (which is what we are getting and all we are ever likely to get) is better than all three of the current ozeki.

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5 hours ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

I would have thought that Tokushoryu was just about safe with 3 wins, but the fact that he's been pitted against Daishomaru (J8 and 10-4) suggests otherwise.

Juryo has been hit hard by COVID-19 absences, and there's a critical shortage of valid opponents down there; I think Daishomaru has already faced most or all of them. Daishomaru might be up just to have an opponent. I'd still encourage Tokushoryu to win that match, though -- 3-12 means nine places, which would mean M17 for him (plus or minus banzuke luck), and it's not safe to count on M17 existing next basho.

Edited by Sue
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Akiseyama crushes Tochinosion ?? !! Special prize if he beats Kagayaki tomorrow.. I hope.  Some fantastic matches today hoping for playoff. Daisho get Okinomi, I like it. Ternernofuji looks like an Ozeki. 

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