Non-K-November basho 2020 Discussion (spoiler space)

[Yamanashi 3,669]

13 minutes ago, Asojima said:

The banzuke requires 2 Ozekis.  Yokozunas are expendable.  Two or three reliable Ozekis will be needed before they can safely punch his ticket.  He may  be stuck where he is until he has a safe (or forced) exit from Ozeki.  A yokozuna can fill in as a yokozuna-ozeki, but this is not a desirable situation.

So if he gets a 14-1 Y or D, and a Yusho in January, they won't promote him because they need enough Ozeki?

[Asojima 2,870]

3 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:

So if he gets a 14-1 Y or D, and a Yusho in January, they won't promote him because they need enough Ozeki?

A double yusho would be a forced promotion.  Anything else becomes optional depending on the status of the rest of the Ozeki club.

[Asashosakari 18,644]

45 minutes ago, Asojima said:

A double yusho would be a forced promotion.  Anything else becomes optional depending on the status of the rest of the Ozeki club.

No, just no. This reminds me of those "Oh, but they won't want to promote the 11-4 komusubi into an extra sekiwake slot because there aren't two good candidates for komusubi if they do" arguments we used to get on occasion. There's absolutely no way they're going to worry about something comparatively trivial like what the ozeki rank looks like in deciding a yokozuna promotion. Important matters first, everything else can be dealt with afterwards.

Edit: I doubt the YDC in particular cares about the numerical make-up of the ozeki rank at all.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Asashosakari

[Asojima 2,870]

59 minutes ago, Asashosakari said:

There's absolutely no way they're going to worry about something comparatively trivial like what the ozeki rank looks like in deciding a yokozuna promotion. Important matters first....

Edit: I doubt the YDC in particular cares about the numerical make-up of the ozeki rank at all. 

If one or both of the kadoban ozekis go south in Hatsu and Terunofuji goes 8-7 or worse, the ozeki outlook will become non-trivial.  Does anyone still think the the YDC's opinion means anything.  Done.

[Jakusotsu 5,720]

1 hour ago, Asojima said:

If one or both of the kadoban ozekis go south in Hatsu and Terunofuji goes 8-7 or worse, the ozeki outlook will become non-trivial.  Does anyone still think the the YDC's opinion means anything.  Done.

Does the Ozeki outlook become any more trivial whether Takakeisho is called Yokozuna or Yokozuna-Ozeki?

[WAKATAKE 2,610]

Sansho:

Shukun-sho for Terunofuji (conditionally)

Kanto-sho for Chiyonokuni (conditionally)

Kanto-sho for Shimanoumi

Gino-sho for Terunofuji

[Jakusotsu 5,720]

20 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Takanosho hasn’t had much attention this basho, but he’s now secured a KK in his Sekiwake debut. Very nice indeed.

I just realized that Takanosho had one of (if not the) easiest Sekiwake debuts ever with his opponents being Sekiwake Mitakeumi, Komusubi Takayasu, and all of the rest Maegashira.

[Asashosakari 18,644]

1 hour ago, Asojima said:

If one or both of the kadoban ozekis go south in Hatsu and Terunofuji goes 8-7 or worse, the ozeki outlook will become non-trivial.  Does anyone still think the the YDC's opinion means anything.  Done.

The Kyokai sure does. Or do you seriously believe that if the YDC members were to be in favour of promoting Takakeisho on yusho + jun-yusho, Hakkaku-rijicho is going to take them aside to tell them, "Sorry, guys, can you help us out here, please? We need him as an ozeki"?

[WAKATAKE 2,610]

Ikioi and Takagenji will see 2021 as sekitori. Ura out of the possible Juryo playoff.

[Gurowake 3,872]

40 minutes ago, WAKATAKE said:

Sansho:

Shukun-sho for Terunofuji (conditionally)

Kanto-sho for Chiyonokuni (conditionally)

Kanto-sho for Shimanoumi

Gino-sho for Terunofuji

I don't see the usual tweet from the Kyokai that would be explicit as to the conditions (which is why I was pipped reporting this, since that what I was watching for!), but for Chiyonokuni he presumably just needs to win as there's little else he could do.  Terunofuji's is likely to require the Yusho, not just a win of the honwari match.  As much as the Shukun-sho was for a long time reserved for those that beat the tournament winner or even a Yokozuna who did decently well, it's generally a required sansho for anyone winning a Yusho ranked below Ozeki, something that's much more common recently than it used to be, and we've seen the Yusho condition a lot for the shukun-sho for rikishi with a chance of winning the Yusho going into the last day. 

Edited November 22, 2020 by Gurowake

[WAKATAKE 2,610]

The numbers dwindle! Jokoryu out of the (possible) playoff!

[Asashosakari 18,644]

7 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

I don't see the usual tweet from the Kyokai that would be explicit as to the conditions (which is why I was pipped reporting this, since that what I was watching for!), but for Chiyonokuni he presumably just needs to win as there's little else he could do.  Terunofuji's is likely to require the Yusho, not just a win of the honwari match.

Yes, Terunofuji's is conditional on the yusho according to Nikkan.

Well, that was quite the bust in the juryo yusho race. Midorifuji-Kyokushuho for the in-1-or-2 decision now just like makuuchi's.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Asashosakari

[Gurowake 3,872]

2 minutes ago, Asashosakari said:

Well, that was quite the bust in the juryo yusho race.

Juryo's gonna Juryo.  Makes up for last time when it was better than Makuuchi's, though that was just Chiyonokuni who's clearly going a ways further up.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Gurowake

[Eikokurai 3,433]

47 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

I just realized that Takanosho had one of (if not the) easiest Sekiwake debuts ever with his opponents being Sekiwake Mitakeumi, Komusubi Takayasu, and all of the rest Maegashira.

You’re right. That is kind of ... lame. Not even Terunofuji or Takakeisho. 

[Jakusotsu 5,720]

4 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

...or Takakeisho. 

well...

[WAKATAKE 2,610]

Well, 2 yusho by M17's in a year find its balance in the form of two full 0-15 by two different rikishi

[Amamaniac 2,078]

Midorifuuuuuuuuuuji!  Why?  Looks like we'll have a Juryo playoff.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Amamaniac

[Eikokurai 3,433]

2 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

well...

Oh yeah. Haha.

[WAKATAKE 2,610]

2 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

Midorifuuuuuuuuuuji!  Why?  Looks like we'll have a Juryo playoff.

The three guys that lost out must really be kicking themselves right now

[robnplunder 974]

Just now, Amamaniac said:

Midorifuuuuuuuuuuji!  Why?  Looks like we'll have a Juryo playoff.

Midorifuji will prevail.

This makes Ura's loss today painful. I was sure Ura will beat injury-laden Ikioi.

[Kashunowaka 300]

57 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

I just realized that Takanosho had one of (if not the) easiest Sekiwake debuts ever with his opponents being Sekiwake Mitakeumi, Komusubi Takayasu, and all of the rest Maegashira.

With the same logic, Takakeisho (if he wins) will have won one of the easiest yusho ever. However, you cannot fight someone who isn't there so we shouldn't hold that against him.

[Kaninoyama 1,649]

Midorifuji. Welcome to Makuuchi!

Edited November 22, 2020 by Kaninoyama

[Eikokurai 3,433]

That Jonidan yusho playoff was pretty good.

Midorifuji gets the Juryo yusho.

[robnplunder 974]

9 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Midorifuji. Welcome to Makuuchi!

Welcome back, Akiseyama!

[Eikokurai 3,433]

Very happy to see Chiyonokuni wind up his Makuuchi return with a win and a sansho. He really brings something a little different to the top division. 10-5 should see him up to around M7-M8 in January. 

Akua got a faceful of dirt! The price of victory.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Eikokurai