September (Aki) Basho- offical thread (yay..)

[rhyen 1,842]

1 hour ago, Seiyashi said:

You probably have Aminishiki to thank for that, since he's the one who established the "don't retire till too physically broken" mentality. Even Kyokutenho knew when to call it quits after double-digit losses.

 

[Akinomaki 40,666]

13 minutes ago, Houmanumi said:

No chance they'd turn down the yen that a large, high-profile retirement like Kotoshogiku would bring in, regardless of his rank at retirement.

The retirement ceremony, the intai-zumo for a high profile rikishi is an event organized and financed by the retired rikishi himself, and he gets the profit from it - or has to pay the loss from his own reserves. In Corona times, no rikishi can afford to have an intai-zumo danpatsu-shiki, with that poor attendance.

[Godango 1,001]

19 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

The retirement ceremony, the intai-zumo for a high profile rikishi is an event organized and financed by the retired rikishi himself, and he gets the profit from it - or has to pay the loss from his own reserves. In Corona times, no rikishi can afford to have an intai-zumo danpatsu-shiki, with that poor attendance.

Ah, touché.

[Otokonoyama 2,735]

31 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

The retirement ceremony, the intai-zumo for a high profile rikishi is an event organized and financed by the retired rikishi himself, and he gets the profit from it - or has to pay the loss from his own reserves. In Corona times, no rikishi can afford to have an intai-zumo danpatsu-shiki, with that poor attendance.

Exactly so, and in days gone by The Geek might have made a tidy bundle upon his retirement (in addition to whatever withheld kensho monies and NSK gratuities received). Now that there is no return to those days (for him nor us), all he can do is hang on and pine for better days. The best he could ever hope for is half the crowd as a usual high-profile intai event, more like a quarter of the usual crowd and perhaps none at all. The others in the queue face the same dilemma.

[ryafuji 815]

I understand Giku wanting a full arena for a danpatsu-shiki, but he doesn't have to remain active for that. He could retire and just postpone it. Time was it was (almost) unthinkable for a former ozeki to compete in juryo, but that seems to have gone now. I don't think he has any chance of getting back in makuuchi even if this latest injury heals. 

[Kintamayama 45,345]

Shoudai’s Ozeki promotion ceremony is slated to be broadcast live on the Kyokai's official YouTube channel. Don't know the time, but that's that.

[Kintamayama 45,345]

Tokitsukaze Oyakata has come down with acute pancreatitis and will undergo surgery. This means he will miss Shoudai's  Ozeki promotion ceremony . Edagawa Oyakata (ex-Aogiyama) will take his place , together with the Okamisan. He was nauseous this morning, underwent checkups and was diagnosed. He was kyujo from last basho for breaking the virus rules, but was allowed to take part in the ceremony. And now this.

 

 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Kintamayama

[Katooshu 3,265]

Giku got a makuuchi KK as recently as July....I don't see the need at this point to be too disappointed that he's continuing, or worse yet have him pressured to retire. He'll be down to juryo, where a lot of guys have never even made makuuchi or had a KK there. 

If someone is so faded that they can hardly do anything on the dohyo, they'll be out of the paid ranks soon enough, and will plummet in the rankings further if they can't put the wins together. 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Katooshu

[just_some_guy 281]

58 minutes ago, Katooshu said:

Giku got a makuuchi KK as recently as July....

 

An 8-7 that followed six consecutive MK basho.

Unless his injuries heal significantly (and soon), the best I think he can hope for is to win enough that his slide down the banzuke continues to be a slow one. Obviously it's his life and his decision, but without much to look forward to it's understandable that many think he'd do well to walk away while he's still in the top division.

[Katooshu 3,265]

True, with 7-8s before that and an MK streak that started up at M1. I just don't think a guy who could manage a winning record in makuuchi as recently as July is someone who needs to be dragged off the dohyo yet for the sake of the sport. If he's really so bad that he is making sumo less enjoyable to watch, as was mentioned, he'll drop out of the paid ranks soon enough anyway, below all the sekitori who can't even make or KK once in makuuchi, and then below all the competitors not good enough to ever make the paid ranks. Maybe they can be culled too....

Of course if he calls it a day now, that's cool too--we could all understand his choice--but to act like he's making the sport worse and/or needs to be pressured out is something I don't agree with at all, and the ranking system will quickly send him out of public view for the most part if he really is that bad now.

Edited September 29, 2020 by Katooshu

[Yamanashi 3,874]

52 minutes ago, just_some_guy said:

An 8-7 that followed six consecutive MK basho.

Unless his injuries heal significantly (and soon), the best I think he can hope for is to win enough that his slide down the banzuke continues to be a slow one. Obviously it's his life and his decision, but without much to look forward to it's understandable that many think he'd do well to walk away while he's still in the top division.

Everyone is different.  There are those (probably not Kotoshogiku) who see a drop to Juryo as at least a couple more paychecks before you make that irrevocable step and retire.  Considering the career record (96 basho as a sekitori, one-third of those as Ozeki!), his deferred salary and other payments should be substantial.  I'd think he would want to step into his Oyakata shoes ASAP, but maybe he wants to savor this a little longer.

[Kaninoyama 1,798]

1 hour ago, Yamanashi said:

Everyone is different.  There are those (probably not Kotoshogiku) who see a drop to Juryo as at least a couple more paychecks before you make that irrevocable step and retire.  Considering the career record (96 basho as a sekitori, one-third of those as Ozeki!), his deferred salary and other payments should be substantial.  I'd think he would want to step into his Oyakata shoes ASAP, but maybe he wants to savor this a little longer.

This. I think the man just loves sumo, knows the end is near, and just wants to continue doing it for as long as he can. And that he's earned the right to do so. 

[Katsunorifuji 65]

2 hours ago, Katooshu said:

True, with 7-8s before that and an MK streak that started up at M1. I just don't think a guy who could manage a winning record in makuuchi as recently as July is someone who needs to be dragged off the dohyo yet for the sake of the sport. If he's really so bad that he is making sumo less enjoyable to watch, as was mentioned, he'll drop out of the paid ranks soon enough anyway, below all the sekitori who can't even make or KK once in makuuchi, and then below all the competitors not good enough to ever make the paid ranks. Maybe they can be culled too....

Of course if he calls it a day now, that's cool too--we could all understand his choice--but to act like he's making the sport worse and/or needs to be pressured out is something I don't agree with at all, and the ranking system will quickly send him out of public view for the most part if he really is that bad now.

This echos my thoughts exactly. If you can’t compete at the top levels of sumo then sumo will shuffle you out as quickly as needed. You can’t really hang out in in the top ranks past your prime because because the way sumo is set up just won’t allow it. 
 

If Kotoshogiku wants to give it one last shot it’s hard to blame him. Once you retire your out and you don’t get to change your mind. Maybe he feels he can still make one last push into the maegashira ranks. Or maybe he just wants to enjoy one last basho. Either way it’s his choice and if he can’t compete at this level then and he keeps trying he’ll get pushed further and further down until it’s no longer with his time. 

[jsolo 106]

https://jbssumo.blogspot.com/2020/03/results-from-haru-spring-2020.html

Complete 2020 Aki (September Basho Blog).

Contents (most of these are links--I have aggregated what I couldn't find already aggregated. Most of my aggregations are for the Aki "team" rather than individual Rikishi. 

=========

Introduction

Complete roster (linked Rikishi, Country/Prefect of Origin, Stable--also CURRENT height and weight information).

Links to preview articles and videos

Daily Reports (From Day 15 to Day 1)

Condensed results (winner, loser, ranks, finishing moves, time of match). For Days 12-15, the Championship "race in miniature"

Top Rank 

Kachi-Koshi/Make-Koshi listings, in order of when they got to  KK/MK. Beginning Day 10. 

Complete cumulative Basho Kimarite sorts, daily and Cumulative day by day.  Kimarite's on the cumulative tables are linked to NHK video demonstrations of the moves.

Time of Match Breakdowns (daily and cumulative day by day. Total time, longest match, shortest match, average time. 10 second aggregations (0-9.9; 10-19.9, etc.)

Top Rank, Rookie, and Jurio substitute wins, cumulative, day by day. For Day 15: aggregated records of Jurio substitutes, Maegashira v san;yaku.(Rikishi by Rikishi).

=========

Daily results lists (Sumo Reference Daily, Basho Win-Loss Matrix, Japanese Sumo Association, Japan Times Daily results for every day on one page). Daily match times from (nikkansports.com), Absent Rikishi information. day by day at one link. (JSA)-. list of Rikishi that did not participate in part or all of Basho--by rank).

Daily Articles 

tachai.org daily previews, recaps, selected bouts from the lower divisions--note that these reports link to match videos of over 100 lower division matches, including the Yusho clinching matches in every division (which I have pulled out and linked to separately, as well as my personal favorite Hattorizakura's (Jk32w) 200th and 202nd loss.    

Japan Times Bosho Reports

Photos (From the great work of Sumoforum.net and nikkansports.com. Literally hundreds of photos.

Videos

Daily NHK 27 minute "highlights" (which are actually the condensed, complete matches--English commentary). The only non-copyright violation source I know that provides this. Also 50 minute summaries from Day 1 and 8. Note that these will only be available for a short period of time after the end of the Basho. Two weeks was what it was for March and July.

Chris Sumo Youtube daily reports (3-7 minutes each). He has high definition videos of selected matches produced from the arena.

=======

I know that most or all of you are aware of the sources I use. This blog was intended for less experienced English speaking 
fans. But I think it might be useful as a "one stop shop" for a great deal of the record of this Basho. And I hope that you find the statistical aggregations I did useful and/or entertaining.

There may be errors, I did use checksums and other methods to check my daily cumulative tables. Please let me know of any errors you may find so I can correct them. Any other feedback is always welcome, but know that I am a content guy (retired data librarian), not a fancy picture guy. I point to the fancy pictures.

I follow this board closely as it helps me to learn a lot about context, history, strategy, tactics, and the basic ins and outs of the sport. This is my way of thanking you for all you have done to increase my knowledge and appreciation of this magnificent sport. My high point for this Basho was being able to watch Shenshuraku on a live feed. What an experience!!!!

Below the September Basho are reports for the July and March Basho. March was when I got serious about this sport.

Enjoy

https://jbssumo.blogspot.com/2020/03/results-from-haru-spring-2020.html

[code_number3 708]

13 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

Shoudai’s Ozeki promotion ceremony is slated to be broadcast live on the Kyokai's official YouTube channel. Don't know the time, but that's that.

 

[sahaven111 176]

4 hours ago, Katsunorifuji said:

You can’t really hang out in in the top ranks past your prime because because the way sumo is set up just won’t allow it. 

I know two Mongolians that could tell you a little something about that...

[Gurowake 4,088]

19 hours ago, pricklypomegranate said:

Kyokutenho, please tell me your secrets. 

He gave up easily at the edge.  He didn't fight hard for wins that might leave him falling awkwardly if he couldn't manage it - he just stepped backwards out of the ring once he was in a bad position.  His reward was that he was never injured.  The only bouts he missed in his career was (1) when he was suspended for driving, (2) one full basho out in Jonidan (his 3rd overall past Mz), and (3) one fusen loss in Jonidan two basho later (I don't know the stories of the latter two).  That he could give up so easily and remain in Makuuchi for as long as he did shows just how good he was, and at the same time explains why he never was even close to being an Ozeki candidate despite having to have serious skill to remain in the top division as old and timid as he was; he was good enough to get wins over lesser rikishi, but wasn't willing to fight hard for wins against rikishi any bit better than him.

Now how Tamawashi has managed to go his entire career without missing a bout while being an oshi-style rikishi is a totally different question.  Ikioi hasn't either, but he's been clearly hurt plenty of times.  Tamawashi just has normally been his usual mediocre self the entire time, and surged to become a sanyaku regular fairly late in his career (which is evidence to me that the quality of the average rikishi in the top division has gone way down from the prime days of the Mongolian Yokozunae).

Edited September 30, 2020 by Gurowake

[Gurowake 4,088]

I was looking at the Kabu list in the database sorted by age, and starting next year, there are going to be the kabu from the first of the rehired "consultants" that will becoming available.  I can imagine that the current oyakata using the kabu owned by Ikioi and Kotoshogiku have requested that they hold on until one of those become available.  I imagine Toyohibiki (anyone remember him? Current leader in Makuuchi basho without sanyaku experience, both among active rikishi and tied all time) is still slugging it out in Makushita with little hope of returning to sekitori status because he's expecting to get one of those as well.

[Amamaniac 2,079]

I've been rewatching NHK's broadcasts of the Autumn Tournament, and have noticed that more than a few times, yobidashi can be seen pouring power water on the dohyo for rikishi to dampen their feet.  Still not exactly sure what the real purpose is, but I suspect it has something to do with traction (counterintuitive to my mind).

It has come up in the past (say, year or two regarding Hakuho's apparent "toe dipping"), but now I am wondering if this is a relatively new phenomenon.  Perhaps some of the members who have been following sumo longer than I have can chime in if they noticed it back in ... Chiyonofuji's days (or even was it a thing in Takanohana's days?).  

[Kintamayama 45,345]

When was the last time someone won the Juryo title with a three win advantage?

[Jakusotsu 5,995]

33 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

When was the last time someone won the Juryo title with a three win advantage?

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Banzuke.aspx?b=201901

[Sakura 1,489]

9 hours ago, Gurowake said:

I was looking at the Kabu list in the database sorted by age, and starting next year, there are going to be the kabu from the first of the rehired "consultants" that will becoming available.  I can imagine that the current oyakata using the kabu owned by Ikioi and Kotoshogiku have requested that they hold on until one of those become available.  I imagine Toyohibiki (anyone remember him? Current leader in Makuuchi basho without sanyaku experience, both among active rikishi and tied all time) is still slugging it out in Makushita with little hope of returning to sekitori status because he's expecting to get one of those as well.

No one is borrowing Kotoshogiku's at the moment. Bushuyama, who is borrowing Ikioi's is the oldest of the borrowers. I also wonder about Takayasu. Will he be the only Ozeki without a yusho or a kabu? 

[robnplunder 975]

20 hours ago, Katooshu said:

Of course if he calls it a day now, that's cool too--we could all understand his choice--but to act like he's making the sport worse and/or needs to be pressured out is something I don't agree with at all, and the ranking system will quickly send him out of public view for the most part if he really is that bad now.

Agree.  Let him finish his sumo career on his own term.   

[Akinomaki 40,666]

On 29/09/2020 at 00:26, Kintamayama said:

The YDC convened today after an eight-month hiatus and had harsh words for the kyujo Yokozunae, especially for Kakuryuu who has been kyujo in five of the last six bashos. Some members demanded issuing a formal warning to him but they stopped short of that and harsh words were heard. His Oyakata Michinoku has publicly stated that the next basho will be a do or die basho for him.  Hakuhou has missed 11 of the last 18 basho -five of them from day one, but of the 7 bashos he did enter, he had 5 yushos.  "We will be watching them closely. We want them to live up to their responsibilities  as the top rikishi. Looking back at the last couple of years there have been intermittent kyujos. Some severe opinions were voiced., " said Sano the chairman. "We want them to uphold the dignity and status of the rank. Even if they go kyujo , they need to safeguard their status as Yokozunae - that is the essence of sumo -it's a special status. It's not only a privilege, but it comes with a responsibility as well. They should remember that they are above all other rikishi and they need to know that they should restrain themselves accordingly" added Mr. Sano. They have let it be known that after the next basho in which the Yokozunae will enter they may issue warnings against one or both of them if they don't see any changes.

While some on the forum tend to agree with the harsh words by the YDC, apparently more and more Japanese fans, including prominent journalist Shoko Egawa 江川紹子, want to have the council go into kyujo indefinitely and get rid of that institution. Takanohana had 7 full kyujo in a row, Kisenosato after 8 kyujo basho just got an encouragement, and the 2 yokozuna who finished 1st and 2nd only in March get threatened with warnings and more.

The YDC started in 1950, at the time 3 yokozuna went kyujo in the basho, 1 had just retired. The article cites one influential sumo reporter of the time, in that pressure from the sumo press club made the NSK form that council, and the reporters designed the rules. It is out of date by now and said to ruin the image of the yokozuna in the public, shortening yokozuna careers.

One rule states that also in case of continued kyujo, depending on the details of the injury and after deliberation, if there is the chance of recovery, they should let a yokozuna devote himself to medical treatment.

http://www.jprime.jp/articles/-/19012

[jsolo 106]

I have added a "Basho results by stable" and several links to Chris Sumo's ongoing videos pertaining to individual Rikishi at my 2020 Aki Report Blog. The stable report is at the top of the blog. For the recently released video links, scroll down to "updates".

Enjoy

https://jbssumo.blogspot.com/2020/03/results-from-haru-spring-2020.html