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Achiyama

2020 Nagoya - THE UNDERDOG GAME (TUG) - ENTRY, TORIKUMI, STANDINGS

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Day 8: Kotoshougiku, back-up: Enhou

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Kyoju's picks for Day 8

Main pick: Kotoshogiku

Back up: Terunofuji

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Posted (edited)

Hello TUG fans!

I am very sorry that I have posted a wrong Torikumi for Nakabi, which was not wrong when I created it.

I fixed the Entry Form: which is the same as above.

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/KGJNB97

I just found out about the problem.

Thanks for all of you who posted your picks here in the Sumoforum.

If you don't want to change the picks don't bother to submit a new Entry Form.

If you do change the form. I will:

1.) Go to the Survey Monkey and consider your picks from there. If there are more then 1 (one) Submittal, the latest will count.

2.) If I don't find your name there, I'll check the picks posted in Sumoforum.

3.) If I can't find your name then will discuss it case by case.

4.) If more than 50% of the registered Gamers could not submit their picks, I'll consider annulment of Day 8.

Question: In the future, to avoid this happening again (change of the official Torukumi while I am sleeping) would you mind me posting the TUG Torikumi early in the morning (say 8:00 a.m. Pacific Time)?

Because of the time difference, please, let me know whether it will be convenient for you. Thanks! 

Best Regards,

Achiyama, TUG Rijicho

GOOD LUCK on NAKABI!

Edited by Achiyama
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As of July 25 2020  8:50 PM  PDT I have received the picks from 23 Gamers (from Sumoforum, Survey Monkey and Jakusotsu (via PM):

# Gamer
1 Achiyama
2 Jejima
3 Shimodahito
4 Katunazuma
5 Pitinosato
6 RaeucherLax
7 Mmikasazuma
8 Philioyamfuji
9 Jakusotsu
10 Joaoiyama
11 Kishikaisei
12 Flohru
13 ScreechingOwl
14 Chishafuwaku
15 Benihana
16 Sakura
17 Andrasoyamawaka
18 Athenayama
19 Atenzan
20 Sawamura
21 Kyoju
22 Reijinguoshan
23 Wakatake
24  
25  
26  
27  
28  
29  
30  
31  
32  

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3 hours ago, Achiyama said:

4.) If more than 50% of the registered Gamers could not submit their picks, I'll consider annulment of Day 8.

Though I managed to make my picks, I would suggest annulment. If I see correctly, you have posted the updated link at 4 a.m. Central European Time on a Sunday with only a couple of hours until the deadline. This seems a bit unfair to everyone in this time zone(s), especially those without small kids that would wake him/her anyway. :)

 

3 hours ago, Achiyama said:

Question: In the future, to avoid this happening again (change of the official Torukumi while I am sleeping) would you mind me posting the TUG Torikumi early in the morning (say 8:00 a.m. Pacific Time)?

Because of the time difference, please, let me know whether it will be convenient for you. Thanks! 

Out of experience: When you have occasionally posted the torikumi at that time (which means late afternoon/evening CET) in the past, I forgot making my picks in about 50 % of the cases as this is not my regular "sumo time" and I make my other game picks earlier. Thus I guess I would have to stop playing TUG. As late torikumi changes are very rare and this was, I think, the first time in TUG history that we had this problem, I would vote for not changing anything. Thanks for all your efforts!

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Posted (edited)

ANNOUNCEMENT

Dear TUG Supporters and Fans,

I thought a lot. Having into consideration Flohru's frank input (thank you Florian), I decided to ANNULE all TUG results for Nakabi (Day 8).

Profomisakari, Holleshoryu and Gaijingai, three veterans who are participating in TUG since its inauguration during 2015 Hatsu Basho and whom I respect enormously for their continuous support of TUG, were not able to submit their picks.

The main reason to annule Nakabi results is because I feel guilty that I didn't check Sumoforum early this morning when I woke up and fixed the Entry Form too late in the afternoon.

Sorry for any inconveniences!

Achiyama,

TUG Rijicho

Edited by Achiyama
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Here is the TUG Torikumi for Day 9:

The link with the Entry Form for Day 9 will be posted on the next thread.  

Those of you, who elected to receive their daily Entry Forms in an e-mail, fill the form from there. 

14 -- Okinoumi (vs. Asanoyama)
  7 -- Takanosho (vs. Endo)
14 -- Onosho (vs. Yutakayama)
18 -- Kiribayama (vs. Mitakeumi)
19 -- Kagayaki (vs. Shodai)
32 -- Aoiyama (vs. Hakuho)
20 -- Hokutofuji (vs. Daieisho)
29 -- Enho (vs. Takakeisho)
17 -- Tokushoryu (vs. Takarafuji)
  9 -- Chiyotairyu (vs. Ryuden)
14 -- Kaisei (vs. Terutsuyoshi)
15 -- Tochinoshin (vs. Ishiura)
18 -- Kotoshogiku (vs. Tamawashi)
15 -- Wakatakakage (vs. Shimanoumi)
19 -- Kotoshoho (vs. Ikioi)
10 -- Chiyomaru (vs. Takayasu)
15 -- Nishikigi (vs. Shohozan)
20 -- Kotoeko (vs. Myogiryu)
18 -- Terunofuji (vs. Sadanoumi)
15 -- Daiamami (vs. Kotoyuki)

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ANNOUNCEMENT

Dear TUG Supporters and Fans,

I need your help!

It turned out that 21 (72.4%) Gamers had scored on Nakabi. If an Annulment is enforced than it won't be fair for 21 Gamers who found a way to submit their picks. I'd like fairness to everybody!

So, I'd like to hear from everybody, what should I do:

1.) Keep the Annulment, or

2.) Remove the Annulment

Please, send me your feedback and your vote. I'll appreciate it. You can post it here, or send it in an e-mail or PM.

Here is the Table with the picks, which I have received.

Day 8
# Gamer Main pick Back-up pick
1 Achiyama Kotoshoho Aoiyama
2 Jejima Kagayaki Kotoyuki
3 Shimodahito Takanosho Enho
4 Katunazuma Kotoyuki Aoiyama
5 Pitinosato Wakatakakage Kotoeko
6 RaeucherLax Hokutofuji Kotonowaka
7 Mmikasazuma Kotonowaka Wakatakakage
8 Philioyamfuji Aoiyama Kagayaki
9 Jakusotsu Terunofuji Kotoeko
10 Joaoiyama Kotoshoho Wakatakakage
11 Kishikaisei Kotoshoho Kotoeko
12 Flohru Kotoshogiku Tamawashi
13 ScreechingOwl Kotoshogiku Shimanoumi
14 Chishafuwaku Tamawashi Endo
15 Benihana Kotoshogiku  
16 Sakura Kotoshogiku Tamawashi
17 Andrasoyamawaka Kotoshogiku Terunofuji
18 Athenayama Hokutofuji Kotoshoho
19 Atenzan Kotoshogiku Enho
20 Sawamura Kotoshoho Terunofuji
21 Kyoju Kotoshogiku Terunofuji
22 Reijinguoshan Kotoshogiku Hokutofuji
23 Wakatake Terunofuji Kotonowaka
24 Wolfgangho Kotoshogiku Kotoyuki
25 Oshirokita Hokutofuji Endo
26 Andonishiki Hokutofuji Kotoshoho
27 Bolo Shimanoumi Tamawashi
28 Fujisan Kotoshoho Enho
29 Karasukurai Terunofuji Ryuden
30 Profomisakari    
31 Holleshoryu    
32 Gaijingai    

 

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It was a rare situation, so I am okay however you choose to rule it. However, I have the advantage of a favorable time zone and a lucky guess on Day 8. If anyone missed the entry because of the torikumi change and wishes it to be annulled, then I say annul it to keep everyone even. Since I have a leading score, I would not want to pad my lead when other players may not have had the opportunity to do keep up. It is a game.

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11 minutes ago, Oshirokita said:

 

Seconded

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I agree with the my betters above, annulling, is your call. If you do annul can we all have a  fusensho  win for KK/MK reasons? :-D (Just asking 'cos I need a win!). Today was a rare event and I don't see the need to alter the way or time you do the picks. Just continue to do them when you can. At the end of the day it's a game and it's a bit of fun. Today was weird, no reason to fix something that isn't really broken. Thanks for your time.

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Like Oshorokita and Karasakurai, I think this a rare situation and I will be OK with your decision.

Also, I don't think you need to change the rules. Living in Europe, I am often one of the "victims" of late kyujo (and I wish some games would alter their rules to take this into consideration), but this case is different as the official torikumi for the day was readily available on Saturday and I could use it to determine my picks.

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Posted (edited)

I think let the results stand, and no need to annul anything.  I picked using the existing entry form, but checked to see which matches were 'real' before picking. My time zone (UK) means that I would have been asleep if the entry was updated later - so I did my best to enter before that. 

Other players put their entries in this thread, which can also be used.

So, we (myself, and the other players who managed to make an entry) went the extra mile to enter the game. I don't think that we should be penalised for this.

It is such a rare occurrence, that those who live in unfortunate time zones should be able to live with it. Can you?

Edit: As Tameiki mentions above, in the Europe time zone, we are often penalised with late kyujos - but we live with it. I think those in the 'wrong' time zone this time, should be able to live with it too.

 

Edited by Jejima

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I'm also fine with either decision you make, Achiyama. It seems that only three players did not make their picks and, to answer Jejima's rhetoric question, I doubt that they would really care if you keep the results. Personally, I am surprised that anyone would feel "penalised", let alone act as emotionally as wolfgangho did, if a day is annulled in this circumstances, but it seems to be the case.

And no need at all to feel guilty, Achiyama, we all appreciate your efforts in manually administrating this game!

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Well, I woke up at 05:00 AM ( in France and that was the only reason I woke up) to be able to submit my pick. And it seems I got a big score !
That being said, I let the administrator take the final decision.  Whatever your decision, dear Achiyama, I'll be fine with it. It's just a game afterall and I'll keep on playing it without hard feelings. I know I let all the burden on your shoulders but that's how I feel. I'll really be fine with any decision. :-D

Stay all safe ! That's the most important thing of all.

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no preference, i'm at the bottom of the points board regardless of the path you choose.

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I made an Entry (after checking if the bout I choose is also in the new torikumi), so other players could have done like Jejima or me did. To chose one of the Bouts who were in the old AND in the new torikumi. 

I would have scored some points, but I don't think that an annulement would be absolutely fair to those players who didn't realize the torikumi change, or couldn't find "their" bout from the new torikumi in the old torikumi. But on the other hand you would take points off from players who deserved this points.

I think there is no perfect solution. No matter which decision you make, there are always players who could say that this is not absolutely fair.

But this is only a game. And only 1 of 15 days. And we do not score on every 15 days. So the impact of your decision is not that big.

I would vote for an annulement of this day.

But I would be also fine with you scoring Day 8

Peter

 

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Unfortunately there is no way in this situation that everyone can be treated "fairly". I selected a winner on day 8, but I'm generally at a time zone disadvantage and know I always feel there is a certain "unfairness" when people win over me in SG or Toto based only on their ability to catch a late kyujo. I would be fine with nakabi not counting.

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