Kintamayama

This IS the July 2020 Basho thread!! Spoilers!!

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35 minutes ago, Wasabeefu said:

Tochinoshin and Takayasu look like they are just hanging on to a downward slide based on their old size/strength-based tactics

I must admit I perked up on days 5 and 6 when Toch pulled a tsukiotoshi and uwatenage back-to-back; good to try something unexpected.  But no way to try an arm throw when locked up with Terunofuji!

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Loved the Terunofuji-Tochinoshin match, looked like they could both pick each other up for just a second! Congrats to Kotoshogiku and Tamawashi getting their kachi koshi today too.

It's been an exciting basho so far, almost makes up for my decision to pick Abi, Yutakayama, AND Onosho for fantasy sumo this basho :(

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9 hours ago, robnplunder said:

Wow, a blow out win by Enho against Takanosho.  I didn't see that coming.   I just assumed Takanosho would manhandle Enho.  Bravo!

I think I jinxed Takanosho the other day, when he was on a 4-bout winning streak:

On 26/07/2020 at 14:09, Kashunowaka said:

Let's talk about Takanosho! First time in the meat-grinder, has now faced 6 of the 8 ranked above him (only Endo tomorrow and Okinoumi left) and is 5-3. I think he is doing extremely well.

Since then he has lost three in a row. (Shakinghead...)

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53 minutes ago, Wasabeefu said:

I'm a bit surprised to not see (m)any comments here about the Tochinoshin-Terunofuji bout.

You're right, it was a bout to be highlighted and was an interesting comparison between two guys who've had similar issues.

I've loved Tochi these past few years but during some recent basho it's almost hurt me to see him struggle. So, I've been relieved to see him string some good wins together now, it gives me hope that he can prolong his career a bit longer, albeit at mid to low Maegashira.

As for Terunofuji, he's already shown that he's better than low Maegashira; the question is, how will he perform against the top guys? Can he get back to a point where he can hover consistently around M5 to Komusubi? I'd like to see him prolong his career here or even higher.  My feeling is that he has better technique than Tochi so will be able to adjust to the limitations of his body. I was never a Terunofuji fan but I've found myself being extremely happy seeing him smash, Hulk-like-, through the lower divisions. Whatever happens, he's been an inspiration.

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I get the impression Terunofuji was really reviled back when he was an ozeki, especially after his little henka on Kotoshogiku. Has that opinion of him changed ever since his Cinderella comeback story? His story has parallels with Konishiki, who got embroiled in the whole gaijin yokozuna debacle while he was ozeki, but got more popular after his demotion to maegashira for his fighting spirit.

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Is it just me or do the gyoji and shimpan give less than a ..... about both hands down before the tachiai this basho ? 

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37 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Has that opinion of him changed ever since his Cinderella comeback story? 

No.

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TochiXTeru; 4 legs, 2 knees. Great yutso bout no matter what.

MitakeumiXTakakeisho. Wtf? I mean...They think we are morons or what? Ridiculous.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

And this just in courtesy of Herutto - Nishikido oyakata says that if Terunofuji beats Tamawashi, it's sanyaku next for him.

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/202007290000875.html

The only problem I see with that is that the torikumi for day 13 will be released well before the Tamawashi-Terunofuji bout. Unless they decide to play it like the senshuraku torikumi, time-wise.

Edited by Kintamayama

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3 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

I get the impression Terunofuji was really reviled back when he was an ozeki, especially after his little henka on Kotoshogiku. Has that opinion of him changed ever since his Cinderella comeback story? His story has parallels with Konishiki, who got embroiled in the whole gaijin yokozuna debacle while he was ozeki, but got more popular after his demotion to maegashira for his fighting spirit.

Well, were people in Japan also criticizing him for the henka or was it just on this forum? And btw, there was nothing wrong with what he did and shouldn't be criticized. Not his fault Koto lost 6 times...

 

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6 hours ago, Wasabeefu said:

A few random thoughts...

I'm a bit surprised to not see (m)any comments here about the Tochinoshin-Terunofuji bout. I thought it was a great "power sumo" match, but it is still surreal to me to see these two former Ozeki so low on the banzuke. Really nice to Terunofuji battle back. Also impressive is to see Kotoshogiku getting the kk. Say what you will about him, while Tochinoshin and Takayasu look like they are just hanging on to a downward slide based on their old size/strength-based tactics, my respect is up for Kotoshogiku seeming to reinvent himself. I can't remember the last time I saw him try to hump his opponent out of the ring, and he is somehow succeeding with a new straight-legged non-tachiai stance.

And today's questionable match included, Mitakeumi has looked a lot more like an Ozeki this basho than Takakeisho.

During his kachikoshi interview, he specifically said that he was reinventing himself, and would continue to try anything and everything to keep improving and prolong his career. 

 

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Well, if Terunofuji keeps winning then he may get some Ozeki and Yokozuna action with Takakeisho going Kyujo.

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2 hours ago, Asapedroryu said:

Well, were people in Japan also criticizing him for the henka or was it just on this forum? And btw, there was nothing wrong with what he did and shouldn't be criticized. Not his fault Koto lost 6 times...

 

He was jeered by the crowd with taunts such as "go back to Mongolia", which led to the Kyokai being questioned by the Japanese government, so safe to say it wasn't just this forum. 
 

 

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9 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

He was jeered by the crowd with taunts such as "go back to Mongolia", which led to the Kyokai being questioned by the Japanese government, so safe to say it wasn't just this forum. 
 

 

Do you think people are still going to hold this against him after all this time?

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Posted (edited)

He would get big cheers when appearing for his lower division matches on his way back to makuuchi. He's had an inspiring comeback from nearly the bottom of the banzuke, and I imagine with that, and simply the passing of time, animosity towards him has cooled considerably.

A few henkas and his trademark angry face might change that though! Imagine if that's how he beats Asanoyama in a playoff for the cup...

Edited by Katooshu
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Well, Hakuho vs Asanoyama on senshuraku’s musubi no ichiban. And if Hakuho, Asanoyama, and Terunofuji win today, will they facing each other on day 13-15?

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29 minutes ago, sumojoann said:

Do you think people are still going to hold this against him after all this time?

The crowd at the Kokugikan this basho appear to be fully supportive with rousing cheers each time he mounts the dohyo. 

Most people appreciate a great comeback story, which this surely is. 

I can also say from personal experience having watched him train up close in Niigata for several years that he's always been quite friendly with the local fans. 

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8 hours ago, Seiyashi said:

Has that opinion of him changed ever since his Cinderella comeback story? 

Yes.

Some of us will never forget or completely forgive that henka against kadoban Kotoshogiku, but I now root for him whereas I used to revile him. He’s made an admirable comeback against very long odds through sheer force of will and a lot of sweat.

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Posted (edited)

Takakeisho does the most predictable thing he could and goes kyujo the day after he clears kadoban. Funny how these injuries only become too debilitating to compete with after eight wins, isn’t it? Doesn’t matter if it comes on day eight or day 14, next day ... bam ... injured.

Edited by Eikokurai
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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

Takakeisho does the most predictable thing he could and goes kyujo the day after he clears kadoban. Funny how these injuries only become too debilitating to compete with after eight wins, isn’t it? 

I think it's the other way around. He was fighting for his Ozeki life and had no choice but to soldier on despite something clearly wrong physically.

Having successfully retained his rank, he's doing the smart thing and going kyujo to heal his wounds and avoid making things worse. 

Edited by Kaninoyama
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15 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

I think it's the other way around. He was fighting for his Ozeki life and had no choice but to soldier on despite something clearly wrong physically.

Having successfully retained his rank, he's doing the smart thing and going kyujo to heal his wounds and avoid making things worse. 

Sure, I’m just messing. But just to be contrary for the sake of it, if an existing injury is severe enough that it qualifies you to sit out the basho, it is severe enough for you to sit out from the start. If you’ve shown that you are not only healthy enough to compete but even kachikoshi at the top of the banzuke, the Kyokai should strap the mawashi on the rikishi themselves and send him back out! It’s clearly nothing.

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Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

Sure, I’m just messing. But just to be contrary for the sake of it, if an existing injury is severe enough that it qualifies you to sit out the basho, it is severe enough for you to sit out from the start. If you’ve shown that you are not only healthy enough to compete but even kachikoshi at the top of the banzuke, the Kyokai should strap the mawashi on the rikishi themselves and send him back out! It’s clearly nothing.

This is the standard Ozeki strategy for as long as I remember.  If you have acquired your 8th win or 8th loss and are not in the yusho race, DO NOT take any action that might cause you injury or threaten your career. No matter what happens in a subsequent match, you cannot be further promoted or demoted.

Edited by Asojima
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40 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

I think it's the other way around. He was fighting for his Ozeki life and had no choice but to soldier on despite something clearly wrong physically.

Having successfully retained his rank, he's doing the smart thing and going kyujo to heal his wounds and avoid making things worse. 

No idea whether his knee injury is an old one or a new one. Probably an old one that gets worse day by day. No good. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Asojima said:

This is the standard Ozeki strategy for as long as I remember.  If you have acquired your 8th win or 8th loss and are not in the yusho race, DO NOT take any action that might cause you injury or threaten your career. 

Sure, but also a poor strategy. Kind of cheating if deliberately mukiryoku.

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8 minutes ago, Dapeng said:

Sure, but also a poor strategy. ...

It is the only strategy.

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