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Haru 2020 Basho Discussion (SPOILERS)

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Kaninoyama said:

Are we sure it wasn't just jovial back-and-forth banter? I wasn't paying attention when this exchange happened; just wondering. 

Definitely not- headline on Nikkan. And lately barbs have been exchanged.

Edited by Kintamayama
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Tochinoshin had the best result ever to become ozeki : 37 wins in three bashos. And then, nothing more :'-( I don't understand what happened to him.

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1 minute ago, charliki said:

Tochinoshin had the best result ever to become ozeki : 37 wins in three bashos. And then, nothing more :'-( I don't understand what happened to him.

Injury. 

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21 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Harsh (Takasago Oyakata on Asanoyama)! He was definitely a match for Kakuryu and while he lost to Hakuho fairly easily, he didn't get totally steamrolled.

Completely agree!

The way I see it, he dominated Kakuryu but the witty Yokozuna got away with it. Hakuho dominated but the defense of Asanoyama on the edge was so strong, Hakuho was lucky in the end. The other losses came to Mitakeumi who can beat anybody on a good day and yusho when in-form, and his old buddy Yutakayama who knows him well enough to hurt him once in a while. The rest - decisive wins throughout. So basically, Yokozuna sumo.

I think, Takasago is just being pedagogically here. Rightly so! Overconfidence is never a good attitude.

 

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1 hour ago, Rainoyama said:

I was quite surprised when it happened, if I remember correctly Kitanofuji even called Mainoumi 君 (きみ) which I thought was a bit weird even for him. I understand better now thank you.

Not the first time he's addressed Mainoumi in this way. I found this from Kitanoumi's column from Kyushu last year. 

やはり舞の海君は見る目がない。気の毒に。忘れていたが、高安がすごい相撲で勝った。本当にけがをしているのか疑わしい。これは冗談。本人は腕が折れてもやらねばと思っているだろう。逆に思いもよらぬ好成績をあげられることもある。「愛は強し」である。婚約者のために死力を尽くす高安は侮れないぞ。

https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20191111-00010006-chuspo-spo

Dunno, their back and forth has always felt like playful banter to me. Could be wrong. 

 

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Kitanofuji like many Yokozuna has a very strong personality and a big ego, he is older than almost everyone and is therefore at the top of the sumo world social food chain. As such, he can basically do and say whatever he wants, the thing is a lot of the time he just spits nonsense, let's be honest. He is telling everyone what to do and think but most of the time he cannot even remember the names of the rikishi he is talking about. When you are excellent at your job like Mainoumi is and are treated like fool by a grumpy and out of touch old man, it can be a bit frustrating...

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4 minutes ago, Rainoyama said:

Kitanofuji like many Yokozuna has a very strong personality and a big ego, he is older than almost everyone and is therefore at the top of the sumo world social food chain. As such, he can basically do and say whatever he wants, the thing is a lot of the time he just spits nonsense, let's be honest. He is telling everyone what to do and think but most of the time he cannot even remember the names of the rikishi he is talking about. When you are excellent at your job like Mainoumi is and are treated like fool by a grumpy and out of touch old man, it can be a bit frustrating...

Although I don't understand Japanese, I frequently get the visual impression that Kitanofuji may be an alcoholic who is half in the bag during many of his performances. He may have a medical problem that causes this appearance.

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41 minutes ago, Asojima said:

Although I don't understand Japanese, I frequently get the visual impression that Kitanofuji may be an alcoholic who is half in the bag during many of his performances. He may have a medical problem that causes this appearance.

He had heart surgery a couple years ago, and it does appear he is in generally poor health these days. He will be 78 in less than a week, and signs of mental decline are creeping in. It's sad, but for such a star he has had a very good run.

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2 hours ago, Kaninoyama said:

Not the first time he's addressed Mainoumi in this way. I found this from Kitanoumi's column from Kyushu last year. 

やはり舞の海君は見る目がない。気の毒に。忘れていたが、高安がすごい相撲で勝った。本当にけがをしているのか疑わしい。これは冗談。本人は腕が折れてもやらねばと思っているだろう。逆に思いもよらぬ好成績をあげられることもある。「愛は強し」である。婚約者のために死力を尽くす高安は侮れないぞ。

https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20191111-00010006-chuspo-spo

Dunno, their back and forth has always felt like playful banter to me. Could be wrong. 

 

Note that 君 here is the honorific -kun, not the second person pronoun kimi.

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6 minutes ago, Kamitsuumi said:

Note that 君 here is the honorific -kun, not the second person pronoun kimi. 

Exactly which is completely different and way more appropriate

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Kudos to Hakuho! Now at 44 yusho with more than a third of those zensho yusho. I'm dubious of him making all the way out to 50, but he's stretching the mark  for future dai-yokozuna.

It was a good, if bizarre, basho. I hope to see a May tournament, although I suppose I shall refrain from purchasing tickets this next go-round.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Andreas21 said:

Completely agree!

The way I see it, he dominated Kakuryu but the witty Yokozuna got away with it. Hakuho dominated but the defense of Asanoyama on the edge was so strong, Hakuho was lucky in the end. The other losses came to Mitakeumi who can beat anybody on a good day and yusho when in-form, and his old buddy Yutakayama who knows him well enough to hurt him once in a while. The rest - decisive wins throughout. So basically, Yokozuna sumo.

I think, Takasago is just being pedagogically here. Rightly so! Overconfidence is never a good attitude.

 

He is no worse than Kakuryu, but still significantly below Hakuho. In fact Hakuho had full control in that bout. Anyway, no one should be blamed for losing to Hakuho :-)

 

Edited by Dapeng

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2 hours ago, Kaminariyuki said:

Kudos to Hakuho! Now at 44 yusho with more than a third of those zensho yusho. I'm dubious of him making all the way out to 50, but he's stretching the mark  for future dai-yokozuna.

As sumo fans we are lucky to see such a yokozuna in action.

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On 22/03/2020 at 10:24, Benihana said:

I wonder about the 44 and the common superstition in sumo. AFAIK the "shi" for 4 is the same as for "death" and japanese try to avoid it, for example taking 2x2 sips in tea ceremony instead of 4. Now Hakuho has "double-death" yusho... Is there something to it, or is it just gaijin prejudice?

As some people have said, he will try to reach yusho 50 (Dribbling...)

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10 hours ago, Kamitsuumi said:

Note that 君 here is the honorific -kun, not the second person pronoun kimi.

True. And in this context it is somewhat affectionate and not derogatory. 

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Kamitsuumi said:

Note that 君 here is the honorific -kun, not the second person pronoun kimi.

Here it isn’t though. そういうことを言ったら、絶交だよ君は  It was a real collision, no banter in any way. 

Edited by Kintamayama
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15 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

"If you say stuff like that, we're done!!" snapped Kitanofuji on air.

What, stuff like statistical facts? It was 28 wins. And like today, there was only one ozeki when he was promoted, so it’s certainly an apt comparison. 

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5 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

Here it isn’t though. そういうことを言ったら、絶交だよ君は  It was a real collision, no banter in any way. 

I concur, as someone who is familiar with the language and being able to read this, Kitanofuji was not saying to Mainoumi in an honorific pronunciation. He was using the kimi instead of kun

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Something completely different: Tokio 2021 - what are the odds of Hakuho carrying on ?

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Just now, Gospodin said:

Something completely different: Tokio 2021 - what are the odds of Hakuho carrying on ?

-155

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4 hours ago, Gospodin said:

Something completely different: Tokio 2021 - what are the odds of Hakuho carrying on ?

We've got two threads on that question!

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Posted (edited)

Given the drought in sumo action, I decided to rewatch the final bout of this year's haru-basho in Osaka.  I noticed that the HNK broadcast displayed a prior record of 41 wins for Hakuho and 8 wins for Kakuryu.  However, when I checked the CyberSumo site for the record of prior meetings between Hakuho and Kakuryu, it was 43 to 8 in favour of Hakuho.  That means that according to a non-Japanese internet source, Hakuho and Kakuryu had faced off two more times than indicated by NHK.  The fact that CyberSumo lists every single bout in detail makes me think that it provides the true record.  But I find it difficult to accept that NHK would have got this wrong.

Anyone care to confirm which record is correct?

Edited by Amamaniac

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