2019 Aki Basho Discussion (spoiler alert!)

[Akinomaki 29,460]

56 minutes ago, Andreas21 said:

Since when the Torikumi is decided before the bouts of the previous day?

Since Edo times, the kaobure-gonjo 顔触れ言上, the presentation of next day's makuuchi torikumi takes place, by a top gyoji on the dohyo after the yokozuna dohyo-iri. It takes about 7minutes to read them all gyoji style and show them, so if time is short this event is canceled. The sumo daijiten also lists a few post-war periods when that had stopped - but that is basically an ancient traditional advertisement - like the yobidashi parade after the dohyo matsuri  that tours around Ryogoku to announce day 1 makuuchi torikumi.

So in order to write the torikumi sheets that get shown, the torikumi have to be decided quite early on the day.

Edited September 26, 2019 by Akinomaki

[Rocks 1,580]

2 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

Since Edo times, the kaobure-gonjo 顔触れ言上, the presentation of next day's makuuchi torikumi takes place, by a top gyoji on the dohyo after the yokozuna dohyo-iri. It takes about 7minutes to read them all gyoji style and show them, so if time is short this event is canceled. The sumo daijiten also lists a few post-war periods when that had stopped - but that is basically an ancient traditional advertisement - like the yobidashi parade after the dohyo matsuri  that tours around Ryogoku to announce day 1 makuuchi torikumi.

So in order to write the torikumi sheets that get shown, the torikumi have to be decided quite early on the day.

I am fine with when they schedule matches but to me it seems clear the reading part was instituted to fill up dead time created by rikishi are changing out of their kensho mawashi. I doubt it has much advertising value, live or on air, as it's a natural place for spectators to take a bathroom or snack break. 

[Benihana 1,552]

They can do what they want, i just need enough time to submit my picks for daily games.

[Kaminariyuki 457]

On 23/09/2019 at 23:45, Eikokurai said:

Perhaps influenced by Asanoyama, who cited his switch to a more abstemious lifestyle as critical to his yusho success. 

I'm not competing in anything these days, but perhaps worth a try just to see...

[WAKATAKE 2,077]

Top 10 Aki updates:

- Mitakeumi's second yusho puts him in a 10 way tie for sixth place for persons to have at least two yusho while not making yokozuna, there are 15 people total on this list, with Kaio leading the pack at 5
- This is the 51st yusho for Dewanoumi beya in its current incarnation, putting them one behind Kokonoe beya
- Kotoshogiku now has 688 makuuchi wins. This puts him 9 behind 10th place Kyokutenho
- Motobayashi of Naruto beya continues his streak of wins from debut at 14. He needs to win his first 5 matches in Kyushu to get into the top 10 list
- Kotoshogiku now has 1261 makuuchi matches, in which he passed Takekaze and also his own stablemaster Kotonowaka to get into 7th place on the all time list. Above him is Akinoshima with 1283 matches
- Hakuho's one match in Aki puts him at 1220 makuuchi matches, which is one behind 10th place Kirinji
- Tamawashi has 1211 consecutive career matches. He will need to compete without interruption until day 7 of Natsu 2020 in order to tie 10th place Hachiya
- Hakuho now has 958 yokozuna matches
- Hakuho has now been ranked on the banzuke in makuuchi for 92 basho. Above him is 5th place Terao with 93 basho
- Kotoshogiku has now been ranked in makuuchi for 87 basho. This ties him with Wakanosato for 9th place. Above him in 8th place is his own stable master Kotonowaka at 90 basho
- Hakuho extends the yokozuna basho record to 73
- Kakuryu now stands alone in 10th place at 33 basho ranked at yokozuna
- Goeido now has 30 basho as an ozeki. Given that he was able to protect his rank in Aki, he is now guaranteed to get into 10th place in Haru 2020, which is 32 basho
- Hanakaze extends the all time basho record to 201 and there is no indication he is going to hang up his mawashi yet
- Tenichi and Terunosato continue to chase Hanakaze having competed in their 159th basho, putting them in a 4 way tie for 5th place. They also have given no indication they will retire yet
- Kakuryu gave up 3 kinboshi for Aki 2019 which means he is 3 away from "joining" the most kinboshi losses list for yokozuna
- Mitakeumi was ranked in sanyaku for the 16th consecutive basho. A lot of things could be happening to see whether he will remain in sanyaku after Kyushu or stop his own record by being promoted to ozeki
- Kotoshogiku now has 16 post ozeki career basho which puts him in 8th place. This puts him one behind Daiju who is 7th place
- Terunofuji now has 12 post ozeki career basho and is in 9th place directly behind Kotoshogiku

[Eikokurai 2,884]

Kotoshogiku surpassed 400 wins by yorikiri in Makuuchi this basho (401 by basho end). This makes him the first rikishi to reach that milestone.

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&m=on&kimarite=66&onlyw1=on

[Benevolance 1,975]

Is that actually showing the # of yorikiri while in Makuuchi, or is it reporting the total career # of yorikiri by a rikishi who reached Makuuchi? 

[Benihana 1,552]

1 minute ago, Benevolance said:

Is that actually showing the # of yorikiri while in Makuuchi, or is it reporting the total career # of yorikiri by a rikishi who reached Makuuchi? 

Click on modify query, you'll see the filter is set to makuuchi. For total career Kotoshogiku is the leader with 455, tied with Kyokutenho!

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&onlyw1=on

[Eikokurai 2,884]

3 hours ago, Benihana said:

Click on modify query, you'll see the filter is set to makuuchi. For total career Kotoshogiku is the leader with 455, tied with Kyokutenho!

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&onlyw1=on

Why does this query show 431 yorikiri wins for him? 

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&shikona1=Kotoshogiku &onlyw1=on

 

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&kimarite=66&shikona1=Kotoshogiku &onlyw1=on

Edited October 5, 2019 by Eikokurai

[Benihana 1,552]

5 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

Why does this query show 431 yorikiri wins for him? 

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&shikona1=Kotoshogiku &onlyw1=on

Because this query is for the shikona Kotoshogiku only. Add the 24 yorikiri wins he had as Kotokikutsugi, et voilà: 455 yorikiri

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&shikona1=Kotokikutsugi &onlyw1=on

EDIT: Don't ask me why, but the other type of query adds up all results for an individual with all his shikona

Edited October 5, 2019 by Benihana

[Gurowake 2,653]

5 hours ago, Benihana said:

EDIT: Don't ask me why, but the other type of query adds up all results for an individual with all his shikona

Because it's sorted by rikishi.  His query he asked specifically about bouts where someone's shikona was "Kotoshogiku".  You asked for all the bouts that were yorikiri and to group all by the same rikishi together.  It's a pretty clear difference.

[Eikokurai 2,884]

6 hours ago, Benihana said:

Because this query is for the shikona Kotoshogiku only. Add the 24 yorikiri wins he had as Kotokikutsugi, et voilà: 455 yorikiri

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&kimarite=66&shikona1=Kotokikutsugi &onlyw1=on

EDIT: Don't ask me why, but the other type of query adds up all results for an individual with all his shikona

Ah ... makes sense, and yet also doesn’t from the point of view of searching the database in the easiest way.

[Asashosakari 15,725]

14 hours ago, Benevolance said:

Is that actually showing the # of yorikiri while in Makuuchi, or is it reporting the total career # of yorikiri by a rikishi who reached Makuuchi? 

It technically shows the number of yorikiri in bouts that were part of the makuuchi torikumi. 1 of Kotoshogiku's 401 came while visiting from juryo. (Normally not considered part of a rikishi's makuuchi record.)
 

4 hours ago, Eikokurai said:

Ah ... makes sense, and yet also doesn’t from the point of view of searching the database in the easiest way.

That's what the "Include changes" selector is for.

[Eikokurai 2,884]

4 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

It technically shows the number of yorikiri in bouts that were part of the makuuchi torikumi. 1 of Kotoshogiku's 401 came while visiting from juryo. (Normally not considered part of a rikishi's makuuchi record.)
 

That's what the "Include changes" selector is for.

I’d make that ‘exclude changes’ and make the default results about a rikishi’s whole career. I imagine people more often search for stats relating to a career as a whole rather than when they held a specific shikona.

[Asashosakari 15,725]

38 minutes ago, Eikokurai said:

I’d make that ‘exclude changes’ and make the default results about a rikishi’s whole career. I imagine people more often search for stats relating to a career as a whole rather than when they held a specific shikona.

What makes you think people only use shikona restrictions to search for a rikishi's stats? Plenty of use cases with wildcards or simply listing multiple names, where unrelated shikona hits from matching whole careers may lead to rather astonishing and unexpected results.

Anyway, if I'm looking for details about a specific rikishi I'm much more likely to look for those on his various career profile pages than via query. To be honest the way you used the query there does not strike me as a common usage at all, so I highly disagree with changing the UI to accommodate it.

Oh, and - you're welcome.

Edited October 6, 2019 by Asashosakari