Atenzan

Hakuho Injures Arm Haru Basho 2019

Recommended Posts

Hakuho performed a dohyo iri at the Ise Grand Shrine today. The injury is confirmed to be a ruptured muscle in the upper part of the right arm (右腕筋断裂). Apparently it shouldn't affect his movements too much and he should be able to do tsuppari or grab a mawashi but he said himself that he feels disconfort when he contracts the arm.  Surgery was an option but "It would take too much time" he said. He plans to rest and wait for the injury to heal on its own. He was out of the Makuuchi tournament held today. According to the articles Hakuhou will perform dohyo iri but probably won't do any sumo during the jungyo.

https://www.nikkansports.com/m/battle/sumo/news/201903310000810_m.html

https://www.asahi.com/sp/articles/ASM3053M4M30UTQP019.html?iref=sp_spotop_sumo_list_n

https://www.yomiuri.co.jp/sports/sumo/20190331-OYT1T50187/

Edited by Rainoyama
  • Like 4
  • Thanks 2
  • Sad 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Wake me up when September ends." - Green Day. 

Hakuho will, probably, skip the next two honbashos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Rainoyama said:

 Surgery was an option but "It would take too much time" he said. He plans to rest and wait for the injury to heal on its own. 

Since Hakuho can take as long as necessary for an injury to heal without surgery (and knowing that this kind of injury can heal completely without it), this is the wisest decision possible. 

On the other hand, there are instances where surgery obviously is the primary choice. However, some of those in sumo seem to ignore that fact. The most obvious example is of course, the desruction of Kisenosato's career. Another would be Endo who with surgery on hiis knee, would be a much more successful rikishi than he is now. I somehow can understand the totally misguided thinking of Endo's advisors. They didn't want him to fall well down the banzuke during the recovery process. So instead he missed no further bashos---and with a permanently weakened knee, has remained well below his perceived potential.

Kisenosato, unlike Endo, could have taken as long as needed to fully recover from surgery and have no risk of losing rank. Why it was avoided for such a severe injury continues to astound me---and many others as well. 

Edited by sekitori

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At 34, injuries will take more time to heal, and take more training to come back in shape.    Motivation to come back?  He already broke all the ozumo records & should be very well off financially.    So, he may not get another yusho for 3 - 4 bashos.   He will be 6 months older.    It may be that we just witnessed his last yusho unless the current crop of rikishis still won't be good enough to beat the returning Hak.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, robnplunder said:

 Motivation to come back? 

It's still more than a year to the Olympics.  He'll need to give at least one more good showing to put off retiring until after that.  But surely it can wait a couple basho.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, thats it then, right? This is definitive proof that nobody in sumo ever listens to the doctors. Kisenosato was not that long ago, but that doesn't seem to faze Hakuho at all.

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rigel said:

So, thats it then, right? This is definitive proof that nobody in sumo ever listens to the doctors. Kisenosato was not that long ago, but that doesn't seem to faze Hakuho at all.

Well, I'm sure there are oyakata and rikishi who would point to Ura and Terunofuji (as recent examples) where surgery has not turned out as hoped (whether or not proper rehab and healing time were taken).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rigel said:

So, thats it then, right? This is definitive proof that nobody in sumo ever listens to the doctors. Kisenosato was not that long ago, but that doesn't seem to faze Hakuho at all.

Apart from being a vastly different kind of injury, contrary to Kisenosato he has nothing to prove anymore.

Edited by Jakusotsu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 31/03/2019 at 13:21, Rainoyama said:

Surgery was an option but "It would take too much time" he said.

Would take too much time? Who does he think he is, an ōzeki? He can take all the time off he wants. I’m scared we’ll see him join next tournament and end his career.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Rigel said:

So, thats it then, right? This is definitive proof that nobody in sumo ever listens to the doctors. Kisenosato was not that long ago, but that doesn't seem to faze Hakuho at all.

There is a huge difference between surgery being an option and surgery being a necessity. Hakuho was obviously infomed by medical experts that unlike Kisenosato, his injury will heal properly without it. Although it will take some  time for the healing process to occur, that's the option he chose and  I think it was the most intelliegent one. At this stage of his career,  he can afford to miss as many bashos as needed for this to occur. The only thing I question is his use of the words that "surgery would take too much time".  I think he meant something entirely different--like surgery has some risk and that natual healing, while taking a while to occur, is his best course of action.

As for coming back too soon, I beleve that Hakuho won't return until he and his doctors feel that he is healthy once again and that he is in condition to complete at the high level expected of him. For someone who has set almost  every record possible and wants to prolong his career up to and maybe beyond the Olympics,  how long that may take doesn't really matter. 

 

 

Edited by sekitori

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, sekitori said:

There is a huge difference between surgery being an option and surgery being a necessity. Hakuho was obviously infomed by medical experts that unlike Kisenosato, his injury will heal properly without it. Although it will take some  time for the healing process to occur, that's the option he chose and  I think it was the most intelliegent one. At this stage of his career,  he can afford to miss as many bashos as needed for this to occur. The only thing I question is his use of the words that "surgery would take too much time".  I think he meant something entirely different--like surgery has some risk and that natual healing, while taking a while to occur, is his best course of action.

As for coming back too soon, I beleve that Hakuho won't return until he and his doctors feel that he is healthy once again and that he is in condition to complete at the high level expected of him. For someone who has set almost  every record possible and wants to prolong his career up to and maybe beyond the Olympics,  how long that may take doesn't really matter. 

 

 

All three articles I linked earlier quote Hakuho on this issue, the problem is that they all give a different wording... Did he repeat the same thing several times to different sources or did they just arranged the information the way they wanted and put the result as a quote I don't know.

In the Nikkan article the quote is "時間がかかってしまうから" In that setence he uses the てしまう form which implies regret to some extent "Because it unfortunately takes time (I won't take the surgery)" is the closest translation I can find.

The Yomiuri version uses words in parenthesis like if he omitted them and they added them back for clarity " 全治(期間)はまだわからない。手術すると(回復に)時間がかかるから安静にする" That version doesn't have the てしまう that implies regret I mentioned earlier and use a neutral form instead.   "I don't know yet how long would full healing will take. If I take  surgery it would take time so I decided to go with rest"

The Asahi version uses the same neutral form but the quote is different "手術すれば時間がかかる。安静にすれば力が入る"  "If I opt for surgery it would take time. If I chose rest it will take effort" ("力が入る" is a pain to translate and he uses that expression quite a lote aha)

Again both Japanese and English are far from perfect so please feel free to correct me if I made mistakes !

Edited by Rainoyama
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Rainoyama said:

The Yomiuri version uses words in parenthesis like if he omitted them and they added them back for clarity " 全治(期間)はまだわからない。手術すると(回復に)時間がかかるから安静にする" That version doesn't have the てしまう that implies regret I mentioned earlier and use a neutral form instead.   "I don't know yet how long would full healing will take. If I take  surgery it would take time so I decided to go with rest"

Hakuho doesn't say that with surgery it takes more time to fully recover: time is needed for recovery after surgery, lost time for him - he can do something while simply resting - e.g. dohyo-iri.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hakuho is in cruise control. Probably kyujo in may, a try in july, some effort in september...its a nice time to heal his cocacobrachisomething and the other injured muscles, tendons and articulations...

Anyway its sad because we are seeing the last bashos of the legend. Every basho counts at this point.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hakuho gave an update on his injury today "Little by little I'm starting to be able to bend my arm"

On his career he said he hopes to be around until at least the 3rd year of the new Reiwa era which is consistent with his dream to be there for the Olympics and even a bit longer.

https://www.nikkansports.com/m/battle/sumo/news/201904020000656_m.html?mode=all

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^Is it really “bend the arm”? I thought he had no problem doing that, rather stretching it is…

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, ALAKTORN said:

^Is it really “bend the arm”? I thought he had no problem doing that, rather stretching it is…

"右腕は「少しずつ曲げられるようになった」 "   る means to bend, to curve, to twist but the translation may be different from the context so it's alway difficult. Maybe someone who speaks better japanese and better english than me can provide a better traduction ?

I did some research and found that on the first article the sentence used to describe the injury was "肘関節を曲げて上腕二頭筋を収縮させると「違和感があるね」" @Kintamayama who's japanese and english are better than mine and who's experience translating medical stuff is far greater than mine translated it like this in his newsletter "when he stretches his elbow joints and contracts his biceps he feels uncomfortable". In that article the same 曲げる is used (although it refers to the elbow not the arm) and Kintamayama used the verb "to stretch" to translate it. He is way more trustworthy than I am so I think his version is better and I should have used "to stretch" in my translation as well.

Edited by Rainoyama
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The bicep muscles  (called biceps brachii) at the front of the arm are flexor muscles which bend the forearm toward the upper arm. When someone is asked to "make a muscle", they do that by flexing the bicep. The triceps brachii at the back of the arm are extensor muscles which straighten it. In other words, they are muscular antagonists. To bend the forearm, the biceps contracts and the triceps relaxes. To extend the forearm, the triceps contracts and the biceps relaxes.  When Hakuho said,. "Little by little I'm starting to be able to bend my arm",  he had to be referring to his biceps. 

How do I know all this? I was a dentist who was requireed to take a course in gross anatomy in dental school. I also had help with some of my wording from my friend, Mr. Google. :-)

Edited by sekitori
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, sekitori said:

The bicep muscles  (called biceps brachii) at the front of the arm are flexor muscles which bend the forearm toward the upper arm. When someone is asked to "make a muscle", they do that by flexing the bicep. The triceps brachii at the back of the arm are extensor muscles which striaighten it. In other words, they are muscular antagonists. To bend the forearm, the biceps contracts and the triceps relaxes. To extend the forearm, the triceps contracts and the biceps relaxes.  When Hakuho said,. "Little by little I'm starting to be able to bend my arm",  he had to be referring to his biceps.  

That makes sense thank you so much ! He previously said he was feeling pain when contracting his biceps so it has to be that !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Latest update from Nikkan. Hakuho is expected to resume serious training after the start of new the Reiwa era so at the very least not before a few days which is consistent with what was reported before - (meaning him not doing any serious training during the Spring tour.) He checked the range of movements of his injured arm before the morning training today by bending and stretching it repeatedly.  During the tour he did some fundamental training ringside but not a single bout. "My lower body is ready but I don't know about (the tear in) my right arm. I'll have it examined when the tour is over." he explained. 「下半身は出来上がってきている。でも右腕は(断裂した筋が)くっつくことはない。巡業の帰りに病院で診てもらってから」

The jungyo ends in a few days (29th) and the banzuke is announced the next day (30th), Hakuho won't be doing sumo at least until the start of Reiwa indeed.

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/201904260000832.html

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hakuho attended Enho's makuuchi celebration party and seemed in good spirit and Miyagino, his oyakata, gave an update on the injury.

"It's about 70% healed" he said   "He is doing fundamental training to get ready for Nagoya. When they showed me the scans, the muscle seemed almost completely reattached"

https://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/201906010001223.html

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 02/06/2019 at 02:56, Rainoyama said:

Hakuho attended Enho's makuuchi celebration party and seemed in good spirit and Miyagino, his oyakata, gave an update on the injury.

"It's about 70% healed" he said   "He is doing fundamental training to get ready for Nagoya. When they showed me the scans, the muscle seemed almost completely reattached"

Even though his bicep may be 100% healed (right now it's supposedly at 70%), does not mean that it will be ready for competition. Once it has fully healed, Hakuho will have to strengthen it so that it can once again withstand heavy physical contact--and that will take time. Since I'm sure he will only compete in a basho when he feels he's physically able to, I still have doubts about his entering one that begins in only five more weeks with a bicep that's now still 30% short of being fully healed and nowhere near ready for sumo competition. My highly uneducated guess is that he will skip Nagoya in order to be completely ready for the Aki basho. On rare occasion however, my predictions have been proven to be somewhat (actually, completely) wrong. :-)

Edited by sekitori

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hakuhou started training today at his heya. He did do some light fundamentals during Natsu basho, but usually on his own. Today he did some real keiko and then continued with some fundamentals for thirty additional minutes after the training session was over.He did some tachiai practice to check out his first step for about 15 minutes as well. It wasn't totally all out, but he did hit his opponent with his injured right arm. Still in the trial phase , but Hakuhou said: "I wasn't able to do any butsugari like today till now, so I'm getting better. I had no problem exerting power." every year, the June keiko starts off mid-month at the Shiga, Osahama Nagahama lodgings of the heya. "I'm really itching to go. It's been a while since I've been this motivated. I guess I am longing for my twenties.." He also referred to yusho winner Asanoyama, who had said in the past that he would like to be a representative of yotsu sumo. "I think he already is. His sumo, his body.. If he would don a light brown mawashi, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between us from behind," he added.

 

201906040000424-w500_0.jpg..

 

 

Edited by Kintamayama
  • Like 2
  • Thanks 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Kintamayama said:

"If he would don a light brown mawashi, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between us from behind," he added.

Whilst it wouldn't surprise me to discover that the kanji for 'light' and 'dark' is the same, that's a strange choice of adjective. I know there's nothing wrong with my eyes, and Hakuho's mawashi is so dark brown that I first took it for an old and slightly faded black one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now