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Kintamayama

YDC convenes after Haru 2019-Hakuhou’s handclapping call

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The YDC has no authority to suspend a Yokozuna. Only to "advise" the NSK. In other words, they are useless.

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Seen the actual events on video, I really like what Hakuho did. Graceful, dignified, well-balanced. A beautiful gesture to celebrate the change of era, finally to the Tenno, by the main ambassador of the "strong men".

Somehow I wish the YDC would be reprimanded for making a fuss of it by the Tenno himself. I know, whishful thinking. But it would be nice.

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5 hours ago, Andreas21 said:

Somehow I wish the YDC would be reprimanded for making a fuss of it by the Tenno himself. I know, whishful thinking. But it would be nice.

Exactly my thoughts.

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On 10/04/2019 at 07:57, Andreas21 said:

Seen the actual events on video, I really like what Hakuho did. Graceful, dignified, well-balanced. A beautiful gesture to celebrate the change of era, finally to the Tenno, by the main ambassador of the "strong men".

Somehow I wish the YDC would be reprimanded for making a fuss of it by the Tenno himself. I know, whishful thinking. But it would be nice.

It seems the NSK is down-playing this hand-clapping fuss. Hakuho exhibited excellent sumo with another zensho yusho, got injured but attending the exhibition tour from the very first day. It's difficult to understand why the YDC keeps harassing this greatest rikishi ever seen.

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Hakuhou was called in to the offices for the third time today. This time, he explained stuff to the Compliance Committee, for an hour and a half.  "I will gambarize at the jungyo tomorrow," is all he said to the reporters upon leaving. His oyakata will be called upon at a different time. Hakkaku oyakata said the punishment for both will be decided in a few days.

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Posted (edited)

What this means of course, is that Hakuho is still defiant. He has not shown the expected level of contrition and nor demonstrated any remorse for his outlaw gesture ending the yusho interview. Whether or not he feels bad (we know he doesn't), he is expected to act like he does, and mouth some platitudes in repentance.

Edited by Otokonoyama

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Posted (edited)

Sorry to post here. 

News spread on social media yesterday in Mongolia, that last week Hakuho filed all the papers to the government to renounce his citizenship. Some sources are approved, like Kyokushuzan etc.

People’s reactions are mixed.

It was just matter of time. 

Edited by TENHO

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56 minutes ago, TENHO said:

Sorry to post here. 

News spread on social media yesterday in Mongolia, that last week Hakuho filed all the papers to the government to renounce his citizenship. Some sources are approved, like Kyokushuzan etc.

People’s reactions are mixed.

It was just matter of time. 

You should start a new thread. "Hakuho to become a Japanese citizen" or such.

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He's not really helping his case because of the past conduct that he's shown. Things like dame-oshi, refusal to step back onto the dohyo after his self-imposed matta, and the banzai. He is the GOAT, you can't take away from that. But sometimes you need to show a little dignity. If the greats don't want to act in a certain way with the organization they represent, that's all find and dandy, but you have to be able to handle the criticism that comes with the position that you hold.

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Posted (edited)

The Kyokai will convene tomorrow to decide on Hakuhou and his Oyakata's  "punishment". There are 7 possible punishments, ranging from a warning to salary reduction. The calls demanding Hakuhou be punished came from the YDC and the Hyogi-inkai  as well.

Edited by Kintamayama
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On 17/04/2019 at 13:07, WAKATAKE said:

He's not really helping his case because of the past conduct that he's shown. Things like dame-oshi, refusal to step back onto the dohyo after his self-imposed matta, and the banzai. He is the GOAT, you can't take away from that. But sometimes you need to show a little dignity. If the greats don't want to act in a certain way with the organization they represent, that's all find and dandy, but you have to be able to handle the criticism that comes with the position that you hold.

I’m sure Hakuho is OK with owning it. He’s a hard man from an honor-bound culture. Mongolia is probably one of the more macho countries I can think of outside Latin America. Look at Harumafuji— he retired because he felt he had brought shame on his oyakata. That was enough for him to hang it up and call it a day, despite all he’d accomplished. Those guys are cut from the same yak hide.

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Posted (edited)

The extra rijikai today decided on a kenseki punishment けん責処分 - no details about what this actually means for Hakuho, some restraint for the future - the lightest of the 7 NSK penalties, something like a letter of apology.

Miyagino-oyakata for lack of properly educating his deshi gets a proper punishment: 10% salary reduction for 3 months - the 2nd lightest penalty of the 7.

NHK news with vid: http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/20190424/k10011894831000.html

Hakuho took part in it without a word

AS20190424002261_commL.jpgoAS20190424002260_commL.jpgo

201904240000491-w200_0.jpgo  b_12271161.jpgo b_12271163.jpgo20190424s00005000247000p_thum.jpgo b_12271162.jpgo 4.jpgo 201904240000491-w200_1.jpgo

 

The only difference to the strict warning he got for the banzai with the spectators at an earlier yusho interview seems to be that this time it is an official NSK penalty by rijikai decision.

Edited by Akinomaki
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So basically he was warned but officialy this time. I guess this is fair, they couldn't let him off the hook since he did something similar before in Kyushu and some people didn't like it but on the other hand the sanction is not too harsh because clearly he only wanted to celebrate the end of Heisei and the audience was happy to participate.

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Posted (edited)

Hakkaku rijicho: "Decorum is an inherent part of Sumo. I told Hakuhou that I wish that the traditions, systems and decorum be adhered to  and protected, especially by a Yokozuna, who should be taking the initiative to protect these things.. He should be showing his leadership in the future!" 

Edited by Kintamayama
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Hakuho should have been forced to retire. It seems like nothing but clapping leads to dancing and the next thing you know the kids are listening to rock n roll. 

Hakuho should go, it's for the children. 

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Posted (edited)

The financial penalty incurred by Miyagino Oyakata seems harsh.  It will be interesting to see how Hakuho responds to all of this.  There is still a good possibility (in my mind) that he will decide to sit out the next tournament just to help heal his injured bicep.

 

Edited by Amamaniac

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21 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

The financial penalty incurred by Miyagino Oyakata seems harsh.

It is a fine of 309 600 Yen - his monthly salary is 1 032 000 Yen - Miyagino-oyakata appearing at the rijikai:

20190424s00005000284000p_thum.jpgo

 

Miyane-ya had it at top subject - with sumo journalist Ohmi - he and another old traditionalist were harshly criticizing Hakuho, younger guests from other sports had no problem with what the NSK made into a big problem http://www.miomio.tv/watch/cc432735/

Goody at 2:25h, with Ishinriki, and Yokono reporting from the kokugikan http://www.miomio.tv/watch/cc432817/

- both last 35min

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34 minutes ago, Amamaniac said:

The financial penalty incurred by Miyagino Oyakata seems harsh.  It will be interesting to see how Hakuho responds to all of this.  There is still a good possibility (in my mind) that he will decide to sit out the next tournament just to help heal his injured bicep.

 

Good God, what was Miyagino supposed to do?  When Hakuho suggested everyone clap, was he supposed to rush up on the dohyo and say "Stop! The proprieties must be followed at all times!"?  (Bonus points if you caught the reference to The Quiet Man).  How was he responsible for this behavior?  Did he fail to go over the checklist of "approved yokozuna behavior" with Hakuho before the award ceremony?

 

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6 minutes ago, Yamanashi said:

Good God, what was Miyagino supposed to do? 

Educate him properly in the first place. He failed to drill Hakuho into a rikishi who respects the traditions and refrains from taking the initiative to do anything new and unusual: the right to do so lies exclusively in the hands of retired rikishi - the active rikishi have to remain passive in this.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Amamaniac said:

The financial penalty incurred by Miyagino Oyakata seems harsh.  It will be interesting to see how Hakuho responds to all of this.  There is still a good possibility (in my mind) that he will decide to sit out the next tournament just to help heal his injured bicep.

 

It's virtually certain that Hakuho will go kyujo for the Natsu basho. It takes time for a bicep tear to heal and other than performing the dohyo-iri, he has not taken part in the current jungyo. Some may take his absence to be some sort of protest against the penalties given to him and his oyakata. But the real reason why he won't compete is that his body is not yet ready to undergo the training necessary to do so. There is even a possibility that he could sit out the Nagoya basho as well. One thing is certain. Hakuho will never return to competition until he feels he's healthy enough to do so. 

I also think that Miyagino Oyakata's penalty is way too harsh. Some sort of mild censure probably would have been appropriate, but he never should have been fined. I  believe that that he will be compensated for his financial loss by members of the koenkai and maybe even Hakuho himself, whose actions started this investigation. Of course, this will be done in complete privacy. There will be absolutely no public knowledge of it.

Edited by sekitori
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3 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

Goody at 2:25h, with Ishinriki, and Yokono reporting from the kokugikan http://www.miomio.tv/watch/cc432817/

She reported from in front of the kokugikan, but the rijikai today took place in a hotel - there was some event in the kokugikan.

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Posted (edited)

Goody: Hakuho says he is deeply sorry about what he did and has as excuse that he didn't know about the final sanbon-jime clapping of the new recruits at the kamiokuri ceremony to end the basho - the only proper place for the clapping. As shindeshi he didn't take part in it: at that time there were so many new recruits that only the best ones, those from the ichiban-shusse  were on the dohyo.

This maybe is the reason that he got away with just another warning and no real punishment

Edited by Akinomaki
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Posted (edited)

Didn't the bow-twirling ceremony originate with a Yokozuna just getting up and celebrating a win by twirling his bow? Was he punished? Should he have been? :-)

Edited by Naganoyama

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17 minutes ago, Naganoyama said:

Didn't the bow-twirling ceremony originate with a Yokozuna just getting up and celebrating a win by twirling his bow? Was he punished? Should he have been? :-)

The problem was not the hand clapping itself, but the hand clapping before the official slated hand clapping ceremony at the end of the award awarding ceremony. That Yokozuna getting up and celebrating by twirling didn't upstage a later bow-twirling ceremony slated to happen.

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