Dohyo and Injuries

[ctbrunner 0]

I am hoping someone on this forum can help me with this topic:  Injuries are common in Sumo.  It seems that the dohyo is configured in such a way as to almost certainly cause injuries.  When a wrestler is pushed out he frequently falls.  Most of these falls would be unnecessary if the dohyo was flat as it was in earlier times.  At the very least shouldn't the immediate are be cleared and padded. Has there been any studies of CTE (Concussions) and Rikishi.   In American football head to head contact has been outlawed.  I see awful head to head contact almost everyday in the tournament.  Sometimes it is incidental but often it seems deliberate.  It seems to me that these two simple steps could greatly benefit the wrestlers without changing the essence of Sumo.

[Asojima 2,873]

In football, head-to-head contact similar to that of sumo occurs many times per game for the linemen. It is only outlawed for full speed tackling. The vast majority of sumo injuries occur on the dohyo rather than from falls over the edge.

Edited March 13, 2018 by Asojima

[Churaumi 728]

It is counterintuitive, but helmets have made head injuries worse over time. There is something of a sweet spot where helmets were good enough to protect heads but not so good heads could be used as weapons. Same thing with boxers and MMA fighters; boxers have “safer” gloves, but pound each other over and over. MMA fighters have lighter gloves but don’t grind each other down the same. Bonking noggins can’t be great for rikishi, but I doubt it adds up the same as NFL players. As for the dohyo, I think you’re preaching to the choir here.

[Benevolance 2,482]

I've already petitioned the NSK to replace the tawari with foam core, construct the dohyo from a giant, inflatable balloon, and add a ball pit around the outside to cushion impacts. I've been told they've taken my suggestions under serious advisement and that I'm not to come within 100 m of the building. 

[Yamanashi 3,771]

My two cents' worth:

1) Even if the majority of injuries occur on the dohyo, that doesn't make the raised dohyo a good idea. 

2) I can't see how to avoid head-to-head contact at the tachiai without completely changing sumo.

 

 

[sekitori 492]

15 hours ago, ctbrunner said:

 I see awful head to head contact almost everyday in the tournament.  

What happens during keiko? Do oyakatas insist that rikshis make head to head contact at tachi-ais in practice as well? Maybe John Gunning will let us know. If less severe but still fairly solid head contact occurs many times a day during practice and this happens over a period of several years, I would think that its cumulative effect could be far worse than occasional heavier contact during a basho. 

Edited March 14, 2018 by sekitori

[Eikokurai 3,437]

On 3/14/2018 at 10:14, Yamanashi said:

My two cents' worth:

1) Even if the majority of injuries occur on the dohyo, that doesn't make the raised dohyo a good idea. 

2) I can't see how to avoid head-to-head contact at the tachiai without completely changing sumo.

 

 

I agree RE #2. I think about the only thing that could be done is to mandate that the rikishi have to lean a certain side, e.g. to the right, so they avoid or reduce head collisions, but that would undermine a lot of the tactical decisions a rikishi makes or even completely disadvantage them if they favour certain a certain grip.

[yutarotanaka 104]

Sumo wrestlers often train literally banging their heads on wooden posts, right? I guess it's to toughen up the forehead area? Also, it probably so they'll get used/be somewhat familiar to the impact of a head to head collision and not mind the pain long enough to stay focused on what they need to do in the dohyo.

As for having some sort of matting in the immediate area outside of the dohyo, I've always wondered why not at least have those matting similar to what they use for kindergarten classrooms or in gymnastics or in other wrestling/fighting sports. I don't think those are unreasonable to implement to lessen the risks of wrestlers injuring themselves if they happen to fly out of the dohyo. They just can't have whatever padding they'll use to be too soft that landing on them may cause sumo wrestlers to twist something if they land on it awkwardly.

[Jakusotsu 5,866]

1 hour ago, yutarotanaka said:

Sumo wrestlers often train literally banging their heads on wooden posts, right?

Er, no.

[Eikokurai 3,437]

1 hour ago, yutarotanaka said:

Sumo wrestlers often train literally banging their heads on wooden posts, right? I guess it's to toughen up the forehead area? Also, it probably so they'll get used/be somewhat familiar to the impact of a head to head collision and not mind the pain long enough to stay focused on what they need to do in the dohyo.

As for having some sort of matting in the immediate area outside of the dohyo, I've always wondered why not at least have those matting similar to what they use for kindergarten classrooms or in gymnastics or in other wrestling/fighting sports. I don't think those are unreasonable to implement to lessen the risks of wrestlers injuring themselves if they happen to fly out of the dohyo. They just can't have whatever padding they'll use to be too soft that landing on them may cause sumo wrestlers to twist something if they land on it awkwardly.

People sitting in the front row should sit inside stacked rubber tyres as an additional crash barrier.

[yutarotanaka 104]

I swear I saw a sumo training video somewhere where a rikishi doing the teppo exercises is also tapping the wooden post with their forehead. But not like full-on or hard bumps. Just light taps here and there. Perhaps the rikishi that I saw doing this was just already at his limit and frustrated and those forehead taps to the wooden post were incidental. I assumed incorrectly that it was SOP for that type of exercise. When I saw that, I was like "Whoah! This sumo wrestlers don't around!"

 

[Benihana 1,910]

The dohyo should simply be on ground level. Sure, i'd miss flying Kotoyuki, but just think about what happened to Kisenosato.

This would not have happened:

 

[rhyen 1,822]

new dohyo proposal from @RobiUsagi

[Jakusotsu 5,866]

Thanks. Now I can't shake the image of Gagamaru in a bouncy castle.

[Asashosakari 18,954]

Maybe they could get Yamamotoyama back to act as the new dohyo.

[Katooshu 3,176]

On 2018-03-16 at 05:50, yutarotanaka said:

I swear I saw a sumo training video somewhere where a rikishi doing the teppo exercises is also tapping the wooden post with their forehead. But not like full-on or hard bumps. Just light taps here and there. Perhaps the rikishi that I saw doing this was just already at his limit and frustrated and those forehead taps to the wooden post were incidental. I assumed incorrectly that it was SOP for that type of exercise. When I saw that, I was like "Whoah! This sumo wrestlers don't around!"

 

I've  seen that type of thing as well. In one of the cases the person banging their head was a young amateur whose coach wanted him to get used to head clashes.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Katooshu

[yutarotanaka 104]

1 hour ago, Katooshu said:

I've  seen that type of thing as well. In one of the cases the person banging their head was a young amateur whose coach wanted him to get used to head clashes.

I also thought that perhaps it was some form of punishment for not meeting a certain standard in their training session or whatever infraction the rikishi incurred or broke within the heya's house rules. Well, whatever it is, it seems to happen here and there from time to time.

[Doitsuyama 1,173]

On 19.3.2018 at 00:22, Asashosakari said:

Maybe they could get Yamamotoyama back to act as the new dohyo.

You meant Motoyamamotoyama, right?

[Asashosakari 18,954]

23 minutes ago, Doitsuyama said:

You meant Motoyamamotoyama, right?

I really should start charging royalties. 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2018 by Asashosakari

[WakaTakaFlame 0]

I think getting the dohyo on the ground would help, or makikg it wider, so that there is at least more room to fall on. Or make it less steep, so the fall is not as big unless you get pushed really far.

I also think it would be hilarious if we just had water around the dohyo and if a rikishi falls off it, you'll get a huge splash.

 

The concussion-stuff is pretty hard to fix. I think they should just try banning headbutts, maybe not at the basho at first but give it a try a little lower down the ranks or at a one day tournament or something, and see how it works out.

If it doesn't work, it doesn't work but there's no reason not to try it.

[Naganoyama 5,879]

3 hours ago, WakaTakaFlame said:

I think getting the dohyo on the ground would help, or makikg it wider, so that there is at least more room to fall on. Or make it less steep, so the fall is not as big unless you get pushed really far.

I also think it would be hilarious if we just had water around the dohyo and if a rikishi falls off it, you'll get a huge splash.

...

...and probably drown the little old boys in the front row.

[Yamanashi 3,771]

4 hours ago, WakaTakaFlame said:

I also think it would be hilarious if we just had water around the dohyo and if a rikishi falls off it, you'll get a huge splash.

 

Now let me just run this up the flag pole and see if anyone salutes:

"Sharks, Baby!"

 

[yutarotanaka 104]

14 hours ago, Yamanashi said:

Now let me just run this up the flag pole and see if anyone salutes:

"Sharks, Baby!"

 

With frickin' laser beams attached to their heads?! 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh7bYNAHXxw

Edited March 28, 2018 by yutarotanaka

[Benevolance 2,482]

"...and in the event of a water landing, your sumotori has been equipped with an inflatable mawashi..."

[yutarotanaka 104]

On 16/03/2018 at 05:50, yutarotanaka said:

I swear I saw a sumo training video somewhere where a rikishi doing the teppo exercises is also tapping the wooden post with their forehead. But not like full-on or hard bumps. Just light taps here and there. Perhaps the rikishi that I saw doing this was just already at his limit and frustrated and those forehead taps to the wooden post were incidental. I assumed incorrectly that it was SOP for that type of exercise. When I saw that, I was like "Whoah! This sumo wrestlers don't mess around!"

 

 

OMG! See! See! I told you they do it from time to time!

https://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/en/tv/sumo/tournament/201809/live_2.html