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Basho Talk - Nagoya 2017 (SPOILERS)

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With Kisenosato, Kakuryu and Terunofuji all out, this leaves only 15 intra-Sanyaku matches remaining. There are still 9 days left. A lot of Sanyaku - Maegashira matches will have to be played.

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42 minutes ago, bettega said:

Well, second kyujo in 3 basho as Yokozuna for a 31y old guy. Not looking good :-|

Hope he can recover and perform in a decent way in Sept, or else ......

Edited by Dapeng

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1 hour ago, Bumpkin said:

With Kisenosato, Kakuryu and Terunofuji all out, this leaves only 15 intra-Sanyaku matches remaining. There are still 9 days left. A lot of Sanyaku - Maegashira matches will have to be played.

I'm counting 16.  And I didn't know until I read this post that Terunofuji withdrew.

Hakuho - Harumafuji, Goeido, Takayasu, Tamawashi, Mitakeumi

Harumafuji - Goeido, Takayasu, Tamawashi, Mitakeumi, Kotoshogiku

Goeido - Takayasu, Kotoshogiku

Takayasu - Tamawashi, Yoshikaze

Mitakeumi - Kotoshogiku

Yoshikaze - Kotoshogiku

One sanyaku match for next 3 days, then 2 for 5 days, then 3 the last day.  Soroibumi will require the Ozeki not meet each other the last day, as Tamwashi has faced everyone below him in rank in sanyaku. (edit: And Goeido thus must face Kotoshogiku, with Takayasu against Tamawashi (or less likely, Yoshikaze)

Edited by Gurowake

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18 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

I'm counting 16.

Yeah, you're right. I can't count. 16 it is.

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If there was any doubt, Ura's definitely going to be facing the top guys now (what's left of them)

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11 minutes ago, Fukurou said:

If there was any doubt, Ura's definitely going to be facing the top guys now (what's left of them)

Well, Kotoshogiku already faced the 3 sanyaku who withdrew, so he's not going to be forced any lower than normal.  Of course, as the lowest ranked sanyaku, he's least likely to face exactly those in the top 16 anyway, so it matters little as to his chance of facing Ura.  

The Y/O are all forced equally down to Chiyoshoma, as there are no intra-heya exclusions left on the board and none of them faced each other yet.  Though again, with how far down and how late the maegashira matches will be, I'd expect some of them to potentially be skipped, although no one in line is doing absolutely atrocious.

Edited by Gurowake

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With Terunofuji's withdrawal we're back to the kadoban carousel next  basho

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5 hours ago, Sakura said:

With Terunofuji's withdrawal we're back to the kadoban carousel next  basho

Roll up, roll up! All aboard the Ozeki ghost train!

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Ura finally took one against Takakeisho. And advances to 5-1. Man, he is having a great Basho. Only 3 more wins for his kachi-koshi. Tomorrow? Mitakeumi! If people ahead of him in Banzuke keep faltering he could be Komusubi next basho. If Ura makes it to Sanyaku in his first year at Makuuchi it would be delicious as hell.

Onosho also has a 5-1 start, only losing to Ura. Tomorrow he will face Kagayaki and destroy him. My condolences to any Kagayaki fans out there. 

Aoiyama is having his best first week ever on the highest division. Could Aoiyama get the fabled double-digit kachi-koshi? His last one is from 2014. Tomorrow is Ichinojo which may be a problem considering Aoiyama doesn't deal well with heavy opponents. But then again, it is Ichinojo.

Shin-Ozeki Takayasu is also 5-1. And his loss to Hokutofuji looks like a fluke. Man, he is powerful, Shodai shouldn't show up tomorrow. He will lose.

Hakuho is well, Hakuho? Greatest of all time, when will he be given a special title crowning him as God of Sumo? Even if we go back and look at other very dominant Yokozuna, Hakuho just makes them look a league below. Heck, Harumafuji is one of the best wrestlers ever but...well...Hakuho is Hakuho. He makes others look unimpressive, even if they're being amazingly impressive.

What I really wish for is that Hakuho makes the most smuggest and most audacious retirement speech full of self-praise when he retires, and tell and dare for the next generation to surpass his legacy.

Edited by Jyuunomori
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That was Ozeki sumo from Takayasu today. He was in real trouble and just hung in there until he could turn it around. Totally proving he deserves the rank.

And is Kotoyuki carrying an injury, or is it just that the others have all worked out how to deal with his relatively one dimensional sumo?

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Hakuho is in the zone, barring a fluke, zensho yusho. Takayasu looking comfortable and patient. Nice to see Aoyama doing well, good footwork for such a big guy. Wish my boy Kagayaki develop a mawashi game. If the thrusting is not working, need a plan B. Like boxers who punch themselves out, go in for a clinch. 

Edited by Philioyamfugi

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44 minutes ago, Jyuunomori said:

What I really wish for is that Hakuho makes the most smuggest and most audacious retirement speech full of self-praise when he retires

Even if it is in Hakuho's character to be smug, it doesn't become a Yokozuna to be smug and full of self-paise. He doesn't need it. There are only a few more records to break and he has already established himself as the greatest of all time in so many ways. His bout against Takakeisho spoke better than any words!

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2 hours ago, Jyuunomori said:

Heck, Harumafuji is one of the best wrestlers ever but...

HMF is very good, but that is a bit of a stretch...

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I was amazed to read today that despite all his history of injury problems this is only Terunofuji's second career withdrawal. He really is the type that likes to fight to the end of a tournament no matter how bad his condition. Whether that will have an ultimate effect on the length of his overall career only time will tell, but not to sit out a tournament having just had surgey seems crazy to me.

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10 minutes ago, ryafuji said:

 but not to sit out a tournament having just had surgey seems crazy to me.

"utterly" I'd like to add!

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Terunofuji's problem is that he keeps fighting injured. He needs to take a whole basho off when he's not kadoban so that he can come back somewhat in better condition. But because he keeps going on and off, he keeps having the injury issues.

Ura finally pulls off a win against his rival Takakeisho and improves to 5-1, and putting himself in a very good position to possibly clinch promotion to the sanyaku if he can manage KK and has some banzuke luck around him.

Takayasu keeping steady and could possibly be the only challenge to Hakuho's path to the yusho if Harumafuji should falter.

Aoiyama improved to 6-0, and seems to be calm and balanced so far in the basho.

Mitakeumi, dominant against Yoshikaze today, definitely looking to be a mainstay in the sanyaku/joi.

Down below, Takekaze improves to 4-2 as the most senior rikishi in makuuchi is trying to stay in the top division.

Aminishiki 4-2 after today and moving slowly but surely towards trying to clinch that promotion back to makuuchi, trying to get that oldest promotion record into the books.

Asanoyama looking to become the second sandanme tsukedashi to make it to makuuchi after maintaining course at 6-0 today in juryo.

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I never learn my lesson: don't make predictions until the last five days of a tournament, and even then there are no sure bets.  But with three elite wrestlers kyujo and both Harumafuji and Goeido struggling, it looks to me that this tournament is going to end up being between Hakuho and Takayasu (no disrespect to Aoiyama).  The spoiler to that race will definitely be Ura.  I can't wait to see Ura go up against Hakuho and Takayasu, or them go up against him.  Talk about a wild card.

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Seems to me Harumafuji is getting back on stride, and should contend with Hakuho and Takayasu as the most likely yusho winners at this point. Hakuho, 21 straight and counting. I think the old man has this one last shot at taking out that 69 straight record, a record he once said he would break.

Terumofuji, I also agree, should have taken note from Hakuho last year and sat out the entire basho, allowing himself to heal. I suppose that's obvious to everyone at this point.

And, I'm with several of you in looking forward to a few Ura vs. ozeki/yokozun bouts. I'd hoped it would be this basho, and looks like it's possible now. Getting those last 3 wins for the kachikoshi may be non-trivial, but he has folks pulling for him.

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Some great sumo today. I particularly enjoyed Shohozan the escapologist, Chiyoshoma the tenacious and Takayasu the patient. Nice first wins for Mitakeumi and Ura too, though I take the latter as an indication that Takakeisho has temporarily lost his mojo. The way he's going I can see Ura causing at least one upset among the sanyaku and above.

It's been obvious for about 18 months that Terunofuji ought to take time off to heal - to everyone bar Terunofuji it seems. Anyone else noticed that his poxy chest has cleared up, btw?

Hakuho looks to be back in command of just about his full repertoire, which makes him almost unbeatable. Could well be another zensho coming up, but to beat Futabayama's record he'd have to win another 49 straight... That would be 4 zensho on the trot then at least 10 straight in the 5th basho. It's not going to happen, though I'd love to be proved wrong!

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24 minutes ago, RabidJohn said:

It's been obvious for about 18 months that Terunofuji ought to take time off to heal - to everyone bar Terunofuji it seems.

Are we just going to ignore that he went 25-5 before the current tournament? I think it's quite possible that getting back to optimal condition is simply not in the cards, even with long-term recuperation, and (like stablemate Aminishiki) he'll have to just live with the inevitable ups and downs brought on by knees that are no longer all that suited to the task of doing sumo.

Edited by Asashosakari
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7 hours ago, Morty said:

And is Kotoyuki carrying an injury, or is it just that the others have all worked out how to deal with his relatively one dimensional sumo?

First i wanted to say "marriage", but his downward-spiral began a few weeks before that.

I said it before, but it can't be said often enough, with good knees Tochinoshin could easily be ozeki. Superb bout by both!

Ura vs. the big ones will be fun to watch, i bet they already make plans how to sink the submarine. Watching the bout vs. Tochinoshin over and over again in amazement...i thought Tochinoshin would just bulldoze him of the dohyo, but he had absolutely no chance. Tomorrow he will lose, but a little piece of Goeido or Harumafuji...why not?

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The Great White Phoenix
Soars above the Blue Mountain;
Hakuho zensho.

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As much as many of us hated Terunofuji for the 'henka heard around the world', he was on a good run and sorry he is out.

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1 hour ago, Asashosakari said:

Are we just going to ignore that he went 25-5 before the current tournament? I think it's quite possible that getting back to optimal condition is simply not in the cards, even with long-term recuperation, and (like stablemate Aminishiki) he'll have to just live with the inevitable ups and downs brought on by knees that are no longer all that suited to the task of doing sumo.

If it's true that he got surgery just after the last basho, then yes, his doctors would probably have preferred he didn't compete this basho.  his career likely would have preferred it too...

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2 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

Are we just going to ignore that he went 25-5 before the current tournament? I think it's quite possible that getting back to optimal condition is simply not in the cards, even with long-term recuperation, and (like stablemate Aminishiki) he'll have to just live with the inevitable ups and downs brought on by knees that are no longer all that suited to the task of doing sumo.

And he was hurting himself doing it. We'll never know now, but I'm of the opinion that if he'd taken 6 months off to properly deal with and recuperate from his original injury, he'd be back to ozeki from juryo or makushita and possibly even a yokozuna by now. As it is, all he's done is aggravate it for the best part of two years, so you are right, he'll probably never get back to a physique that can fulfill his potential. I'm just glad he decided not to go for another 2-13...

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